You haven't explained - is this residential parking or 'other'? I think there are different arguments depending on this. Residents should be able to park a car somewhere without having to pay megabucks.
Otherwise, the case is not so convincing. If you were a cash-strapped council trying to raise revenue, wanting less cars, more use of public transport, wouldn't you raise prices until you got the message across and the coffers full? I would...
...puts on bullet-proof armour ready for BR onslaught...
Splodgeface
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How often have you lobbied your local Council about the cost of parking? All charges have to be agreed by the Council, if you are not happy make representations.
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Splodgeface, I fully agree with you that if I were a cash-strapped council trying to raise revenue, wanting less cars, more use of public transport, I would raise prices until I got the message across and the coffers full.
However, I'm not a cash-strapped council trying to raise revenue, wanting less cars and more use of public transport.
;-)
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What cash strapped councils do is to raise parking charges to a ridculous level, restrict the number of spaces available to encourage use of poor quality public transport then sit back and watch their income decrease because people shop at out of town supersites with free parking and the profitable local retailers shut up shop and turn the once thriving town into another concubine of charity shops and building societies.
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Well, i'l reply in order.
Volvoman - Park illegally in London on purpose, i'm not that rich/stupid. I made the mortal mistake of paying for my ticket, Pay & Display, and turning up 10 mins late.
Obviously i was asking for it.
Splodgeface - I was actually talking about parking in general, but don't get me started on residents parking.
In theory Residents parking could work, in practice it works for the benefit of the local council.
My suggestions would be;
1. Parking should not be limited to a couple of roads, but the whole of the borough, i.e Kensington & Chelsea.
Lived there four 4 years, it worked well enough.
2. The cost should cover the administration of the project, let them make there profit from fines.
3. Permits to be limited to a max of 2 per house.
Daveyjp - How do i lobby my council, it's not exactly info. that they publicise.
Tom - I agree with you fully.
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So Rashid - although I sympathise with anyone who genuinely turns up a few minutes late only to find they've been done - technically you hadn't paid for all of your parking and that's the problem.
Whilst I know there are restrictions beyond which you aren't allowed to go (e.g. max. 2 hrs.) many people get done because they just think/hope/pray they're going to get away with it and save a few pence but then whinge about it when it all goes pear shaped. Likewise those who knowingly park on double yellows to pop into a shop then decide it's ok to assault the parking attendant for issuing a ticket when they know they've done wrong and should accept their punishment.
As regards the cost of parking as opposed to the cost of the fines for illegal parking, I suppose local govt. revenue has to come from somewhere so if it's not parking, expect it to be added to your ever growing council tax. The bad news is that as we all decide to own more cars they'll be more pressure on parking and the laws of supply and demand will probably dictate that parking costs rise even further.
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What cash strapped councils do is to raise parking charges to a ridculous level, restrict the number of spaces available to encourage use of poor quality public transport then sit back and watch their income decrease because people shop at out of town supersites with free parking and the profitable local retailers shut up shop and turn the once thriving town into another concubine of charity shops and building societies.
Well said. Try comparing the town centres at:
- Witney (free & plentiful parking, lots of thriving shops)
with
- Bicester (limited and expensive parking, almost no shops worth visiting).
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Well said. Try comparing the town centres at: - Witney (free & plentiful parking, lots of thriving shops)
Patently,
Not for long if the development of the Welch Way car park and area behind goes ahead.
Also, always people in the Waitrose carpark checking numberplates for overstaying the time limit (3hrs?)
StarGazer
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Also, always people in the Waitrose carpark checking numberplates for overstaying the time limit (3hrs?)
3 hours is long enough (for me) to shop, but not long enough to go to work, which (I suspect) is the point. Bicester is limited to an expensive 2 hours, which is tight.
Not for long if the development of the Welch Way car park and area behind goes ahead.
At which point I may stop shopping there...!
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We seem to have the opposite attitude to parking in this country to the French (yes I know we are much more congested) They seem to encourage you to use town centres by providing lots of free (or very cheap)parking. In Bordeaux, for instance I was struggling to get a coin in a meter when a Frenchman explained to me that there were no charges in August because it was holiday season. Therefore free to encourage people to visit. Parking at coastal resorts also often very cheap or free within yards of the beach whereas when I visited my old home town of Scarborough in June it was virtually impossible to park within a mile of the beach. In my local town, unless you park at Sainsbury's and spend money there it is quicker, cheaper and easier to drive to the out of town centre 10 miles away. No wonder town centres are dying.
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How can councils justify any charge whatsoever for parking in streets already bought & paid for by the motoring taxpayer? They do not provide any facility for the charge.If the counter argument to this is the possible obstructions which might ensue with "free" parking , strict application of existing police powers would be perfectly proper.
If, on the other hand, a council has provided proper parking facilities, such as a multi-story car park, then of course parking charges are justfied.
--
Roger. (Costa del Sol, España)
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In France where we have a Flat on the med, they put the pay & display machines in for July and August. Apart from then its a free for all!!!
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Roger, the roads are paid for and used by all taxpayers, not just those motoring. Parking, on or off street, is a commodity for which demand is not met. In some places e.g. the vicinity of tube and railway stations and in tourist areas it cannot be met. I know they manage it in France though largely as a product of huge investment in underground facilities and a greater willingness to have parking defile historic and architectural space.
Charging is one way of rationing and controlling use and making a return for the local taxpayers, who themselves may only be a small proportion of the users.
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So it's impossible to met the demand for parking space, except for those places where they manage?
;-)
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So it's impossible to met the demand for parking space, except for those places where they manage? ;-)
Some places make a political choice not to manage; up to the local electors to sort that one.
In other places demand exceeds any possible supply. Phil W mentions Scarborough, a town built long before the car and whose charm includes its steeply terraced streets. Was there at August BH, all accomadation taken and streets packed on permits issued by hoteliers. Loads more day trippers flow in and fill P&D. Apart from re-instating the Marine Drive parking once the sea defences work is complete it's difficult to see where further parking could be created. Parking on the foreshore in either bay would be both hazard and eyesore. North Bay redevelopment may provide parking for the fancy housing, conference centres and casinos proposed. But at the loss of existing parkland and tourist facilities. Park and Ride on the outskirts?
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Agreed, Bromptonaut. I was being cheeky!
But there is a sensible point. Most people travel by car, especially when away from home and therefore not familiar with bus routes, times etc. So, HMG:
(a) discourages use of cars in built-up areas. Limits to car parking, traffic calming measures, congestion charges on the way.
(b) moans that our town centres are dying and that ugly out-of-town developments are springing up.
Am I alone in thinking there is a slight lack of intellectual rigour here?
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... and a country (France) that's twice the size of ours.
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I conceded in my post that we are more congested than France but the fact that France is twice as big as us doesn't mean that its towns, cities, tourist areas are less under pressure than ours for parking space. Why is it so much easier to park in the centre of Bordeaux or Lille or Reims than (say) Leeds, Leicester or Nottingham?
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Well I guess that'd depend on how those towns have developed over time and what emphasis has been placed on car parking provision by the French authorities over the years. It's a while since I've been to Bordeaux but I recall seeing cars parked everywhere rather like we do here. Likewise in Paris, Chatres, Calais, Bolougne, Dunkirk and all the other places I've vistited. Maybe the perception we have as relatively relaxed visitors to other countries colours our view of their problems at times whilst the daily grind we face here going about our daily routine make it all seem so much worse here. Perhaps it's a combination of both things.
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You are probably right VM. There are certainly towns in France which have nice wide boulevards where parking is allowed on both sides and in the middle, and on holiday we are not usually trying to park in rush hour etc. However, parking in France seems much cheaper and they do seem to try to make it easier. In this country it is as if they are trying to make it difficult (to get us to use public transport?)A case in point is a village I drive through to get to work used to have parking down one side of its main street and a bus bay - easy to stop to buy a paper, sandwich, lottery ticket what have you. They have now blocked the bus bay, widened the pavement to about 15 feet (honest) with no parking - result? Traffic jams behind the buses every morning, no parking so I no longer even go that way to work let alone stop to use the shops.
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