Without a witness, its your word against his as nothing is written down.
IMHO, best to put it down to experience and learn from it, as there really is no way forward.
Looking through your comments, I`m sure you can see the mistakes in basically *trusting* rather than *checking* being late for pick up, having nothing in writing and no witness.
Don`t beat yourself up over it as thats even more harm done to you from the situation.
I bet there are few people that have not been stitched up in someway by elements of the motortrade at some point in their lives, I know i have.
Last time I bought a used car I had a micro tape recorder running in my pocket, as well as getting it in writing :)
At least, as you say, its a car you "really like" and you should find 2 new tyres for less than £100.
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Thanks for the quick responces. the car came with the normal 3 month warrenty but also a 12 month paid for one with a warrenty company which i think will be invalid if i dont get the car serviced as it states in the book that the car has to be regularly serviced and as the dealer refuses to tell me who serviced the vehicle i cant prove that it has been.
i have seen on a couple of websites that as i took out HP i need to claim through the HP company but i will call trading standards when on monday for there advice ( im sure they will have a tempate of a letter or something)
i definatley want to take it further i will see what traiding standards say on monday
i think next time i will take a tape recorder lol
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Good luck Harry, You have to have some proof though for it to go anywhere. Your own statement of what was agreed will not be enough if the car dealer denies it all.
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You were late, he has a life as well as a business.
I'd get the tyres fitted and go back with the receipt and ask for a contribution towards the cost (don't delay). At least you can chose the tyres you prefer rather than the cheapest his supplier could offer.
Enjoy your car ;o)
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i don't think you're being unreasonable at all.........you want something done properly...in the manner of which you discussed with the seller
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Thanks for all your replys
What you think about refusing to tell me who serviced the car? if he had nothing to hide surely he wouldnt mind me getting the book stamped because the way i see it the warrenty i bought with the car is now invalid as it clearly stated in the book that regular servicing is required and the last service in the book is a year ago.
and if i wanted to sell the car in the future there would be a massive gap in the service book of 2 years if i waited until when the dealer claims the next service is due.
i dont trust the guy he lied over the tyres so how do i know if it has been serviced?
i know it will be harder to prove what was said about the tyres but he is still stating the service has been done so if he refuses to tell me by who i think i will have a case for getting a service done.
Would i have to give the garage a chance to do the service because i wouldnt trust that it would be done properly
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Why not ask the dealer to stamp the service book with his own stamp?
That way you will have a complete service book, albeit not containing all main dealer stamps.
I told my niece to ensure this was done when she purchased a used car lat year which we knew was going to be serviced before she picked it up. The dealer was quite happy to stamp the service book when she asked him.
With regards to the tyres I guess the thing to do is measure the amount of tread left with a depth gauge. Anything above 3mm is probably acceptable on a used car, though I do agree with you that if the dealer told you at the time of sale that two tyres would be replaced then that should be done regardless.
We can all be wise after the event but anything like this needs to be written onto the receipt at the time of purchase so that there is a written record of it.
I wish you good luck and hope you are able to obtain some degree of satisfaction via the routes that others and myself have suggested.
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Thanks Galaxy,
The dealer is just a car sales business no garage as such the service was suposedly done by another garage and it wasnt the one where the MOT was done which makes me even more suspicious
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lets face it.........he hasn't done the service has he. That's what your instincts are telling you. Save it up your sleeve, but how about the local press?
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Sorry haryhairdo, our posts crossed over!
If you're unsure whether the service was actually carried out have a look at the oil on the dipstick to see whether it's relatively clean (unless it's a diesel car) and try to see whether the oil filter casing looks new. This is no absolute guide, however, since all that may have been done is a change of oil and filter and nothing else.
I guess that the only safe and sure way is, as you have suggested, have the car serviced by someone else and get them to stamp the book.
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Is there a possibility that the car has been serviced in the past within the dealer network? If so, it might be worth giving a local dealer a ring to see what they have on record for the car.
For what it's worth, I was lied to by a salesman about 12 years ago when buying a three year old car from him. 'Service records lost but car has full service history. It hadn't. I had it serviced thereafter according to the schedule and never had a problem with it. Hopefully, neither will you.
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I once had a good result from just threatening to use the local press over a used car warranty.
But in Harrys particular circumstances ( IMHO) without *evidence* of what was agreed, the used car dealer could really turn the tables on him if the newspaper damaged his image or trade in some way.
Perhaps Harry could go back and discuss the whole matter ( in a reasonable way) again with the used car dealer, taking someone with him this time as a witness.
At least then it may be possible to still get some actual evidence of what was agreed.
(I`m still thinking of that mini tape recorder in a pocket:)
Get some evidence and then the case is much stronger in getting an expert opinion ( In writing) on whether it was serviced or not.
I see trading standards/HP company, then having more than hearsay on which to base action against the dealer.
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I hate saying this as I am sure you have enough on your plate already, But IMHO, if you can't trust him on one aspect, then you can't trust him at all. And that would go for the car's history, mileage etc.
If I were you, and you like the car, I would try and find out quickly about all these issues, make sure the car is sound and then have no more dealings with him. Otherwise it will take the enjoyment of the car away.
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Personally after dealt with in such an offhand manner and actually told me I was lying I couldnt let the matter rest no matter what it cost to gain satisfaction.
Why should you put it down to experience and forget about it.
He would have n genuine reason not to tell you who had serviced the car so it has obviously not been done.
Have you any legal cover via the AA or bank for such matters. If not trading standards and your HP company as your first step, and if you paid by CC ask them.
As regards feeling better by forgetting all about it would be exactly the opposite if it happened to myself.
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wemyss
I agree entirely.If you let these people get away with such practise,they regard it as a blueprint for future trading.
They need to be made to realise that they can't treat customers like this.
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Hi
Thanks for all your comments
the car is a diesel so checking the oil unfortunatly wont tell me anything!
the car has been services regulary all the stamps in the book up until 1 year ago so its due its yearly service and i have the last mot so i am confident the car is genuine mileage but i definatly dont trust the dealer anymore. i will talk to trading standared tomorrow oilrag and see what they say regarding taped evidence and getting a witness.
wemyss
i think the initial process is to go through the HP company however the deposit (1k) was put down on a credit card so that is another avenue!
i will update you all with the outcome
Harry
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Life's too short. Change the oil and the filter now so that there can be no longer term damage. Unless it's a PD engined VAG car, you can do this yourself for under £20.
As you like the car, enjoy driving it with its new oil.
A few months later, when it needs the tyres, go out and buy them - it won't seem so bad by then.
Your story is typical of the motor trade - any agreement not in writing is invalid and won't happen. As to the header subject, I think that you are being unreasonable but not for the more obvious reasons. My view is that your long term health is likely to be affected by any ensuing dispute and it just isn't worth whatever an oil change and 2 tyres will cost you. Always think of the bigger picture.
659.
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Completely agree with 659, life's too short to get too worked up about this. Harry, why not get yourself a full service at a Fast Service or indie, get the book stamped by them and fit yourself two nice tyres of your choice- the supplying dealer would probably have fitted el cheapos anyway, which may not have been to your liking. Or if you prefer, do the work yourself and keep all the receipts as evidence of servicing. By the time you sell, I don't think that will be an issue. Then just enjoy the car, and don't take your custom back there again.
Baz
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I agree with Bazza and 659, get it serviced properly and get 2 decent new tyres. I don't think the lack of a service stamp will make much difference to the value of a 5 year old car.
I remember when looking at a second hand car, the salesman told me he had been to London in it yesterday. I asked him why the brake discs were rusty? he told me I was a TW and to go away. (He didn't put it like that)
I think that many used car salesmen will tell you anything to sell the car, I would rather they knocked a bit off the price so that you can service the car yourself. If they do it they will use the cheapest parts, or just wipe it over with a rag. When I bought my son's first car the salesman said the car would have a full service, when we got it the pads were down to metal. I got it serviced for him and never went back to that dealer again.
It's not worth upsetting yourself to try and get back at the dealer, you will get more upset than he will, he will have heard it all before. Just tell everyone of your experience and never go back.
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Further to quizman's post, part of the problem is that people think 'full service' means something when actually it doesn't mean anything at all. The main dealer/new car thing covers, if you look at the books, several levels of 'service' depending on mileage. These days of course it's even more complicated with cars supposedly aware of when they need this or that done to them.
A proper garage - a good VW independent for example because I know one of them - will talk about a 'small service' or a big one, and in their case they will list what is done. But it always worries me when I hear innocent impoverished ladies talking about getting their car 'serviced' by the man round the corner. They may get an honest job for reasonable money and they may not. There's no way of telling because they think 'service' covers everything necessary, when in fact it may not cover anything at all. Trouble is with any car, not just a secondhand one, it is a good idea to know what needs to be done and list each job by name. There aren't all that many standard consumeables after all. It isn't rocket science. But some people are so earnest about not wanting to know that they let themselves in for all sorts of carp by allowing this holdall, or hold-nothing, word to be used.
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Firstly not all traders in the car business are like the 1 you experienced.
Do contact tradignstandards, they may be able to exert more pressure if he has a history of this style of trading. Do contact cc company and finance company. They will have more pressure than you can muster.
I think his type of service would be just oil and filter; unless it was agreed in detail? In which case consider mileage condition type of vehicle and arrange a service if you feel it would be more beneficial. Do not forget to consider a timing belt! I doubt if he would have touched that by the sound of him! A decent place would have mentioned it and agreed something for both sides piece of mind?
Too late for backing out of the deal but let others learn from this. Bad publicity is difficult to overcome so make sure people you know dont use him !
OR... if you know someone who is potentially buying a car? go with them to this site and find a car he likes. make sure the salesman knows of the interest and then discuss yopur car and say you wont let friend buy car from him until the little details on yours are sorted! If your car then gets sorted your friend could suddenly lose interest in the car he was looking at? Naughty maybe but no worse than he was !
Good luck whatever
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It's a shame you accepted the car as it was, as to be honest you had good grounds for backing out of the deal or insisting these were done until you collected the car.
In the future, when placing a deposit on a car get them to give you a receipt with "Includes full service history & 2 new tyres" or words to that effect and then there is no room for confusion.
I'd stand your ground on this one and insist these issues are sorted you say you will reject the car. Contrary to public opinion, very few car dealers behave like this unless they are a pile 'em high sell 'em cheap outfit so big they don't need to care about individual customers - most want you to come back again.
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This deal has definitely been soured by all accounts so you've got nothing to lose in pursuing what you were promised.
The main problem I see is with your aftermarket warranty (although I have to say I personally question whether these things are worth anything). If it is similar to the one I have seen, for it to be valid your car needs to serviced in accordance with the manufacturer's schedule. Furthermore in the event of a claim, the warranty company will request your service book and/or receipts to prove this has been done. As it was this "dealer" who presumably sold you the warranty explain that his refusal to get the book stamped up or provide a detailed invoice is going to invalidate the warranty from the outset and what is the point of that. Get his response and if it is not to your liking inform Trading Standards.
As for the tyres measure the tread depth yourself to gauge (!) when you're going to need a set yourself.
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