KIA Sportage - RAC Clearing Fault Code to get you back on Road

Honest John Back Room » Motoring discussion
View Threaded
Thu 11 Apr 2019 14:16
KIA Sportage - RAC Clearing Fault Code to get you back on Road - Michael Stephen

Bought a 6 month old Sportage from Kia Arnold Clark Dealership 6 weeks ago. It had only done 125 miles when bought. Last night it broke down (went into limp mode).

After contacting Arnold Clark, they put me through to RAC (1 year cover when you buy car) and they sent roadside assistance straight away. The technician plugged in his tablet, brought up fault codes (P061B), Torque Control Signal System. He said dealers don't normally like you to delete codes but he would print off a report showing what codes come up and id just need to hand these into dealer.Codes were cleared and car was now drivable and i went on my way

Walked into Arnold Clark the next day and their reply was "we cant fix the fault if the faults are not present in the car".

Amazing response from dealer and after two hours of complaining and going round in circles im at a dead end. I now have to wait until my car breaks down (hopefully not with the wife and young kids in it) and send the car on the back of a truck into dealership.

Anyone been caught out by this? Can i force AC to look at my car somehow? Are RAC at fault...Are they working in cahoots so dealer doesnt need to investigate?

I have went to citizens advice and only way i can put car back is if the dealer has chance to fix and it breaks again, but this breakdown doesnt even count as a chance to fix.

any help appreciated

Edited by Michael Stephen on 11/04/2019 at 14:20

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Thu 11 Apr 2019 14:46
KIA Sportage - RAC Clearing Fault Code to get you back on Road - dan86

I'd see how it goes as it may have just been a phantom fault because a sensor didn't like something. If it's a genuine fault it will come back sooner rather than later.

As to weather Arnold Clark will do anything if theirs no fault for their diagnostic machine to pick up they can't do much. As will all modern cars it's a case of computer needed to find faults.

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Thu 11 Apr 2019 14:52
KIA Sportage - RAC Clearing Fault Code to get you back on Road - Cris_on_the_gas

What a lot of t*** from AC.

Why didn't they believe the printout supplied and looked into their flow chart of troubleshooting and perform first action.

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Thu 11 Apr 2019 14:56
KIA Sportage - RAC Clearing Fault Code to get you back on Road - Michael Stephen

They believed the fault.....however they said there was nothing they could do because the fault wasn't still present in the car. Unwilling to even investigate the RAC report codes i gave them, just said there was nothing they could do.

AC have been a total nightmare from day 1

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Fri 12 Apr 2019 17:36
KIA Sportage - RAC Clearing Fault Code to get you back on Road - nick62

They believed the fault.....however they said there was nothing they could do because the fault wasn't still present in the car. Unwilling to even investigate the RAC report codes i gave them, just said there was nothing they could do.

AC have been a total nightmare from day 1

What's even more frustrating, is that the plonkers would still have no idea how to fix it if the sensor jumped out of the car and smacked them on the nose.

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Thu 11 Apr 2019 15:05
KIA Sportage - RAC Clearing Fault Code to get you back on Road - sammy1

Being fobbed off here, Fault could happen again, Kia dealer would have a procedure to check out the fault code causes. Suggest you complain to Kia direct.

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Thu 11 Apr 2019 15:12
KIA Sportage - RAC Clearing Fault Code to get you back on Road - Michael Stephen

Complained to Kia UK yesterday, their response was to call the dealership who stated they couldn't diagnose the problem as the fault code wasn't present in car.

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Thu 11 Apr 2019 16:20
KIA Sportage - RAC Clearing Fault Code to get you back on Road - sammy1

Have you tried googling your fault code, there are quite a few possible reasons why the code is generated. The fact that the car can go into limp mode cannot instil you with a great deal of confidence Have you spoken to the service manager.

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Thu 11 Apr 2019 16:37
KIA Sportage - RAC Clearing Fault Code to get you back on Road - Michael Stephen

Code brings up a multitude of things (maybe 7 possibilities). Service manager says he cant hookup to diagnostics and work backwards from the code (whatever that means) to troubleshoot and find where the fault was coming from.

fundamental flaw in the system if RAC can "fix" your car to a state where the cause of the problem cannot be investigated by the dealer.

In todays world of computers you would think the codes would be retained somewhere in the cars Central Computer System!

www.obd-codes.com/p061b

should probably send this to Kia right?

Edited by Michael Stephen on 11/04/2019 at 16:39

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Fri 12 Apr 2019 16:24
KIA Sportage - RAC Clearing Fault Code to get you back on Road - Michael Stephen

Emailed today from RAC claiming full responsibility for deleting the codes, which they say the Technician should not have done with a car still under warranty.

Unfortunately im still left with a car i have no confidence in when driving my young family.

Is it worth pursuing RAC for a like for like replacement from AC?

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Fri 12 Apr 2019 16:36
KIA Sportage - RAC Clearing Fault Code to get you back on Road - sammy1

How would the RAC tech get your car out of limp if he did not reset the ECU? It is unclear in your posting whether AC even tried to read the ECU or did they just accept you saying the code was cleared. Some cars retain information in their computer even though codes are clear and which only the dealer equipment can read

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Fri 12 Apr 2019 16:49
KIA Sportage - RAC Clearing Fault Code to get you back on Road - Michael Stephen

RAC should have put it on the back of a van back to dealership. This should have been standard practice for the technician - who looks like he took the easy option and deleted the codes to get on with his day!

I showed Arnold Clark the RAC report with the fault codes that were deleted. AC said they cant replace warranty parts if they dont diagnose faults on own diagnistic machines so they can report it back to Kia. AC were not willing to investigate with no fault present. They eventually agreed to run diagnostics on the car but as expected, everything was clear.

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Fri 12 Apr 2019 17:14
KIA Sportage - RAC Clearing Fault Code to get you back on Road - gordonbennet

I'm only surmising here, but i assume AC are not Kia dealers, as such presumably they will not have the full dealer diagnostics which may well find the original fault logged in the ECU memory, not visible to a generic diagnostics reader.

Whether this is the fault of the RAC chap or not, i have to say that Kia haven't proved particularly helpful, it wouldn't have hurt them to arrange for your nearest dealer to run your car through dealer diagnostics, maybe not helpful as AC the seller and not a main dealer, but that is only a guess.

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sat 13 Apr 2019 12:22
KIA Sportage - RAC Clearing Fault Code to get you back on Road - Michael Stephen

Yes it is Arnold Clark Kia in Aberdeen. They run it through diagnostics eventually, which was a waste of time as the fault codes had been deleted. As far as I'm aware, once deleted, they can't be recovered. AC tell me that they can't replace warranty parts without running the fault through their own diagnostics.

My line of complaint will now focus on a like for like replacement at the expense of RAC.

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sat 13 Apr 2019 13:01
KIA Sportage - RAC Clearing Fault Code to get you back on Road - Big John

My line of complaint will now focus on a like for like replacement at the expense of RAC.

Is that getting the RAC to replace your whole car? All they have done is get you moving and they haven't damaged anything - so you are unlikely to win anything here. Presumably you have read all the RAC small print!

As for RAC "Are they working in cahoots so dealer doesnt need to investigate?" - the answer is NO.

As far as the dealer is concerned I can see their point. If all the detailed issues have been deleted from the car how can they investigate the fault? The printout would have been more generic and will not give enough detail to diagnose.

I myself had wobble with my Superb just after I bought it (was 14 months old) and it popped up a management light in Germany - turned out to be my fault after filling up with petrol - was told "One Click - Halte!!!!" at a great German Skoda dealer. It's been faultless since but I'm careful filling up now.

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sat 13 Apr 2019 15:42
KIA Sportage - RAC Clearing Fault Code to get you back on Road - catsdad
If RAC contest any claim for a whole car like for like replacement, as surely they would, pursuing this could cost the OP a lot of money as the small claims limit in Scotand is £5k.

The law generally works on the basis of putting the aggrieved party back in their original position. So had the RAC physically damaged something there would be a simple case to answer and clear costs to effect a remedy. With resetting of a fault code that has not recurred then would the legal position be that there is no loss to the OP as in effect his original, pre fault, position has not changed? Being devil's advocate, he started with a car that ran without fault and showing no fault codes and that is how he has ended up.

If the fault recurs then Kia warranty will cover it.

I know the OP feels aggrieved but to try to get the car replaced by the RAC is very, very unlikely to succeed. Its surely not worth the grief and expense.

What might be worth pursuing is a goodwill gesture on the back of their admission that they shouldn't have reset the codes. A free year or two breakdown cover?
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sat 13 Apr 2019 16:43
KIA Sportage - RAC Clearing Fault Code to get you back on Road - James2018

I had a car from the same stable that refused to accelerate, even down hill (auto) and even slowed if the accelerator was depressed further.

No fault codes were generated so the dealer couldn't do anything and of course they never materialised on the dealers test drives.

I had to film the dash - 3500 RPM, 50MPH, flat out down hill before the dealer did anything and had to call the manufacturers technical support team for advise. The throttle assembly had to be changed and touchwood the fault hasn't reoccurred.

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sat 13 Apr 2019 18:11
KIA Sportage - RAC Clearing Fault Code to get you back on Road - nick62

The annoying thing here is that fault WILL have occurred on another similar car previously, but they don't give a damn. If they replaced the assembly after seeing your video, then they would also have known what the likely problem was from your description.

In essence, they are treating you as a liar!

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sat 13 Apr 2019 18:26
KIA Sportage - RAC Clearing Fault Code to get you back on Road - mcb100
The dealer won’t want to commit any hours to it, with it currently showing no faults, because they need to claim those hours back as warranty work from KIA. A manufacturer may well say they won’t pay to investigate what appears to be a perfectly healthy car.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sat 13 Apr 2019 19:02
KIA Sportage - RAC Clearing Fault Code to get you back on Road - madf

Any suggestion that you can claim from the RAC is risible: they FIXED a fault: did not cause it..

A Clark are correct in their response: they cannot diagnose a non existent fault.

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sat 13 Apr 2019 19:27
KIA Sportage - RAC Clearing Fault Code to get you back on Road - RT

Any suggestion that you can claim from the RAC is risible: they FIXED a fault: did not cause it..

A Clark are correct in their response: they cannot diagnose a non existent fault.

Non-existent is little different to intermittent - with proper documentation of the fault code(s) recorded it's possible to start the investigation in a normal way.

The case highlights two undesirable features of modern car ownership - dealer technicians have little diagnostic skill, simply reliant on their computer's logic - "who pays" seems to over-ride any form of customer support these days.

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sat 13 Apr 2019 19:38
KIA Sportage - RAC Clearing Fault Code to get you back on Road - sammy1

It would appear that the Kia dealer AC is contracted to the RAC and that the car owner is NOT the member therefore it does suggest that AC are themselves responsible for the deletion of the code?. As todays cars are run by computer owners can only put up with the glitches that happen, much the same as your average PC or phone.

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sat 13 Apr 2019 20:02
KIA Sportage - RAC Clearing Fault Code to get you back on Road - gordonbennet

edit, never mind

Edited by gordonbennet on 13/04/2019 at 20:02

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sat 13 Apr 2019 19:59
KIA Sportage - RAC Clearing Fault Code to get you back on Road - nick62
The case highlights two undesirable features of modern car ownership - dealer technicians have little diagnostic skill, simply reliant on their computer's logic - "who pays" seems to over-ride any form of customer support these days.

+1

At £100+ plus per hour, it is an absolute joke that you are actually paying for someone on about £15/hour. The wages reflect the amount of skill.

Edited by nick62 on 13/04/2019 at 20:01

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Sun 22 Dec 2019 08:08
KIA Sportage - RAC Clearing Fault Code to get you back on Road - Ian D
Michael - did the fault come back? Any joy with the RAC or AC?
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Thu 2 Jan 2020 18:52
KIA Sportage - RAC Clearing Fault Code to get you back on Road - barney100

Clarks put you on to the RAC, did they offer to recover the car themselves? If not you were acting on their advice so I can't see why they won't at least have a look for you. All they need to do is plug in their machine and assure that there are no faults present now....or am I missing something? Maybe a lesson for all of us, get the car back not letting anyone else do anything.

Reply | Report as offensive | Link