The impossible quest....! - Bobbin Threadbare

Ok, here's another one of those questions that folk put on here in the 'what car should I get' guise. I am not going to give a list of premium brand cars that I can neither quite afford or have the potential to be an expensive mistake. I am no badge snob (I've had 2 Mazdas and a Ford and been happy with all), I just enjoy driving.

I am changing jobs in September and will need to carry kit (eg a van der Graaff in a box, crates of trundle wheels, balls, rulers, posters....the list is varied and long!) but no passengers really. The MX5 isn't up to the job of carrying much, and I also haven't decided if I am willing to do a long commute or move closer to the job yet, so a diesel may be on the list. My MX5 also isn't suitable for this size of commute; 25 miles one way was ok but this is 40-odd.

I'm 30, so insurance is on its way down but not low yet, and I don't want to pay more VED than I do now. I want some oomph from the car too, and the back seats have to fold down.

I've got a 57 plate MX5 with average mileage to p/x or sell, and a few thousand cash.If I can get a good finance deal on something newer/better then I will consider it, even though it's not a norm for me.

Suggest away! Reasons please - I spend a long time researching my cars, even down to tyre types and costs, so all info and detail helps!

Edited by Bobbin Threadbare on 26/05/2014 at 13:30

The impossible quest....! - FP

Forgive the impertinence, but does "changing jobs" mean "quitting teaching"?

On the other hand, your list of equipment to carry might indicate continued ped***gy. I always loved the very rare occasions at school when a van der Graaf generator was demonstrated, or even a Wimshurst machine.

Science was never my bag, but the experiments and demonstrations in physics and chemistry were great.

P.S. Something's upset the filter. Can't think what; perhaps I'm naive.

Edited by FP on 26/05/2014 at 13:53

The impossible quest....! - gordonbennet

You can't beat research, you could teach how to car buy Bobbin.

Normally i wouldn't suggest Diesel, but your new commute is ideal to take advantage of the better economy, but if you go Diesel half the service intervals.

You've enjoyed a lively car recently, so i think you should look for reasonably effortless torque of a larger (for its bodyshell) Diesel, which whilst requiring a different technique will give great pleasure too as well as startling economy.

I'd not suggest Ford Diesels (always disappointed me though others like them) and i'd suggest avoiding Mazda Diesels like the plague for well known reasons.

So for its engine Civic 2.2, or Auris (Avensis possible?) 2.0d or T180.

Again for its engine and maybe a better whilst fast load lugger Volvo V40/50 D5 manual...that would definately be one i would look at, effortless power from low revs and a pleasant soundtrack to boot.

I doubt you'd consider an auto anyway for any of the above, and i wouldn't suggest an auto in almost any FWD, but if you were tempted by say a Merc C Class coupe (3 door) 07 on which is an overlooked and good car, then you really want the auto box in it which are in a different league altogther from the usual FWD offerings, being proper TC autos....apart from anything else you would not enjoy MB's parking brake with a manual box, horrid.

Edited by gordonbennet on 26/05/2014 at 14:25

The impossible quest....! - Auristocrat

If you consider an Auris or Avensis diesel look for one made after September 2009 in the case of the Auris, or after February 2009 in the case of the Avensis, to avoid the head gasket issues associated with the 2.0 litre and 2.2 litre D4D engines.

If you're considering one produced earlier than these dates, check whether the engine has experienced head gasket or heavy oil consumption problems and whether the engine was replaced under Toyota's 7 year goodwill warranty for these engines. A Toyota dealer should be able to confirm whether the engine has been replaced.

The impossible quest....! - Avant

So, Bobbin, it needs to be capacious and fun. You'll have already thought about another Mazda 6, and you've followed the forum for long enough not to go for the 6 diesel. If you move and/or decide you don't need a diesel, then as well as the Mazda 6 you could consider the Octavia, Volvo V50 (good suggestion that by GB - I'd forgotten about it) or possibly Honda Civic, which people either love or loathe and is less roomy than the others.

I think you'll need one of these with a 1.8 or 2.0 engine: the 1.6s are competent without being exciting. The 1.4 TSI in the Octavia may be a bit recent depending on your budget but is quite lively. An Octavia vRS could suit you, although you'll need two sets of tyres as the standard fit tyres are no good in snow and ice.

If you go for a VAG diesel, you need the 1.9 or the faster 2.0 common-rail: avoid the 2.0 PD. The Octavia vRS diesel is good but not all that much quicker than the Elegance 2.0 TDI, and the Elegance (talking estates here) has a variable boot floor as standard, although some people (like me) specify it on the vRS. This makes quite a difference when lifting heavy things into the boot. I've never heard of a van Graaff - but it just sounds heavy....

The Ford 2.0 TDCI has a good reputation - faster and very little less economical than the 1.6. So assuming we're thinking of medium-sized estates here, and that the Mondeo and Passat are a bit too big, my short-list for you would be:

Skoda Octavia

Mazda 6

Volvo V50

Ford Focus

Have fun looking! Are you moving with the teaching profession?

FP - the filter is as you know a little over-sensitive, and I think its objection was to the word d-a-g-o which is in the middle of your elegant word for teaching.

Edit - I'd also forgotten the Avensis. If you follow Auristocrat's advice the Toyota 2.0 diesel is a good engine, and I've enjoyed test driving both an Auris and a Verso so equipped. A lot better to drive than the road testers would have you believe. The Verso has a low loading lip - maybe that's one to consider too.

Edited by Avant on 26/05/2014 at 14:59

The impossible quest....! - FP

"...its objection was to the word d-a-g-o..."

I am naive.

The impossible quest....! - Bobbin Threadbare

Thanks for the suggestions so far chaps!

I am still going to be a teacher, based in a school, but I have broadened my role somewhat and will need to visit other schools a lot.

Indeed no autos!

Edited by Bobbin Threadbare on 26/05/2014 at 17:57

The impossible quest....! - concrete

Hello Bobbin, glad to make contact again. You are just over the cusp of mileage to make diesel work for you. I am really very pleased with my Skoda Superb 1.9tdi PD130 and when it finally gives in I will go for an Octavia or maybe a Fabia estate.

Someone suggested halving the service intervals. All I can say is that covering about 25K miles per annum I was on the VAG extended service regime. This uses a long life special oil designed for this purpose. The computer used to flag up a service roughly every 18-19K miles. This is obviously more cost effective than a time based service regime. My car is used daily and mainly longish trips and being 8 years old with over 180K on the clock it goes well, used very little oil between services and returns an average of over 50mpg on decent runs and roads. Speaks for itself I think, but it has been looked after.

Good luck with your search, but do consider Skoda.

Cheers Concrete

The impossible quest....! - nortones2

I used to commute 40 miles, via M6 mostly, from rural peace (Ribble Valley) into Liverpool. Not pleasant. Unless your route is particularly bucolic, keep the MX5 and move closer!

The impossible quest....! - Bobbin Threadbare

I've done this before myself, border of Cumbria down to Warrington on the M6. I didn't enjoy it, and sticking to a petrol car and moving house may well be the best choice. I do need the extra space in the car though.

I am not averse to a slightly smaller car - I have been looking at the Mazda 3 and the HyundaI Veloster. I like the look of the Volvo C30 and V40 models, but I think they're out of budget.

Edited by Bobbin Threadbare on 26/05/2014 at 19:54

The impossible quest....! - 72 dudes

Bobbin, you may remember that I also had an MX5 of similar vintage to yours (although mine was a cherished weekend car), so I know you'll be giving up a lot of fun for a more sensible commuting vehicle.

Now, I have a Volvo S40 2.0D (which is for sale) and I can honestly say that for this type of vehicle, this is going to the best bet of all the ones suggested, but for what you are carrying you'll need the V50 which is the estate version.

Interior is lovely, very Swedish. Aviod the basic 'S' trim and go for SE or SE Lux, or R Design/Sport if you can live with the 18" wheels which do affect ride comfort.

The steering is meaty with proper feel, and the car flows through bends really well, but the ride is still supple over pitted surfaces. The car is an excellent M/way and A road cruiser too (6th gear @ 70 MPH = 1950 RPM), really quiet with little road or wind noise.

The 2.0D with 136 BHP is the one to go for, unless you can afford the later D3 or D4 versions. The D5 is grunty but economy suffers, whereas you will get 48 MPG all day in the 2.0D. VED is £180 (lower for the D3/D4 I think) so same ball park as MX5.

Avensis and Octavia are good cars but not in the same leaugue for driver enjoyment. Focus obviously handles similarly but without the quality feel of the Volvo.

Happy hunting!

The impossible quest....! - artill

How about a Honda CRZ? They are good to drive, if less quick than the shape suggests. Plenty of space for stuff when you fold down the useless back seats. Being a hybrid you should see 45 mpg or more, yet its still a fun, petrol powered manual. The earliest ones are 2010, so you will have to add some cash to the Mx5. The hybrid system is tried and tested being basically the same one they used from 1999 in the first Insight, and the rest is standard Honda, so little to worry about.

The impossible quest....! - daveyK_UK

A Skoda rapid with the 1.2 tsi petrol engine

Huge boot, will easily get 65 mpg on the motorway if not more, and you can pick them up on a 13 plate for under £9 grand.

Its an absolute bargain.

The impossible quest....! - scot22

The only personal knowledge I can add is do not buy a C30. It is a lovely car to drive etc but it is not practical. In Autocar in came 150th out of 150 for practicality. I've had one for three years. Much as it is a great car for many reasons, I am really looking forward to replacing it with something more practical.

When we bought it my wife was running an A class which we used for short runs, shoppng etc. Now only need one car so replacing C30.

The impossible quest....! - catsdad
Hi. I would add a vote for Civic. Pros are - chain cam, surprisingly powerful engine in 1.8 petrol (without recourse to a turbo) and I like the vtec performance, proper handbrake, good storage including magic seats (but beware quoted boot volume includes the spare wheel well so if you buy a spare it reduces the volume), sensible wheel/tyres for ride and cost, Honda Approved used offer good service packages. I like the styling but it is divisive. You have plenty of time to test your short list and decide for yourself. Some reviews are obsessed with supposed visibility issues when in fact in real life use neither me or my wife have any issues with rear or dash visibility despite our six inch height difference. For example there is no mirror blind spot at all - passing cars are in the wing mirror just as they leave the main mirror. Having set the steering wheel on the first day we got the car we can both see all of the instruments whichever of us is driving and never have had to adjust it again. And the reversing camera is pretty good too. Cons - petrol engine revs are a bit high for cruising (3000rpm at 70), not unduly noisy mind but higher gear would help economy, trip computer is limited to either average mpg or miles to empty (you can't toggle between these on the move), DAB not standard on most models, if you don't want to use stop-start you need to disable it each time you do a turn key start, rear passenger headroom is limited.
The impossible quest....! - Bobbin Threadbare

Sorry DaveyK I absolutely cannot bring myself to get a Skoda Rapid!

I know I am sacrificing a lot of driving enjoyment by giving up my MX5 and I really don't want to. I don't need an estate car; I will have access to a van if I need to take an enormous amount of stuff.

I want the power and as much response as I can get I suppose. I haven't ventured to look at VW, Audi or BMWs, or Alfas. My kind of car is the GT86 hahaha!

The impossible quest....! - daveyK_UK

The rapid has a few things over its rivals (mainly thanks to its VW bits) and its very compeititve pricing,

but there is nothing in its class that can get close to the Rapid on boot space (other than the identical seat toledo).

Please name a similar sized and price hatchback that even comes within 100 litres of boot space to the rapid?

The boot for the size of car is enormous and suprisingly, there is no compromise on rear leg room, its actually generous and better than most of its rivals.

I was convinced we where going to replace the Nissan Note pool car with another Note or a Dacia Logan MCV, but after having a Skoda Rapid on hire, all the staff simply love the space, like how it drives and most importantly for me the fuel economy from the petrol engine.

Edited by daveyK_UK on 27/05/2014 at 22:12

The impossible quest....! - corax

I want the power and as much response as I can get I suppose. I haven't ventured to look at VW, Audi or BMWs, or Alfas. My kind of car is the GT86 hahaha!

If you want the power, how about a slightly older Subaru Impreza Wrx estate? That will leave you more for fuel and insurance, although they're not too bad at around 28 average.

Reliable tough cars if fully serviced, and great to drive.

The impossible quest....! - Sprice

I have a Civic too, new shape on a 63 plate. Great comfy car, I have the 1.6 DTEC diesel and it's plenty quick enough for me (120 PS, 300 Nm torque) and it averages about 65 mpg (brim to brim calculations). I'm not sure if 'catsdad' has this type or the older 8th gen version as I can toggle between the different settings of the trip computer on the move, unless they've made this improvement since its launch in 2012

I agree about the supposed poor rear visibility, not an issue whatsoever, in fact the spoiler helps block headlights at night! Again, all the magazines stated that the instruments reflected on the screen in the dark, not noticed it myself.

Cruises at 70 MPH at 2000 rpm. The boot space is very good, esp with seats folded, but there's no spare wheel option, it's gunk and a compressor. The 2014-on models have supposed better handling but probably a slightly harder ride.

The impossible quest....! - Bobbin Threadbare

How about a Honda CRZ? They are good to drive, if less quick than the shape suggests. Plenty of space for stuff when you fold down the useless back seats. Being a hybrid you should see 45 mpg or more, yet its still a fun, petrol powered manual. The earliest ones are 2010, so you will have to add some cash to the Mx5. The hybrid system is tried and tested being basically the same one they used from 1999 in the first Insight, and the rest is standard Honda, so little to worry about.

I am test driving a CRZ on Friday - they are that rare combo of hybrid and manual gearbox!

The impossible quest....! - Dabooka

Have you considered an Alfa Giulietta?

Good diesels with plenty of poke and economy, several to choose from too. Good looking and tidy handling too, at least in my humble opinion. Should be capacious enough for your bits and bobs. Good deals too, and can be had at a reasonable prices too.

I know there not everyone's cup of tea mind, I grant you that!

Dabooka

The impossible quest....! - Avant

Sorry Bobbin - by the sound of that van Graaff I thought you needed an estate. If you don't need anything as big as an Octavia vRS, you could look at a similarly-engined Golf GTI (you need the Mark 5 and onwards: the Mark 4 wasn't very fast). Or a hot Ford Focus ST (although the previous version had a 5-cylinder 2.5 engine which is fast but thirsty).

You may find a Golf 2.0 TDI or a Focus 2.0 TDCI fast enough - both go very well and have lots of torque as well as acceleration. The VW Group 1.4 TSI petrol is lively and economical - avoid the dual-charge 160 bhp version wich has been troublesome.

BMW 3-series? Might be tempting but quite expensive, and a full service history is even more essential than usual.

Edited by Avant on 29/05/2014 at 00:30

The impossible quest....! - Bobbin Threadbare

I have had a look at the Giulietta - just don't know enough about their long term performance really. I do like the looks of them.

I spent quite a bit of time on Autotrader today looking at Focus STs but I don't think fuel economy is remotely considered!

The impossible quest....! - Happy Blue!

If it was eight years ago i would have suggested a Subaru Forester Turbo. Space and pace!

The impossible quest....! - corax

Too much choice. It's a pain looking for a new car. If your job involves driving different cars, it must be easier.

The impossible quest....! - Trilogy

Bobbin, how about a Seat Leon? A friend has had three and rates them highly.

The impossible quest....! - Bobbin Threadbare

The Seat Leon has been looked at - I'm not sure I don't find them overpriced though; I can't see what it's got for the money compared to some other cars. I do like the look of it and on paper the performance looks good.

The impossible quest....! - Bobbin Threadbare

Ok, research has netted me this, thus far:

Volvos - lovely but out; I just can't afford the one I want, basically.

Audi - no but a look at the A4 Avant did lead me to a SEAT Exeo estate which I rather liked.

BMW - no chuffing way. I like to drive in a 'lively' manner and I would be mortified to turn into one of those dreadful BMW drivers. Besides, the lack of indicators is a concern....

SEAT - like the FR models of the Leon and the Ibiza; this is a surprise for me!

Alfa - can't afford the Giulietta, alas.

Skoda - I really like the Superb!

Merc - I had a peek at the E class and the C class, but they'd be poverty spec and I could get a Focus with every bell, whistle and leather for the price!

Honda - looking at the Civic and the CRZ (testing CRZ too). I've always liked the Civic and I nearly went for one instead of the MX5.

VW - no, unless someone gives me a load of money so I can buy a Scirocco!

Finally, one which hasn't been mentioned - the Saab 9-3. I've fallen in love with them a bit.

No French cars and no Nissans which are French in disguise. Ugh.

The impossible quest....! - daveyK_UK

Correction - Nissan's are not french cars in disguise, the main parts nissan/renault share is the diesel engines.

And there has rarely been a problem with a Renault engine, infact its one of the few things Renault are good at.

The impossible quest....! - focussed

And there has rarely been a problem with a Renault engine, infact its one of the few things Renault are good at.

What? I nearly swallowed my coffee mug when I read that! Where have you been for the last 10 years, living on a desert island?

The few things that Renault are good at does not include engines.

The impossible quest....! - Avant

Renault petrol engines are pretty good. I had seven big Renaults between 1980 and 2001 and all were reliable over high mileages, three of them six-figure. None ever used a drop of oil.

Most of the major problems we hear about are with Renault diesels: I suspect even here it may be the electronics that fail rather than the engines themselves.

Thinking of Saabs, Bobbin, they used to be great cars before GM got its paws on them. I found the 9.3 diesel very disappointing on a 24-hour test drive. And who knows for how long parts will be available.

If you like the Skoda Superb, try an Octavia as well.

The impossible quest....! - Happy Blue!

Skoda Yeti has a good reputation. Lots of 'ladies who lunch' near us have them surprisingly. They ditched their fancy cars when they started to lug golf clubs and grandchildren around.

The impossible quest....! - SteveLee

Renault engines - petrol or diesel - are generally a lot less troublesome than those from the VAG stable.

The cars themselves may suffer from niggly electrical issues - but mechanically they are reliable.

The impossible quest....! - Bobbin Threadbare

I find Peugeots pug-ugly you might say. Several Clios in the family have put me off Renaults. Citroen is an unknown to me.

Honda and Skoda are winning at the mo.

Edited by Bobbin Threadbare on 30/05/2014 at 12:17

The impossible quest....! - SteveLee

Hondas are boring but reliable. Škodas seem to be well screwed together with one generation old running gear which have largely been debugged of the usual VAG design c***ups - I'd trust one over a "cutting edge" VW or Audi. All that said I'd probably buy Korean - Kia and Hyundai have upped their games with styling and interiors - so you get a European(ish) looking cars with Japanese(ish) reliability.

The impossible quest....! - Bobbin Threadbare

Well we can end the quest....I said it was impossible and it isn't! I am now the proud owner of a 2.5 year old Honda CRZ which I pick up next week. Enjoyed the test drive, it fulfils my mpg requirements, and it goes like the clappers when you want it to. Good boot space. Insurance is fair and VED is very low indeed!

I do fit in a strange motoring category really; no passengers or pets or children and a dislike of small hatchbacks, so I am glad to be able to go for something off the wall like the CRZ.

I got a decent part ex on my MX-5, which will be sorely missed, but I expect that in 2 years' time I will be looking again, as I usually do, and I would go back to Mazda in a heartbeat for another MX-5.

Thanks for all suggestions and thoughts!

The impossible quest....! - Trilogy

Good to see you've gone for something different. Next time I see one in the north west I'll know it is you behind the wheel. IMO, as rare as hen's teeth.

The impossible quest....! - SteveLee

Blimey - you bought THE interesting Honda! Looking forward to the first owner's report.

The impossible quest....! - nortones2

What, apart from the Type R Civic, Mugen Civic, Honda Legend, NSX and S2000?

The impossible quest....! - corax

Thanks for all suggestions and thoughts!

I don't think you needed any. You seem to know your own mind :)

It would be nice to hear your experiences though, it's always useful for other people.

The impossible quest....! - Bobbin Threadbare

Thanks for all suggestions and thoughts!

I don't think you needed any. You seem to know your own mind :)

It would be nice to hear your experiences though, it's always useful for other people.

Of course! I will certainly write up the first week of ownership and follow it up later on.

The impossible quest....! - Avant

Well done Bobbin. I'd no idea that the CR-Z had the boot space that you need. Looking forward to hearing how you get on with it.

It sounds a lot more fun than the various other suggestions that we came up with - and therefore suits you I suspect!

The impossible quest....! - Cyd

The trouble with threads like this is that you'll just end up with a list of all cars available on the market! And everyone will simply recommend whatever they happen to drive!

I have a Saab 9-3 Aero. I've written about it before:

www.honestjohn.co.uk/forum/post/index.htm?t=99578

As you say you like a lively drive and enjoy driving, I'd seriously suggest you give one a try. Could also be your last opportunity to have one.

They are hardly sluggards to start with, but the Maptun tune really gives it some pep! 40-80 ttg in just 5.9s and pushing 220 atw on Shell V Power!!

Since I wrote that piece, I've suffered broken road springs, so have fitted a set of Maptun lowering springs. They are stiffer, but not too stiff. Improved handling, yet still comfortable. Slightly crashy on really rough stuff, but you'd expect some of that with any sport saloon.

Also since that piece I've replaced the stock Sport Contacts with Goodyear Eagle F1 Ass2. Much better comfort, loads quieter and superior wet grip (especially under power - the traction control cuts in a lot less in the wet now).

I now also do a 45 mile each way commute round the M6/M42. Driven with a light foot at about 66-68 I get an average of 40 -42mpg on standard branded unleaded (some days a little more). I sometimes have to go to Oxford from Redditch on the M40 - using cruise at 63mph it is pushing 46-48mpg.

Of course, if you hoof it about the economy suffers. I typically get about 32 driving round the lanes normally (we live in rural SW Leicestershire). Hoofing it can drop that further.

Very nice to drive, comfortable and quiet. Affordable. Extremely safe. What's not to like.

As an asside, I'm considering converting mine to lpg. There's a company near work that has done one recently. With the reduced fuel price and taking into account the 20% economy reduction on gas, it should return a "petrol equivalent" of about 75mpg on the commute. I reckon it's makes more economic sense than choping out for a diesel (and anyway I hate diesel and love the car I've got). And the company can fit a manual fuel selection switch for those occasions when every last mousepower is needed! Which is also good as I'm planning for a bit more power (looking to get to about 300).

You haven't actually said if economy is important - if I were buying now I'd go for a V6 with XWD (4WD). Quite rare. Couldn't afford one of those when I was buying mine.

Go on, give one a try. I defy you not to smile!

The impossible quest....! - Bobbin Threadbare

You haven't actually said if economy is important - if I were buying now I'd go for a V6 with XWD (4WD). Quite rare. Couldn't afford one of those when I was buying mine.

Go on, give one a try. I defy you not to smile!

Yes I looked at those! Very nice but I'll give my CRZ a go!