Any - Mixing 'summer' & all-season tyres - Tester

https://www.honestjohn.co.uk/askhj/answer/148301/can-i-fit-a-mix-of-summer-and-winter-tyres-to-my-car-

Question: 'Can I fit summer tyres to the front of my Audi A3 and all-weather tyres to the rear?'

Answer: 'No, this would destabilise the car. The rear of the vehicle would have substantially more grip than the front. And in all likelihood, this would cause an accident.'

Surely this is nonsense, that the difference would be so pronounced that a normal driver would even notice, let alone lose control because of it? I have done this on several mainstream cars when OE front tyres needed replacing before rears, swapping rears to front and getting Michelin CC put on the back, then Michelin CC on the front when the 'swaps' wore out. I never felt the slightest evidence of destabilization. (I'd class myself as no more than a reasonably competent driver -- not a track-day petrolhead!)

Edited by Tester on 30/07/2020 at 10:40

Any - Mixing 'summer' & all-season tyres - KB.

Not sure if you're asking if this nonsense, or telling us this is nonsense. If there was a question mark at the end of your first sentence then that would have clarified things.

But if it WAS a quesion, then you've comprehensively answered it yourself.

Like you, I make no claim to be a racing driver but I do know I wouldn't mix "All SAeason" or "Winter" tyres in any combination with "Summer" tyres. I make a point of having the fronts and the backs swapped over annually to achieve even wear and then replace all four with the same type - be that All Season, Winter or Summer (and I've had all three types over many years).

Any - Mixing 'summer' & all-season tyres - badbusdriver

https://www.honestjohn.co.uk/askhj/answer/148301/can-i-fit-a-mix-of-summer-and-winter-tyres-to-my-car-

Question: 'Can I fit summer tyres to the front of my Audi A3 and all-weather tyres to the rear?'

Answer: 'No, this would destabilise the car. The rear of the vehicle would have substantially more grip than the front. And in all likelihood, this would cause an accident.'

Surely this is nonsense, that the difference would be so pronounced that a normal driver would even notice, let alone lose control because of it? I have done this on several mainstream cars when OE front tyres needed replacing before rears, swapping rears to front and getting Michelin CC put on the back, then Michelin CC on the front when the 'swaps' wore out. I never felt the slightest evidence of destabilization. (I'd class myself as no more than a reasonably competent driver -- not a track-day petrolhead!)

Firstly, i completely agree with KB. There is no way i'd have a different type of tyre on the front than the back.

Even ignoring my own prefrence and opinion on the matter, i strongly suspect (but am ot 100% sure) that your insurance would have something to say if you were involved in an accident (regardless of who is at fault) and it was found that you had different types of tyres on each end.

As to the HJ response, they don't know what kind of driver is asking the question. You or i may drive in a sensible and responsible manner for the conditions but that is not the case for everybody. And the simple fact is that different types of tyre do provide different levels of grip and response. Maybe not at sensible speeds, but they do. So for HJ to advise anything other than what they have done would be very irresponsible.

TBH, i find it very odd that you object to HJ's comments strongly enough to start a new thread. The effects may well have been exaggerated (certainly for most drivers), but as i said, HJ doesn't know what kind of driver is asking the question.

Edited by badbusdriver on 30/07/2020 at 11:26

Any - Mixing 'summer' & all-season tyres - daveyjp

It is far easier when limited for space to respond with a generic 'don't do it' rather than analyse the nuances and consider permutations of possibilities.

Some A3s have all wheel drive systems. Mixing tyre types on those isn't a good idea.

In heavy rain all weather tyres may be better at shedding water than summers. If the summers have 3mm and you go and stick all weathers with 8mm on the rear it could cause problems, even at 'normal' speeds.

Any - Mixing 'summer' & all-season tyres - Smileyman

here are two videos about tyres and the impact on driving, there may be more of interest too on the YouTube channel or website https://www.tyrereviews.co.uk/

How BAD can tyres make a car? Premium VS Budget tyres tested and reviewed!

www.youtube.com/watch?v=xTcxNw3raNE

Why Mixing Expensive Tyres With Cheap Tyres Will Ruin Your Car!

www.youtube.com/watch?v=_wo-9112aHw

Any - Mixing 'summer' & all-season tyres - mcb100

I suspect that the published advice needs expanding upon slightly. A one line answer does not adequately answer the question, in that under 'normal' conditions a driver will notice no difference with 2 and 2 tyre types. In snow or ice however, a FWD car with winter tyres just on the front may have a tendency to 'swap ends' when the rear runs out of grip before the front, such as when coming off the accelerator mid-corner or potentially under braking. A RWD car will always need 4 tyres of the same type to enable both steering and traction.

Any - Mixing 'summer' & all-season tyres - gordonbennet

As mcb100, and the tyres you fitted 2 at a time i believe were all season tyres, not winter only rubber, so the difference between the two would be slight in most temperatures, possibly full winter rears would be lacking grip in hot weather but much different limits of grip could apply in extreme cold, you fitted the CC's to the rear first so the tyres likely to lose grip first would be the fronts, which is typical for wrong wheel drive cars anyway.

If you fitted full winter tyres to the front leaving summer tyres on the rear, then once again during normal weather the fronts would probably lose grip first, but in the event of adverse ice/snow conditions you could have the unenviable combination of a front end having excellent grip whilst the rear would be caster like.

Personally i'm not bothered what anyone else does, but as said in the event of a serious accident where the car with mixed tyre types lost control the insurer might be unimpressed.

This subject is not writ in stone, articles and advice freely available to the public need to err on the side of caution, most people know from experience their cars usually handle better with matched tyres all round, some will find other combinations suit them and their usage but to delve into the nitty gritty an article would be pages unending.

Edited by gordonbennet on 30/07/2020 at 12:53

Any - Mixing 'summer' & all-season tyres - Engineer Andy

You (the OP) may be ok in warmish, dry weather, but you could easily find out the hard way on a cold, wet and/or snowy/icy day or especially at night when the difference in performance would be greater between the sets/types of tyre.

There's a reason why F1 cars get black flagged if they fit tyres (even brand new ones) of a different type on them at the same time.

Not ever worth the risk other than for an emergency spare when you drive accordingly - and for a much shorter distance than usual - before replacing it with a proper matching new tyre.

You probably were fine because the vast majority of the driving was in decent conditions and not having to use anywhere near the full potential of the tyres' performance, e.g. in very bad weather.

You want your car's tyres to be predictable and controllable in all conditions for the way / speed you drive at.

The same rule of not mixing and matching summer and all-season tyres also applies to doing the same for asymetric and directional tyres. They behave differently in the same conditions - again, more so in poor weather. It isn't just the case that as you go from summer to all season to winter tyres, they just get softer and wear out quicker.

What you should be doing is rotating your existing tyres enough so that all of them wear out at the same time, and replacing all four with a new set of X, Y or Z. You should then be a bit more cautious as the tyres get scrubbed and you get used to driving with them, compared to the previous set.

Sometimes, the driving style needs to be adapted - especially in poor weather - to the set of tyres you have. Even though my current (2yo) set of CC+s are excellent, they still would not be as good performing as a new summer tyre of the same grade in non-winter (above 7degC) conditions. In winter, they (by their nature) do perform better, relative to summer tyres.

I would say that under the right conditions (that happen more than you think), having a set of new all-seasons and older (worn) summer tyres are just as bad as having a set of new and old summer tyres fitted to the wrong axles.

Edited by Engineer Andy on 30/07/2020 at 13:22

Any - Mixing 'summer' & all-season tyres - John F

https://www.honestjohn.co.uk/askhj/answer/148301/can-i-fit-a-mix-of-summer-and-winter-tyres-to-my-car-

Question: 'Can I fit summer tyres to the front of my Audi A3 and all-weather tyres to the rear?'

Answer: 'No, this would destabilise the car. The rear of the vehicle would have substantially more grip than the front. And in all likelihood, this would cause an accident.'

I really do think that if the purportedly authoritative HJ is going to provide one-liner answers, more attention should be paid to both the choice of words and intelligence of the reader.

The rear of the vehicle would have substantially more grip than the front.

This would make better sense if 'would' became 'might' and 'substantially' became 'somewhat'. Indeed, for much of the car's life on dry roads, the slicker front tyres might afford more grip than the rears.

And in all likelihood, this would cause an accident. 'All likelihood? Nonsense. Better to phrase 'in wintery conditions this could make an accident a bit more likely'.

Any - Mixing 'summer' & all-season tyres - Tester

Thank you, John F, that's pretty much what I was getting at and backed up by my experience, which I fully accept should not be generalized to all drivers in all conditions. I apologize for upsetting anyone and will, I think, stop asking questions from now on. I'm not cut out for forums.

Thanks to all, and goodnight.

Any - Mixing 'summer' & all-season tyres - gordonbennet

Thank you, John F, that's pretty much what I was getting at and backed up by my experience, which I fully accept should not be generalized to all drivers in all conditions. I apologize for upsetting anyone and will, I think, stop asking questions from now on. I'm not cut out for forums.

Thanks to all, and goodnight.

As said by Avant, nothing wrong with the question at all, so please don't feel you are unwelcome or anything, there are some reasonably enthusiastic car owners here who enjoy experiments and comparing notes.

The thing with the website itself it needs to not leave itself open to litigation if someone less experienced or less hands on than you tried your mix and match set up and came unstuck, as we know in these days of blame culture people are only too keen to avoid accepting their own responsibilities for their choices, hence why the site would err on the side of caution with advice.

Any - Mixing 'summer' & all-season tyres - Avant

It was a perfectly reasonable question, Tester, and there was nothing in it to upset anyone. People have strong views about topics like this, so don't be surprised.

I think there's general agreement that mixing tyre types like this carries an element of risk, depending on the type of road and the weather conditions - so best not to do it.

Any - Mixing 'summer' & all-season tyres - corax

Tester - I had an unrepairable puncture on one of my rear Goodyear Efficient Grips on my Forester. I decided to go with a pair of Uniroyal Rain Experts since the price was lower and they are a well rated tyre.

As soon as they were fitted, the car handled very strangely, feeling like it was steering from the rear, or the tracking was out. The Uniroyals are summer tyres but have a very open tread with different characteristics to the Goodyears, besides having more grip as new tyres. I swapped them front to rear and the handling improved no end, especially after they had worn in.

As for finding out the hard way on a winters night, it was a daily occurrence to slip and slide all over the road in the days of rear wheel drive and leaf springs with no electronic aids in the eighties, let alone before that. People are so mollycoddled now, and less skilled.

Edited by corax on 30/07/2020 at 17:19

Any - Mixing 'summer' & all-season tyres - gordonbennet

As for finding out the hard way on a winters night, it was a daily occurrence to slip and slide all over the road in the days of rear wheel drive and leaf springs with no electronic aids in the eighties, let alone before that. People are so mollycoddled now, and less skilled.

I never minded a bit of oversteer, within reason its (er interesting in an artic when the tractor drive axle goes full OS) fairly easily conrollable with RWD, i dislike intently the ploughing straight on tendency of wrong wheel drive and if OS does occur normal lift off steer into technique isn't helped by the engine braking effect on the front wheels.

Just out of interest for you Corax, the recent and superb value purchase of Falken ZE914's for our Forester is turning out well, recommended by daughter who found them really good on her hard driven Civic, lovely predictable handling able to balance it nicely via throttle input alone on the Foz on long bends.

Any - Mixing 'summer' & all-season tyres - corax
Just out of interest for you Corax, the recent and superb value purchase of Falken ZE914's for our Forester is turning out well, recommended by daughter who found them really good on her hard driven Civic, lovely predictable handling able to balance it nicely via throttle input alone on the Foz on long bends.

Sounds good GB, a tyre that has been recommended more than once on the owners forums, I might try that one next time.

Engineer Andy - very true, and I've learnt my lesson :-)

Any - Mixing 'summer' & all-season tyres - Engineer Andy

Indeed, and why I prefer my cars to be inately very good at or at least very predictable handling sans driving aids, and whilst I understand the benefits of many of the modern safety features, I think that too many people nowadays drive at speeds or a style well above their skill level and rely on those aids and features to keep / get them out of trouble.

It's also the reason why I would never mix and match different types of tye other than a emergency spare and only then to enable me to get somewhere that I can replace the damaged one with a suitable new one.

Better safe than sorry, especially when it likely only costs a few quid extra for that.

Any - Mixing 'summer' & all-season tyres - mcb100

They may be less skilled (not sure about that, myself) but they're dying in far fewer numbers than in previous decades. All that tech must be doing something.

Any - Mixing 'summer' & all-season tyres - Engineer Andy

They may be less skilled (not sure about that, myself) but they're dying in far fewer numbers than in previous decades. All that tech must be doing something.

In some regard - yes, but I think that the main reasons are the introduction of safety cells, airbags and ABS in vehicles, and, just as important, great strides in emergency medicine.

I'm sure improved tyre technology helped a reasonable amount as well.

 

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