quiet night in - bell boy
Been watching television all night heard a noise outside 2 cars had pulled up and there were 6 men in t 2 cars 2 got out and used my house as a toilet i shouted for them to move and when they finished they went one of them using the wifes car to prop his lager on as they went,i have done a vehicle check via the dvla website on one of the vehicles and the tax ran out in january.
I have rung the local police to register my complaint and the switchboard i spoke to in my town advised me that although it is anti social behaviour there was nothing i could do and nothing they could do ,i asked if i could report it at the police station tomorrow morning and their words not mine was "dont bother" your wasting your time.
My question is if you drive round on a night drinking and being antisocial its alright so long as you dont knock anybody down?
quiet night in - Civic8
Regardless of what you was told over the phone,I would report it,the more the public complain about this the better.It may help in getting more police in the community rather than getting less, as appears to be the case in certain areas

To answer you,its not alright and needs to be stamped on rather swiftly,IMO
quiet night in - Zippy123
IMHO the police do not care for minor crimes.

Wifes Touran was keyed in a multistory car park earlier this year. The police have not even asked for the CCTV!

Thing is minor crimes sometimes lead to bigger crimes.

Get the culprits early and you may save them and the community in the longer run.
quiet night in - Civic8
>>IMHO the police do not care for minor crimes.

Might have to if enough complaints made,instead of saying ok and letting it go. Far too many let this go and should complain,again IMO,but think this has gone beyond a joke and should be sorted ASAP
quiet night in - rip
My mirrors have been 'smashed' four times in the space of a year, and this in a very quiet area, every time it has been a Friday night/ Saturday morning when they?ve been vandalised. Also my windscreen was hit with some sort of tool (so was my neighbours) and thus required changing..... mind you it did have a few wiper type scratches and so needed changing anyhow. I believe its drunkards taking a short cut through my road

I should have informed the police, i know they will do jack. But it will be on the crime figures. also send letter to your MP and email to local paper- the more publicity the better.

Btw i now fold my mirrors in
quiet night in - Screwloose

One effective way of ensuring lots of police attention. Pump-action 12-bore loaded with rock-salt cartridges........ Then; small grey room....no shoelaces.....
quiet night in - Another John H
While agreeing with all of the above.. has anyone else noticed how rare a useable public toilet is these days?

My local town Council has recently locked them _all_ shut in an attempt to save UKP210,000

Where do you go?

I certainly don't go to the town anymore as diuretic tablets make it a no go area for me.
quiet night in - Mattster
McDonalds, KFC, large pubs like Wetherspoons where you can pretend you're looking for someone, Debenhams cafe, etc. One of those things - it costs to go to the loo (premises, cleaning, etc.) but no-one is willing to pay for it.

On the police, they have a finite resource. To solve a key-scratching crime, they'd have to take resource away from a burglary. Which would you prefer?
Boycott shoddy build and reliability.
quiet night in - Manatee
Mattster: >>On the police, they have a finite resource. To solve a key-scratching crime, they'd have to take resource away from a burglary. Which would you prefer?

Fair enough. But if we have laws against car-scratching, mirror smashing, or micturating on someone's house, there needs to be some alternative to the immediate dispatch of a police car.

Perhaps if they were at least willing to record the incident they at least have an objective record of where problems are and perhaps data that would identify serial offenders.

OM could have his house peed on every night for a week and as far as the police are concerned there would be no problem because they haven't recorded anything.

If there was recording, then the police could at least consider following up on a percentage of repeat occurrences - at the moment they can't even do that.

Having once reported a crime and spent 2 hours in a police station while a PC typed with 2 fingers I can see why it is impractical to do anything if this system hasn't changed; maybe a system of self-reporting via the internet could be introduced? A registration process would reduce abuse. I suppose we would have to spend £42bn to provide the computer system...
quiet night in - Manatee
I see from Ashok's post I am behind developments! I can't agree with the suggestion to exaggerate the incident though - all that does is prevent proper prioitisation by the police.
quiet night in - Armitage Shanks {p}
"On the police, they have a finite resource. To solve a key-scratching crime, they'd have to take resource away from a burglary. Which would you prefer?"

Resources + police + burglary! What planet or county are you living in? My partner had £5k+ worth of stuff taken from her garage, oily handprints as evidence all over the garage door. No police attendance until 48 hours later, and after a letter to the local headman, when a Crime Reduction Officer turned up, at 11am "On his way to the office" and gave her a crime number. Oh and she got a very kind and concerned letter from Victim Support which started "Dear Victim".

We need a lot less tolerance of what is ludicrously called low level crime, less paperwork and a much more visible police presence on the streets
quiet night in - wotspur
Lagre pubs like Weatherspoons, where you can pretend you are looking for someone.

Don't bother, I always say, so this is a public house, I am a member of the public and you've no right to prevent me using the toilets, I've never been challenged further nor prevented from using them
quiet night in - Hamsafar
If you say that they did it because of your perceived sexuality, then they will put a special team of hate-crime detectives onto the job. Also... report it online, I always do this now, and use the word "hate" in your description of events, you'll see why....

quiet night in - local yokel
Report it, and then compose a reasonable, but pointed letter to the Chief Constable, cc'd to your MP, that describes your frustration and annoyance at the implication that the police see this as acceptable behaviour. Your MP will have regular meetimgs with the local Area Superintendant (mine does) and the MP will just love the ammunition you give them in the letter.
quiet night in - Stuartli
The police won't bother with minor crimes - as they are virtually unable to solve them unless the culprits are caught in the act, they go down as unsolved and that doesn't go down well with New Labour's spin that crime figures are dropping.

My own current pet hate is the fact that so many people now use mobile phones whilst driving with such impunity as they know they are unlikely to be caught redhanded.

If you bothered to report it, the police only state that they have to witness such mobile phone use before being able to take any action.

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
What\'s for you won\'t pass you by
quiet night in - oldgit
I live on a busy 'B' road and have a bus stop outside my house! This, at certain times of the day and certain days of the week attract all sorts of undesirables who may have come from the local clubs or sports ground and who have many assorted drinks and food in their hands.

Whilst waiting for the buses to arrive, all types of shenanigans takes place and I'm very reluctanct to interfere on any occasion as I'm afraid of what might happen to my car parked on the driveway if those people should decide to take offence at any action taken by myself or the police - I therefore suffer in silence!
quiet night in - c h a r l e s

Time to bring in politics and blame Blair.

We used to have a police force, it is now called a police service, much to the disdain of a few coppers I know.

Recently in Hertfordshire I think there was a case where the police could not pursue a motorcyclist comitting various traffic offences whilst not wearing a helmet. The patrol was told not to pursue him in case he came off and subsequently the police would get sued for contributing to his injuries...

The police have a tough job to do, made all the more difficult by meeting targets set by politicians.
quiet night in - Zippy123
Time to bring in politics and blame Blair - HA HA HA!

The police have been in serious decline since the 80's imho. My car was hit and run when parked outside my girl friends house at the time.

There were witnesses and reg numbers. Nothing was ever done - save that I got a seven day producer and a rollocking for not displaying a tax disk - the front window had been popped out and the disk was on the glass on the road!

quiet night in - nortones2
The police may have been in serious decline, but you don't actually think that central government has caused their apparent decline or has direct management control of them do you? If the police are in decline, despite additional staffing and funding, its probably due to a combination of the enormous and growing pressures on them from an intemperate and fragmented society, together with the feebleness of their management. The police are linked to (I'll not say run by!) local authorities, and central control is diffuse, except for the provison of funds. The employers of the police are not central Govt. but outdated LA's. If you have had anything to do with LA's you tend to the suicidal, if you actually want competent management (my personal opinion). Probably ACPO is the most persuasive of the influences, along with the Federation for the rank and file.
quiet night in - Armitage Shanks {p}
Tut Tut Charles. Very non PC! The police service don't have targets - they have performance indicators. Go and wash your mouth out!
quiet night in - barney100
Mayor Guilliani of New York had his zero tolerance policy,even the most minor crimes were sorted. Result? New York experienced a huge drop in major crimes over a period of time. It seemd that if you start at the bottom then it soon filters up. They have police everywhere and it is quite reassuring. Here in my part of downtown Basingstoke I have only ever seen the odd police car drive by and have seen a beat bobby perhaps twice in 16 years. I don't blame the actual boys in blue but put it down to lack of numbers.
quiet night in - madf
part of a VERY long DT article..

"Rather less known is the experience of New York City. Over the past 15 years, New York has come to be seen as a model for tackling crime, thanks to the success of "zero tolerance" policing, which encourages a tough response to minor misdemeanours that might previously have been overlooked. It is now clear that people who break little rules tend to be the ones who go on to break the big ones, and that by arresting a vandal for breaking a window you can stop him developing into a serious criminal."


It is clear that the Home Office/Home Secretary and Police do not want to reduce actual srime (as opposed to reported crime ) as there is further detail on the NY experience:
take mentally ill patients out of prsiosn and put in suitable treatment
put drug abusers who commit srime to feed their habit into rehab to solve the basic cuase.

No doubt Dr Reid may do something which may produce real results as opposed to uniforms for the IND but so far no sign.

What is clear - from Dr Reid's actions and words- that the past three Home Secretarise have wasted 9 years- Straw Blunkett and Clarke - going the wrong way..

Never mind. We voted them in:-((( Or rather the Scots did.

quiet night in - Hamsafar
Tolerance, diversity and respect are New Labour's watchwords, I doubt we will have a "Zero Tolerance Policy" any time soon!
quiet night in - Martin Devon
quiet night in - Martin Devon
Maybe, just maybe a little too sensitive at times. I understand the need for moderation, but was that really that bad? Everybody bar none that I speak to in business takes the same line.........yes really.

quiet night in - Pugugly {P}
Remember ZT didn't exactly cover itself in glory in Cleveland, Don't think the UK is ready for it really. There needs to be major changes to the CJS beyond the Police, some of the changes proposed by Mr Ried (note - Mr) appear to go some way to addressing this, what makes it beyond the spin and froth is debatable. My local Constbulary have taken to issuing Fixed Penalties for some disorder and crime (including shoplifitng) the crimbos are already finding ways around these (I won't mention them here) - it's not for the want of trying. Listen to Analasys on R4 now......
quiet night in - bell boy
ive reported the car online to the dvla for its 6 months out of date road tax as posted on their checking site.
i havnt been to the police station (really dont see the point if they are going to refuse to log it without me being insistant and seing a senior member and getting labelled as a troublecauser) but will get in touch with my local councillor for our next police "local forum" meet.
Thanks for the posts at least my feelings are not only mine on this subject .

oh and i felt a lot better for posting it last night and i now know why if i ever applied for a shotgun licence my application would not be accepted ,but good thought screwloose.........
quiet night in - Dalglish
oldman -

take a look at www.homeoffice.gov.uk/rds/pdfs06/countrecstan06.pdf

National Crime Recording Standard (1 of 6)
? To promote greater consistency between police forces in the recording of crime.
? To take a more victim oriented approach to crime recording.
The standard accords with three basic principles:
2.1 All reports of incidents, whether from victims, witnesses or third parties and whether crime related or not, will result in the registration of an incident report by the police.
..... ....
2.4 It is important that the Standard supports a victim focused approach to crime recording where the
public?s call for service is met, as opposed to a proactive one where the police are required to trawl for
potential crimes.
3.1 The reasons for registering all incidents include the need to ensure forces have all available information in relation to possible crimes in their area and to allow an audit trail to be created, to ensure consistency of crime recording between forces. Where a report is recorded as a crime initially (eg telephone report direct to Crime Management Unit), it is not necessary that an incident report is also created. However, where the report is not initially recorded as a crime, an auditable incident report should be registered (whether on the Force Incident System or some other accessible and auditable means).
3.2 When examining a report of a crime related incident, the test to be applied in respect of recording a
crime is that of the balance of probabilities: that is to say is the incident more likely than not the result of
a criminal act? In most cases, a belief by the victim (or person reasonably assumed to be acting on
behalf of the victim) that a crime has occurred is sufficient to justify its recording as a crime, although this will not be the case in all circumstances. Effectively, a more victim oriented approach is advocated.

also today's papers report this:
Children arrested, DNA tested, interrogated and locked up... for playing in a tree
19:57pm 23rd July 2006
To the 12-year-old friends planning to build themselves a den, the cherry tree seemed an inviting source of material.
But the afternoon adventure turned into a frightening ordeal for Sam Cannon, Amy Higgins and Katy Smith after they climbed into the 20ft tree - then found themselves hauled into a police station and locked in cells for up to two hours.
Their shoes were removed and mugshots, DNA samples and mouth swabs were taken.
Officers told the children they had been seen damaging the tree which is in a wooded area of public land near their homes. ....

so you have some hope of being taken seriously.

remember, as no-fm2r and pugugly say: "you get the police force you deserve".

quiet night in - Pugugly {P}
Daily Mail
quiet night in - bignick
I suggest you report them for indecent exposure. I have a strange feeling that the local plod will regard this as a sufficiently serious offence to abandon their lucrative speed traps for long enough to make some enquiries.
quiet night in - NARU
Someone hit my wife's legally parked car and drove off. We got the registration no. from witnesses (who were prepared to sign witness statements). Police response: nil.
quiet night in - DP
Police attitude / response varies massively depending on where you live.

We moved recently from Uxbridge, Middlesex where we had one car stolen, another vandalised three times, and various incidents of chavs and chavettes hanging around in gangs throwing stuff at windows and generally intimidating people. The only time I ever recall seeing them respond to anything was when a malnourished looking 13 year old kid crashed a crowbarred steering locked Kawasaki ZXR400 into a wall opposite where they waited with the bike until it was recovered, and even managed to arrest the little ray of sunshine. Otherwise, the police couldn't have cared less, and beyond giving us crime reference numbers, were completely and utterly useless.

We moved to a small town in Hampshire where, in the year and a half we have been there, there has been one incident. Someone decided to walk down the street one night and steal every single aerial off the parked cars.

The police turned up the next day and went door to door asking for witnesses. A neighbour's son had seen the offenders and recognised one of them. Within a few hours they had arrested the guy that did it and recovered the aerials. They then went back door to door to get people to identify which was theirs.

Never heard any more about it after that, but I couldn't believe that such a small incident was taken so seriously.

quiet night in - Waino
Never heard any more about it after that, but I couldn't
believe that such a small incident was taken so seriously.

How long is it going to take our politicians and police to realise that if smaller crimes are firmly dealt with, there will be a knock on effect through to serious crime? It's a bit like the adage 'if you take care of the pennies, the pounds will take care of themselves'.

quiet night in - DP
Don't misunderstand me, I think it was a good thing, but after years of complete police apathy to anything short of murder, it was a bit of a shock.
quiet night in - madf
"How long is it going to take our politicians and police to realise that if smaller crimes are firmly dealt with, there will be a knock on effect through to serious crime? It's a bit like the adage 'if you take care of the pennies, the pounds will take care of themselves'."

We are a police sate. The police do what Central government want.

We have no say in police policy. Full stop.

So blame all your police woes on the Home Secretary. Only He has the power to change things. And of course the prior 3 incombants were: incompetent. At everything they did...Mr John Reid says so. It must be true:-)
quiet night in - Martin Devon
Police attitude / response varies massively depending on where you live.
We moved recently from Uxbridge, Middlesex where we had one car
stolen, another vandalised three times.

We left Uxbridge, our home town, (Hillingdon), in 1987 and escaped to Devon cos of the dross. Couldn't have done a better thing. Rush hour can be a pain though, but hell, the Pheasants have to walk somewhere!

quiet night in - Pugugly {P}
We are a police sate

No we're not, If you were in a Police State you wouldn't be posting this without fearing a knock on the door. Read "Defying Hitler" by Sebastian Haffner. That will explaint to you in some detail what a Police State is all about.
quiet night in - Lud
Hear hear PU. A lot of loose polemic to that effect, silly and destructive.
quiet night in - Westpig
The sad thing is, the police have too many conflicting demands of them to achieve everything, so something has to drop....so it's your garden shed 'break in' or damage to your car (or even the peeing into your garden).

Nowadays, compared to even 10 years ago, there are things like the folllowing considered priorities: homophobic crime, race hate crime, domestic violence, child abuse to name a few. I pass no commment on their suitability as a priority, because you can easily argue each and every one of them, it's just the fact they never used to be.

Furthermore when you consider how advanced some frauds have now become and internet/computer crime then there's a lot more to consider.

As an example govt guidelines state that police forces should be 'intelligence led' conforming to a national model, this means that instead of 2 pc's in an office fulfilling that role, there are now 15 or more. The intent is more than laudable, but if you end up with drastically less officers available to work the streets and those that are, are young and inexperienced, then the object is somewhat defeated.... and this sort of thing is relevant to many other areas.

Direct govt interference , via the Home Office doesn't help, with all sorts of priorities and work returns imposed.

Lastly and as an aside,compare the policing numbers between New York - approx 45,000 and London - approx 33,000, when they are comparable cities. I make it about 24% less. Is it any wonder there's a big void and certain 'low level' crime is ignored.

quiet night in - Lounge Lizard
It isn't true to say that crime level is inversely proportional to police numbers.

As a westerner, you can walk through many third-world countries and not experience any crime: despite the fact that you are likely to be carrying enough dollars to feed a family for a year.
Yet rarely do you see a policeman in these areas, maybe the odd army checkpoint on the outskirts of town. Many of the people (who do not mug you) are very poor indeed, and are homeless apart from their taxi-tricycle thing parked up on the side of the road.

I am not against increasing police numbers, but there are other more effective ways of reducing criminality.

quiet night in - Micky
If you're prepared to see it through, write to the duty inspector at your local police station and request a reply within 7 working days. When the reply doesn't arrive, write again and cc to your Chief Constable and MP, they're all public servants paid with your tax money.

If you're not prepared to see it through .. forget it.

Put everything in writing and avoid the civvy switchboard operators at all costs.
quiet night in - Armitage Shanks {p}
We DO live in a police state! There are petty restrictions on all sorts of things (Veg being sold by the lb = illegal, beer sold by the litre = illegal) work that out! What we do not have is the police to enforce the lawful running of any decent sort of state, society or call it what you will!
quiet night in - Westpig
Longe Lizard has a valid point...... however...... in those countries that you can walk through a village with a year's worth of their wages in your pocket, quite safely...... i don't suppose for one minute domestic violence is investigated (or even considered a crime), or homophobia, religious intolerance, traffic offences, child abuse.... what would happen to the person who felt ill one day and the local large employer felt he was slacking and sacked him immediately or gave him a whack, would that get dealt with?.. I think not.

So who has the better system?

There are obviously enormous cultural and in depth social differences between this country and the one(s) hypothesised, which has given us considerably more freedom,choice and rights, but allowed criminality to expand with that freedom., due mostly to selfishness, i might add.

No easy answers.

quiet night in - pksknqx
Do we really want a situation where the police take a 'pro-active' role in reducing crime. The experiments in Cleveland with Mallen and his crew show that sometimes giving the police a mandate to do more than just react to crime can be very dangerous indeed.

Maybe an element of devils advocate, but I would rather risk a few people urinating on my hedge and resting their can of lager on my wife's car than live with the agents of the state interfering in peoples lives as they see fit to 'reduce crime'.

We live in a tolerant country, and one that allows a great deal of personal freedom and mobility, perhaps low level crime is an inevitable by-product of such a society.

Don't think any of us would be very happy living in a real police state...
quiet night in - Pugugly {P}

Don't think any of us would be very happy living in a real police state...

I agree 100%. I would walk through my neck of the woods with a year's wages in my pocket quite happily. Despite a recent spate of burglaries (where the Police did nick someone by the way) it is a reasonably law abiding area, the local cop called for a brew and a chinwag last Sunday from what he said it ain't sweetness and light but it isn't Crime Central either.
quiet night in - Dynamic Dave
And now back to motoring discussion please.


Ask Honest John

Value my car