I've said this before, but...
Instead of worrying about very small differences in perceived 'safety' levels of different cars, fork out less than £100 and a few hours of your time on an Advanced Driving course (IAM or RoSPA). The advantages this will bring (not only in safety, but also in mpg, less wear and tear (car, driver and passengers!), less stress, and more confident and comfortable driving.
It never ceases to amaze me how many people put 'safety' as their top reason for buying a particular new car, and spend many 000's of pounds in the process (esp those thaty buy 4x4 for this reason!), but the standard of their driving is lamentable to say the least.
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RichardW
Is it illogical? It must be Citroen....
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It's also worth noting that whilst 4X4 may fair better in an accident they are inherently more "unsafe" when trying to avoid one - high centre of gravity = poorer stability & less control, the newest models are trying to address this with the aid of technology but the older ones certainly haven't.
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Thanks for all the comments. I agree that driving skills are a major factor in keeping safe but still feel that when choosing a car the protection it offers is still a key concern.
One thing that amazes me is that until recently the Focus didn't have ABS as standard. To me anybody who buys a new car without this must be mad! You never know when you may need it.
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To be honest, I think ABS is overhyped. Great, you can steer IF you lock the wheels and would stop quicker IF the road was perfectly dry. It's not the be all and end all of road safety. I'd rather know how to brake correctly in an emergency than have ABS.
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Adam
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To be honest, I think ABS is overhyped. Great, you can steer IF you lock the wheels and would stop quicker IF the road was perfectly dry.
Adam,
While it may not be the be all and end all of road safety, it is extremely effective when in the wet and the wheels do lock. I have felt the effect both on a skid-pan and on a motorway.
The skid-pan course was completely wet and the difference in stopping times was fanomial. The car (a V6 Mondeo) had a clever little switch to turn ABS on and off. ABS off: twice as far to stop, no steering control. ABS on: half the stopping distance, enough steering to avoid an obstruction. OK, so you might say that in that situation all you need it to be clued up about cadance braking. Great, except in a real emergency, you're hardly going to have time to think about this, you're just going to be pressing hard on the brake pedal.
The motorway incident was slightly more real and scary. In this instance, I had ABS on one front wheel but not on the other. Again, the road was wet, and I felt the car steer to one side as one side locked and the other ABSed. Had to correct with the steering wheel. Some time during the "vacation" I'll fix this with new ABS belt and modulator on the broken side, having understood how effective it is.
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Mike Farrow
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I see your point Mike - the majority of people would "panic brake" but I think too many people just think "It's got ABS - it'll be alright". I'd rather learn how to brake without locking the wheels.
I think it was said on here, the optimum braking pressure is at the point just before the wheels lock up.
I would agree with all of your argument though.
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Adam
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Adam,
I've tried out ABS on an airfield, in a new 911 whose brakes are powerful enough to make your eyes water. I have also had cause to use it on the road in anger(/panic).
The optimum braking effort is indeed just prior to lock-up, but I have no confidence that I could find that point reliably in adverse (i.e. typical!) conditions.
ABS also changes the rules of the game so that they are in accord with the blindingly* obvious. You want to stop: you hit the brakes. You want to stop as quickly as possible: you hit the brakes as hard as possible. Something in the way? Steer round it.
Give me ABS every time, thanks.
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*patently?
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Good point Patently. I suppose I was saying....I don't know what I was saying really!
Yes I do - it's good, and I'd have it but I wouldn't think it would stop me dead like many people I speak to do.
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Adam
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Laws of physics still apply, of course.
And one thing that they say is that anything capable of literally stopping you dead would decelerate you with such force that you would be, err, dead. Literally....
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Adam, was it a few days ago that you locked the wheels? dig dig. the main advantage of abs is that it compensates for the natural reaction to brake like stink when you need to. In this situation driver time and attention is usually elsewhere, and cadence braking becomes "unnatural". It goes against the grain to force yourself to reduce braking effort when you need to stop asap. With abs you can "forget" braking force and look for other possible escape routes.
No vehicle is safer than the person in control of it, including putting your own vehicle "in harms way". Accidents do still happen and always will. There is a tendancy to mix up safety and survival. Most of the devices such as airbags, crumple zones etc. are survival features. Safety features help to avoid the potential accident.
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Curses! I was hoping everyone had forgotten about that!
I completely agree with everything you've said mjm. Perhaps I'm bitter that mine doesn't have it and seemingly every M reg Cavalier and ZX seems to have it!
I really want to take my advanced driving test but am wondering if it's worth it when I want to join the Police as soon as I leave.
Fortunately (although too late if a kid jumped out straight in front of me) I remembered to ease off and then reapply but as I said - it was an eternity after my brain had sent the signal to my foot to stamp on the anchors.
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Adam
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Adam,
I think the advanced driving test would be a good idea, it gets you into the mood for the harder stuff to come on your Police training. A better plan would be to join the Specials (if you haven't already). Though that doesn't give you driver training, you can work your way up to "blues" with no "twos" :-)
If you're planning on joining the Police the wait can be quite long. Around here (Warwickshire) you have to apply almost a year beforehand. So if your uni course ends next June apply to the Police (or at least phone up to check) this June.
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Mike Farrow
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Mike,
I've contacted them and they seemed indifferent but said to write a letter in April so that's what I'll do!
I'm seriously considering the advanced driving course though - I think your reasoning has just swayed me.
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Adam
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Adam
Take the advanced driving test. It may give you the edge over any other candidates who want to join.
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Good point RF. If anyone can give me the lowdown about it I'd be grateful. I know it's about £150 but that's about it.
Cheers
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Adam
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Adam,
goto www.iam.org.uk/Skill4life/index.php
The course you want is "Skill for life". The course is quite thorough and will take up every other Sundary morning until test time. I went through the course but didn't take the test, though I'll probably try this summer.
Every Sunday I went out with a different person, this makes perfect sence as some pick up more about your driving than others. Remember that although it will be harder than your past driving test, the examiner will be looking to pass you not fail you this time.
Good luck, and don't forget for the "Skill for life" course you get a discount for students of £10, so it'll cost you £75 which includes the course and test.
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Mike Farrow
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Cheers Mike,
Much appreciated. The more I think about it, the more I look forward to it.
Again, thanks a lot. I'll keep everyone informed as I'd always wanted to do it - I'm just greatful you've both talked me into finally doing it!
Thanks,
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Adam
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