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Get any new Euro IV compliant diesel and the air that comes out is possibly cleaner than the air that goes in. Certainly less polen comes out than goes in,
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Diesel fumes do not affect my Asthma. I live in the country and do not suffer to any great extent. However when i go to Paris( Business trips 3 times a year) i suffer terribly.
Did i suffer from Astma as a child no i deleloped it it Norway one winter in the early nineties, 3 months of breathing cold air at -25 acted as the trigger, and i,ve suffereed ever since.
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Are new diesels really that clean all the time? I've been behind several lately and when ovetaking or just accelerating normally some still puff out black smoke. I suspect that the mapping of the injection system is set to be as clean as possible over whatever cycle is used to test them.
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Without a doubt, and the same goes for petrol engines. Both will be running optimally at the points they are measured. It's a law of quality, start measuring something and it gets better - but only where it is measured. HMG has discovered this in another way with the millions of "targets" that it has set. You learn to meet the target, ot neccesarily to make things better.
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its not the visible smoke that you need to worry about! The particles that get into the lungs are the ultra-fine particles: these are emitted by all vehicles, and by natural processes also. What is still unclear is what effect engine particulates have: silica and asbestos, for example, have given clear cut ill=health and early mortality patterns, but diesel exhaust, even in confined spaces like mines (the only epidemiological tests I know of) has not produced clear cut evidence, SFAIK, despite the press hysteria. Nevertheless, its sensible to reduce the amount of assault on the lungs: its just that DI petrol engines and oil-burning petrol engines might have to be treated, as diesels are going to be.
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Most of these health and environmental scares are simply the work of those who wish to perpetuate the continuation of the industrial revolution. It keeps the prices high, creates new industries, mines scarcer elements such as palladium, wastes energy,best of all, it makes things onsolete through rising running costs, or legislation.
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Nick,
New diesels (the engines themselves) are very clean. Usually when you see black smoke coming from the exhaust it means the driver has his foot slightly harder down than usual. By nature of a diesel's low down torque the engine is relatively relaxed compared to a petrol at cruising speed, typically around 2000-2200rpm as 70mph, resulting in much less gas flow than a petrol running at 3000rpm. Also the diesel has mainly air present in the cylinders, as a result the small amounts of soot produced in combustion by any engine get deposited in the exhaust by the slower gas flow while the petrol is likely to get them as far as the tail pipe. As a result when the gas flow increases under hard acceleration the lightly deposited soot gets blown out.
This is why when you take a diesel for an MOT it is wise to give the car a good hard run. If the car is consistently driven gentle the exhaust is liable to smoke every time slightly harder acceleration (higher revs) are used. It is not unusual to see a diesel come in for an MOT, and register 3k smoke opacity, then take it for a run, leave a cloud smoke, return and a result of 1.2k or so. While working at an Audi dealer last summer we had an A4 TDI come in for a replacement exhaust and an MOT. The MOT was done after the exhaust replacement and the amount of smoke produced by the engine barely registered as there was nothing in the new exhaust to be blown out.
Regards
Chris
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Lol with the polen (sic).
As regards the Euro IV I'd take that with a large pinch of salt,
my Honda Accord is Euro IV but it's also supposed to do 44mpg under urban conditions.
I struggle to get 40mpg out of it on motorway runs so it's definitely using a lot more fuel than the government figures, also moderate to hard acceleration produces something more than air, more like a Routemaster going up Archway hill.
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A good friend and some-time colleague has spent the last 30 years working on Diesel engine combustion for various companies around the world. Much of his work has focussed on reducing particulate emissions - which is something the manufacturers themselves are very concerned about. Particulate emission *is* a problem with Diesels. Basically the tiny particles (sub 10-micron) are breathed into the lungs and tend to stay there. Whether they cause asthma or not is a moot point - its not healthy to have these tiny soot particles lodged in the lungs.
Particulate filters help alleviate the problem.
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budu: I hope you don't think this is an attempt to hijack your thread, but I've just got my first diesel...Aprilia, glad you're around. I've just bought a 2001 A6 tdi which I think is pre facelift: it's got the concert 1 audio rather than concert 2. Two questions. i) is it a Euro IV engine? ii) I understand it will run on what the UK laughingly call Bio Diesel (5%) but that Audi/VW are now twitchy about their engines running on anything more. I think it's hard (impossible?) to get a higher mix in the U.K. Do you have any knowledge of whether this engine will take any higher concentration/pure biodiesel?
Tim{P}
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Can you imagine following a bus emitting so much smoke you literally cannot see through it to whatever is beyond? No? Welcome to Manila.
They say you've smoked 20 gaspers by 10 a.m. even if you don't touch the things.....
The Clean Air Act has been introduced. As has emissions testing. But of course the bus, jeepney and tricycle operators complain it is unfair to make poor people who can't afford it pay for correcting these things. Never mind, our President needs your votes, I'm sure this needn't be a problem..... (let's not mention the corrupt cops and local politicians who run unlicensed buses, wouldn't want to upset them.....)
Ah well, the weather is warm, the beer is cold and the women are beautiful.
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budu: I hope you don't think this is an attempt to hijack your thread, but I've just got my first diesel...Aprilia, glad you're around. I've just bought a 2001 A6 tdi which I think is pre facelift: it's got the concert 1 audio rather than concert 2. Two questions. i) is it a Euro IV engine? ii) I understand it will run on what the UK laughingly call Bio Diesel (5%) but that Audi/VW are now twitchy about their engines running on anything more. I think it's hard (impossible?) to get a higher mix in the U.K. Do you have any knowledge of whether this engine will take any higher concentration/pure biodiesel? Tim{P}
I think these engines were only Euro IV compliant since about early 2003 - but I may be wrong.
You really need to watch it with the bio-Diesel. I have heard from a very reliable source in Germany that the Bosch injection pumps tend to fail prematurely when run on bio-Diesel. I gather that it dissolves the internal rubber seals! Some pumps fail as early as 50k miles. I would get in touch with Audi to see what their current position is on this problem. You really don't want the injection pump to fail - they cost ££££ !!
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Thanks, Aprilia. I will check. Does that caution apply to the 5% stuff, or only to stronger biodiesel?
Tim{P}
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The caution applies to all bio-Diesel - but obvioulsy the higher the content, the sooner the trouble is likely to appear. Try a web search on this - might turn something up?
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Personally, Tim, I have no idea.
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I'm a bit concerned about some misinformation regarding biodiesel. The "reliable source in Germany" is passing on information that is some 10-12 years out of date. Since the introduction of ULSD, all diesel engines destined for the European market have been made with synthetic rubber components for lines, seals etc, as it was found that ULSD can dissolve natural rubber. Coincidentally, the same is true for biodiesel. The synthetic material is equally impervious to ULSD and biodiesel. This means that no modern diesel engine will experience corrosion of the "rubber" components (or any other components) due to using biodiesel.
All VAG diesel engines are warranted to use pure biodiesel and have been for years. Check the fuel section in your handbook. It may be referred to as RME (Rape Methyl Ester) or diester. This appears in the handbooks for my VW Passat and my Seat Leon, both of which I have run on pure biodiesel since I acquired them - the Leon has done 50k miles from new on it, the Passat has gone from 92k to 125k on it. I haven't made any adjustments to the engines at all in order to use biodiesel. Neither car has had any biodiesel-related problems. Neither did the other cars I ran it on, nor have any of the other customers of my supplier in Belfast. His estimate is that nearly 1.5 million miles have been covered running on his fuel in a variety of diesel engines from all major manufacturers.
Older Ford engines equipped with a rotary fuel pump have been known to fail when using biodiesel. I have never heard of a proven case of biodiesel causing any other kind of fuel pump/fuel system failure.
If you're looking for a supplier, it's worth knowing that like fossil fuel, biodiesel should be produced to a standard. The European standard that applies to pure biodiesel is called EN14214 and replaces the previous DIN51606 standard, which was previously used across Europe. The common 5% blend (5% biodiesel, 95% derv) should meet EN590. Before buying anybody's fuel, you should ask them what standard they produce it to. If they don't know what you're talking about, don't bother with their product.
Links to the many possible UK biodiesel suppliers can be found here:
www.biofuels.fsnet.co.uk/biobiz.htm
and here:
www.biodieselfillingstations.co.uk/
Many of the outlets will only sell a 5% blend. Others will sell a higher blend, all the way up to 100%. Some of the information is a bit dated, but should be mostly accurate.
Something else to be aware of is that biodiesel is the result of a chemical reaction between an oil (such as rapeseed, sunflower, hemp etc, or even an animal fat, although this is not advisable for the UK climate) and an alcohol such as methanol or ethanol, using a catalyst such as sodium hydroxide or potassium hydroxide. The process is called transesterification. Biodiesel is *not* merely filtered vegetable oil, or vegetable oil mixed with paint thinners, white spirit, butanol etc. I understand that Rix and Broadland are reputable suppliers, I just haven't heard anything about the others but have no reason to doubt them.
What Tesco and others sell as biodiesel is exactly the same as what is sold at the pump as "diesel" all across France - a blend of 5% biodiesel and 95% derv. The French don't seem to consider it worth mentioning in the name, but even this small blend will be a little kinder to your engine - as well as to the air quality in terms of lower particulate emissions and lower CO2/CO emissions.
--
andymc
Vroom, vroom - mmm, doughnuts ...
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Thanks, Andy, that's very comprehensive. Our local supplier is Rix, so, at the moment I'm likely to be on a 5% blend. Youngest son is a budding eco-warrior, and would thus like us to save the planet, providing he doesn't have to walk anywhere! (unfair on him, he has serious problems with his feet, so it does hurt him when he walks too far)
I will check carefully with VW Audi, but recognise that they're likely to err on the side of caution.
Tim{P}
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My source in Germany is very reliable and works in the Diesel component industry - I don't want to say more than that. His information is bang up to date.
I gather that there have been quite a few problems with the pumps and there are arguments between VAG and Bosch about who picks up the bill for warranty claims. Note that post-2003 cars (e.g. Golf V, Touran etc) are no longer bio-D approved unless fitted with the optional factory 'RME pack'. I don't know what the situation is in the UK, but in Germany I gather that any warranty claim must be accompanied by evidence (e.g. fuel station receipts) showing that the car was fuelled with bio-D to the DIN standard at no greater than 5%, otherwise the claim is refused.
Anyway, that's the information I have. I've no axe to grind either way, so feel free to take it or leave it as you wish.
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