Honda Civic - Requirement to identify the driver after 5 months - thibaud

Hello,

I'm surprised today, i received letter "requirement to identify the driver"

Date of offence : 10 april 2017 !!! We are 5 months after (9 august today)?

I got some question :

I don't know who was driver (5 months after... it's too long time)

It's not within 14 days (i should leave it?)

I sold my car 2 months ago... I'm not registred keeper now...

I'm french and i got french driving licence so i can't get point.

So what is the best answer, because i don't know who was driving (5 months...?) and it's not within 14 days !???

Thanks in advance for advice.

Honda Civic - Requirement to identify the driver after 5 months - RT

The 14 days only applies in specific circumstances - why don't you know who was driving the car - how many people have legal access to it?

As I understand it, DVLA will create a UK record for you to record the fine and points - or you may be invited to attend an awareness course, depending on the offence - that does presume you have a UK address.

Whatever you do, DON'T ignore it - that's a separate offence if you do!

Edited by RT on 09/08/2017 at 20:51

Honda Civic - Requirement to identify the driver after 5 months - thibaud

My father and my sister got access but doesn't live in UK and he was here with my sister in 10 april...(they come 1-2 weeks every month for business)

Honda Civic - Requirement to identify the driver after 5 months - SLO76
Were they listed on your insurance? They can pull your insurance details to see if anyone else was insured to drive it. If they weren't then you could be leaving yourself open for a charge of allowing someone to drive without insurance.

I received a speeding fine through the post for a car I'd sold but didn't keep the new owners details (I know, as a trader I copy all V5's and invoices when I sell a car on) but this was my car and I stupidly didn't this time.

I called the authority concerned and the rather helpful lady on the phone pulled up the new keepers details via their insurance there and then and redirected the penalty.

Don't try to dodge it! If you were driving then accept the fine and move on. It's hardly a disaster.
Honda Civic - Requirement to identify the driver after 5 months - skidpan

Date of offence : 10 april 2017 !!! We are 5 months after (9 august today)?

Is maths different in France?

10 April (which is month 4) to 09 August (which is month 8) is actually 4 months.

Honda Civic - Requirement to identify the driver after 5 months - RichardW

What's it for?

Assuming a speeding or red light offence, then they have to 'serve' the NIP within 14 days. Note that 'serve' = in first class post, you don't actually have to receive it! If you were the reg keeper, and your address was up to date, then it would appear to be invalid. You can't ignore it as otherwise you'll be up for a S172 offence, which is much more serious. If all your data was in order, and it's for a straightforward offence, then I would fill the form in (I'm sure if you think hard engouh you will work out who was driving) but write a covering letter pointing out that the NIP is invalid due to elapsed time, and inviting them to cancel it....

Honda Civic - Requirement to identify the driver after 5 months - Dwight Van Driver

There are a number of offences in relation to the use of a vehicle on a road other than Noipable ones so 14 days does not apply but 6 months limitation on proceedings may.

Form should say what the alleged offence is. Parking?

Form should still be returned with your explanation as to why you cannot name.

dvd

Honda Civic - Requirement to identify the driver after 5 months - thibaud

Hello,

it's for speed,

They told me, somebody was driving at 43 mph for 30mph in the city.

Because it was 5 months ago (too long time), it's not same like, I received within 1 month...

Thibaud.

Honda Civic - Requirement to identify the driver after 5 months - Bianconeri
So, silly question maybe, is this a UK-registered car registered at a UK address? As you have a non-UK license (French?) does the car have French plates?
Honda Civic - Requirement to identify the driver after 5 months - concrete

Very little information to digest at first but even after some additional information this still seems a bit murky. I think the best course of action would be to fill in the document, as required by law, return it to the police with an explanation similar to the one you provided here on the forum. You may wish to include the address of your relatives. Even if they live in France it shows good faith and the police can decide if it is worth pursuing them at all. Your relatives may admit to being the driver or deny it, however that is not your problem. The police however may think you are creating a smoke screen and may simply not accept what you say and pursue you as the registered keeper of the vehicle at the time. You are caught in the legal system now and it is very difficult to extricate yourself except by telling the truth. Good luck.

Concrete

Honda Civic - Requirement to identify the driver after 5 months - Middleman

The advice you require here depends on your relationship to the vehicle at the time of the alleged offence. Were you the Registered Keeper (RK)? That is, did you have in your possession the Registration Document (the V5C), was your name and address shown as the Registered Keeper on that document and has there been any changes to that within a short time prior to the offence? Were you the person "keeping" the vehicle at the time (that is, did you regularly use it and have responsibility for it?) If not, who was the RK why would somebody have nominated you as the driver?

It is insufficient to simply say you cannot remember who was driving - even after four (not five) months. Nor is it sufficient to simply provide details of a number of possible drivers. If you do you will face a charge under Section 172 of the Road Traffic Act. This carries a hefty fine, six points on your UK driving record, and, should you ever need it, difficulty (with the prospect of considerably increased premiums) obtaining UK motor insurance.

What you need to do now (and you do need to do something) varies depending on your relationship to the vehicle. Please let me know what it was and I can advise you more appropriately.

Honda Civic - Requirement to identify the driver after 5 months - Middleman

The advice you require here depends on your relationship to the vehicle at the time of the alleged offence. Were you the Registered Keeper (RK)? That is, did you have in your possession the Registration Document (the V5C), was your name and address shown as the Registered Keeper on that document and has there been any changes to that within a short time prior to the offence? Were you the person "keeping" the vehicle at the time (that is, did you regularly use it and have responsibility for it?) If not, who was the RK why would somebody have nominated you as the driver?

It is insufficient to simply say you cannot remember who was driving - even after four (not five) months. Nor is it sufficient to simply provide details of a number of possible drivers. If you do you will face a charge under Section 172 of the Road Traffic Act. This carries a hefty fine, six points on your UK driving record, and, should you ever need it, difficulty (with the prospect of considerably increased premiums) obtaining UK motor insurance.

What you need to do now (and you do need to do something) varies depending on your relationship to the vehicle. Please let me know what it was and I can advise you more appropriately.

Honda Civic - Requirement to identify the driver after 5 months - thibaud

Hello Middleman,

I was registred keeper without v5c at this time (i was waiting, it was new car, i bought it 10 days before the fine). Yes i was responsibility for it but my father and my sister was driving too (they come regulary).

Thibaud

Honda Civic - Requirement to identify the driver after 5 months - SLO76
"Yes i was responsibility for it but my father and my sister was driving too (they come regulary)."

Were they listed on your insurance?
Honda Civic - Requirement to identify the driver after 5 months - Middleman

“I was registred keeper without v5c at this time (i was waiting, it was new car, i bought it 10 days before the fine).”

Your recent acquisition of the vehicle explains why the NIP you received was late. The first NIP (which is the only one subject to a time limit) almost certainly went to the dealer or somebody else). It may be worth enquiring when the first NIP was served. If it was served beyond 14 days you have the potential for a defence against the speeding charge.

However, as I said earlier, it is very unusual for a first NIP to be served late these days and in any case that will only provide you with a potential get-out of the speeding charge. Your overriding concern at present is to respond to the request for driver’s details. As the “person keeping the vehicle” at the time of the alleged offence you have a duty to provide the details of the person driving. Whilst it is an offence to deliberately name somebody whom you know was not driving, it is not an offence to name the person who was most likely to have been driving. You may decide this is the most pragmatic course to take but it is a matter for you.

As I said earlier, if you fail to name the driver you will almost certainly be charged under S172 of the Road Traffic Act. There is a statutory defence against that charge which says that if you did not know who was driving and you could not, after exercising reasonable diligence, find out then you shall not be guilty of the offence. “Reasonable Diligence” is not defined and it is a matter for a court to decide. But simply saying “it was too long ago and I cannot remember” will not work. You will have to demonstrate that you have examined all the possibilities and have still been unable to find out. It is a difficult hurdle to overcome (if it was easy everybody would do it).

If you do decide to nominate a driver let me know. The speed alleged (43mph in a 30 limit) qualifies for a Fixed Penalty (£100 and three points). However it is likely you will not be offered this because of the time elapsed since the offence and they will go straight to court proceedings. There is scope for the court to sentence you at the Fixed Penalty level but you need to ask them to do so. I’ll let you know what to say. If instead you decide to defend the S172 charge I’ll also give you further advice.

If you decide to do nothing at all you will almost certainly be convicted of the S172 offence in your absence. If you do return to the UK and especially if you intend driving here this could cause you some difficulties.