fan of the BMW i3? - ellis123

I'm usually quite skeptical when it comes to electric cars, I've never been a fan of them. However this new BMW i3 seems to be getting some really good press, as well as changing many people's perceptions about electric cars.

(Edit - link deleted as this poster's E-mail address is the same as a dealer named in the link, and thus it looks like an attempt at free advertising.)

The only thing that's putting me off purchasing it is the price tag of around £25-£30k, but would anyone think that it warrants that price?

(EDIT: I've just seen that it's been nominated for "car of the year", surely a good sign?: http://www.stokesentinel.co.uk/Telsa-S-BMW-i3-electric-cars-shortlisted-2014-Car/story-20394966-detail/story.html)

Edited by Avant on 04/01/2014 at 11:40

fan of the BMW i3? - SteveLee
(EDIT: I've just seen that it's been nominated for "car of the year", surely a good sign?: http://www.stokesentinel.co.uk/Telsa-S-BMW-i3-electric-cars-shortlisted-2014-Car/story-20394966-detail/story.html)

Joining such motoring heavyweights as the Chrysler Horizon, Lancia Delta, Fiat Tipo and Fiat Punto.

fan of the BMW i3? - daveyjp
I wonder what position the OP holds at a BMW dealership? Cut out the nonsense sales bull about looks, huge wheels etc and the review tells you absolutely nothing.
fan of the BMW i3? - SteveLee

I bet it'll have your fillings out over the bumps in typical BMW style. Apparently "sporty" means having your spine slamed through your skull.

fan of the BMW i3? - Cluedo

All the recent reviews of BMWs I have seen are suggesting they are going soft and certainly do not have hard rides - I think Audi have that covered. Certainly if you buy a car with the adaptive suspension systems they have some very comfortable rides.

As for the i3 I think it is also reviewed as having a reasonably comfortable ride and would think that a number of faults could be picked with it but for a carbon chassis and the build quality and lengths BMW have gone to in terms of sustainability then I think they should be applauded and suggest many other manufcaturers will be following in their footseps in the not too distant future.

I also saw one in the metal (or should I say Carbon Fibre) at a local dealer the other day and the build quality is very impressive - it looks bigger than I thought it would be as well.

Edited by Cluedo on 03/01/2014 at 18:07

fan of the BMW i3? - i3 Driver

I was surprised how few posts there were on the i3, for such an innovative vehicle. I was initially skeptical but after trialing the upgraded 96aHRX for three days was blown away by the smooth power delivery, ease of use around town and how well it coped with longer journeys. These vehicles now all come with the DC rapid charge facility which for longer journeys is essential, allwing for a 20min recharge at motorway services. So I bought one... 2 months in and 4000 miles later I have not used any petrol at all and am delighted wuth the vehicle and it is saving me £200 a month on diesel

fan of the BMW i3? - SLO76
Have to say I rather like them too but battery lifespan is the killer with electric cars. Depreciation is horrific as the cost of battery renewal is colossal. The Nissan Leaf for example is currently one of the worst depreciating cars on the market despite being a very pleasant thing in every way.

Batteries have a realistic lifespan of 6-8yrs so who will spend a lot of money buying a 4-5yr old car knowing there's a £6-7k bill looming to replace the power pack?

The cost will fall as volumes increase but manufacturers need to stop seeing vital replacement components like this as a cash generator and instead offer them at subsidised prices to reduce buyer anxiety and help ease the current poor to terrible depreciation levels on electric and hybrid cars which more than eliminate any fuel savings owners are making. Currently leasing is the only was to go electric but these costs will rise sharply if they can't get a functional used market operating.
fan of the BMW i3? - Fishermans Bend

A friend who leases one always carries a lanmower fuel can full of petrol as back up.

fan of the BMW i3? - Wackyracer

After watching James May driving his own i3 on the grand tour, I can say I'm not convinced it's the way to go unless you do all your driving over short distances with enough time stopped to recharge inbetween.

I'd rather buy a Toyota hybrid.

fan of the BMW i3? - skidpan

"A friend who leases one always carries a lanmower fuel can full of petrol as back up."

Where is the logic in that.

If its only electric the petrol could only be used to set it on fire when you ran out of electricery

And

If its a hybrid it will have a petrol tank where you can store petrol.

fan of the BMW i3? - Fishermans Bend

"A friend who leases one always carries a lanmower fuel can full of petrol as back up."

Where is the logic in that.

If its only electric the petrol could only be used to set it on fire when you ran out of electricery

And

If its a hybrid it will have a petrol tank where you can store petrol.

Of course it isn't only electric! It's if he runs out of petrol. The tank only holds two gallons, SIB.

fan of the BMW i3? - mss1tw

Of course it isn't only electric! It's if he runs out of petrol. The tank only holds two gallons, SIB.

They could fit an even bigger fuel tank if they got rid of the batteries and that electric motor malarky.

;D

fan of the BMW i3? - P3t3r

I'm curious, what are people's perceptions of electric cars?

The biggest problems I see are the relatively short range, lack of public charging points and high cost. Even though there are many good things about the i3, I don't think the i3 solves any of these (or at least not completely).

fan of the BMW i3? - RobJP

First time I've seen this thread, I must have missed it the first time around.

When I just read that the fuel tank on the i3 is only 2 gallons, I thought "that must be wrong", so went ad checked.

It's correct. My flabber is gasted.

If you want to drive locally, and only locally, and you have a charging point available, then they make lots of sense - I know someone with a Prius hybrid who lives a couple of miles from me, her commute is 4 miles each way, she hardly ever goes further than Chester (25 miles away), and she puts the car on charge in her garage every evening.

She's told me she filled it up with petrol soon after getting it, and it was a year before she filled it up again (whether that is any good for fuel tank/pipework longevity is another matter, I suppose)

For her though, even if she wants to go on a long trip, it's not a problem, she just runs on the engine part of the hybrid.

For the i3, with it's tiny tank, and the other 'pure' electric cars, range is the biggest issue - not being able to find an available charging point (say on a bank holiday weekend) could well lead you to be stranded.

Whilst technically the same is true if a fuel station was closed, the station isnot likely to run out of fuel, and people don't take up a pump for hours on end to fill up.

When an EV can do a REAL 400 mile trip in one day, I'll consider one. Until then, they're a useless gimmick to me.

fan of the BMW i3? - skidpan

I know someone with a Prius hybrid who lives a couple of miles from me, her commute is 4 miles each way, she hardly ever goes further than Chester (25 miles away), and she puts the car on charge in her garage every evening.

Didn't know the Prius was plug in. Always thought it was one of those pointless hybrids with a duracell in the boot. The Auris hybrid we had at work was a waste of space. All noise and no performance and if you drove normally on a long trip my Leon TSI did better mpg figures.

fan of the BMW i3? - mss1tw

Didn't know the Prius was plug in. Always thought it was one of those pointless hybrids with a duracell in the boot. The Auris hybrid we had at work was a waste of space. All noise and no performance and if you drove normally on a long trip my Leon TSI did better mpg figures.

Someone (Probably on here now I think of it) pointed out that on anything like a motorway a hybrid is basically a petrol car lugging along ??? kilos of batteries and electric motors

fan of the BMW i3? - sandy56

For short commutes and city use electric cars are OK. I like the i3 and now I am retired I could run one. Its expensive and battery life is a concern. According to a US BMW site they lose about 5-7% battery capacity a year,depending on use. As a solution BMW will sell you new battery packs which can be sold in batches, you dont need to buy a complete new battery assembly. I havent heard about that option over here, until I do, I will keep away.

fan of the BMW i3? - Sofa Spud

For short commutes and city use electric cars are OK. I like the i3 and now I am retired I could run one. Its expensive and battery life is a concern. According to a US BMW site they lose about 5-7% battery capacity a year,depending on use. As a solution BMW will sell you new battery packs which can be sold in batches, you dont need to buy a complete new battery assembly. I havent heard about that option over here, until I do, I will keep away.

A survey of high mileage Tesla Model S cars concludes that they lose 2.3 miles of range for every 100,000 miles travelled. Interestingly this drop is the same whichever battery the car is equipped with.

www.teslacentral.com/worried-about-tesla-battery-d...n

So if your early Model S has a quoted range of 265 miles per charge, which for argument's sake might be a real-world figure of 250 miles, then after 100,000 miles its range might be 247.7 miles. After 200K miles it might have dropped to 245.4.

If the Tesla battery really only loses less than 1% of its range every 100K miles and the BMW i3 battery really loses 5-7% each year (maybe 15,000 miles), then BMW's battery technology must be somewhat deficient!

Edited by Sofa Spud on 28/02/2017 at 17:12

fan of the BMW i3? - RobJP

2.3 for every 10,000 miles driven, not 100k.

As the article also points out, there did seem to be quite a variance in those figures. The smallest loss was 0.16 per 10k, the largest was 5.1

But it's a very small sample size, only 50 cars.

fan of the BMW i3? - Engineer Andy

Seems to be a combination of journey type, driving style, when you use the car and where its stored (how you use the car/batteries) and a possible variability in the performance/specs of the batteries themselves, not so different from using household batteries. Some of mine have easily been refreshed back to their maximum and don't lose much charge sitting around in between uses, other seemingly identical sets are lucky to be able to take 50% of their charge (even after refreshing them in a decent charger) and self-discharge quickly, despite being used in similar ways.

Looks like battery technology has some way still to go, despite recent improvements. I suspect many people are still put off by the relatively short range, long (relative to the time they have [especially on long trips or when on work trips when they need to drive from one meeting to another in one day]) charging time and a lack of charging facilities about. Anyone living in a flat (unless its brand new and very up-market), working to tight schedules or needing the use of car at short notice just can't consider an electric car, even if they live in a built-up area.

To make them viable, facilities for every new home (or parking space in flat blocks), business premises car parks would need to be provided as standard, something developers and councils won't do because it is way too costly for the infrastructure and won't be a selling point or pay back the investment for decades. We really need to miniturise battery technology (i.e. make their energy density far higher) hugely so that they can be 'hot-swapped' when you arrive at your destination with another with you/at home so its immediately ready to go out straight away, and have a range comporable to fossil-fueled cars. That seems some way away to me.

fan of the BMW i3? - daveyjp
A local authority near me have a condition that all new houses have to have an electric car charging point. Its only a three pin socket close to the car parking area.
fan of the BMW i3? - RobJP
A local authority near me have a condition that all new houses have to have an electric car charging point. Its only a three pin socket close to the car parking area.

It's national policy these days. I believe it came in for new housing in late 2012.

As you say, it only involves putting a normal socket either inside the garage (close to the door) or a fully waterproofed socket outside.

fan of the BMW i3? - i3 Driver

Thought I would add another post, having owned the vehicle for 12mths my i3 continues to perform faultlessly. I have done 18000 miles in a year and now purchased 36litres of fuel, 9 of which are still in the fuel tank.

The car is running to spec and in the winter months I precondition the car battery to find an indicated 100-110 electric miles though in coastal south west we are warm compared to much of the UK, setting the heating as part of the preconditioning means all the windows are frost clear and the vehicle a cosy 22delcius which on frosty mornings is great.

I have done a few longer runs (200miles) and the public charging network is just about ok, the range extender however saved me on one trip when the rapid charger had failed, a quick fill with fuel and away we went, else we would have been on the back of a recovery vehicle!

I have also suffered two punctures, there is a puncture repair kit but one resulted in a 1inch cut to the wall luckily only 100yrds from home, the other was a slow leak. There is NO spare and tyres are NOT runflats.

The ride is on the firmish side, typical BMW and I would not advise purchase of the bigger rims, handling in town is superb and on faster B roads this is a quick car.

I have been delighted with this car, though expensive to purchase I have saved £2500 in fuel spending about £330 on electricity, with zero road tax. The battery warranty is 8 years 100,000 miles so assuming all goes well one might expect to save £12500 in fuel over 5 years more than enough to replace the battery, which TBH I think will still be ok looking at current rates of degradation, with these savings the depreciation is small beer.

Yes battery tech will move on but for those of us doing less than 100mile or so a day this car is fine...it is also incredibkly quiet at 70 on good surfaces....do try one...

fan of the BMW i3? - kiss (keep it simple)

Here's my take on what is needed to get electric car sales moving.

1. They make an ideal second car, such as for short commutes, shopping, dropping kids off etc. So we need cheaper models without all the bells and whistles.

2 Manufacturers need to standardise on a single design of easily removable battery pack. There will then be an incentive for garages to hold stock in more remote areas ready for a quick swap. Bigger cars just need maybe 2 or 3 packs, but could still run on one if necessary.

3. They need to be reliable. Too much reliance on fancy apps gives scope for problems.

fan of the BMW i3? - Sofa Spud

The thing that puts me off the BMW i3 is its odd styling.

Compare it with the Tesla Model 3's clean, graceful lines that must be a big selling point alongside its technology.

A 200 mile range is now the benchmark for electric cars although not all models meet it. The Chevrolet Bolt, the long-range version of the Renault Zoe and, of course, all Tesla cars exceed the magic 200. Before long the benchmark will move to 300 miles, which would cover most peoples' motoring needs

Edited by Sofa Spud on 22/12/2017 at 15:45

fan of the BMW i3? - madf

with the Tesla Model 3's clean, graceful lines that must be a big selling point alongside its technology.

A 200 mile range is now the benchmark for electric cars although not all models meet it. The Chevrolet Bolt, the long-range version of the Renault Zoe and, of course, all Tesla cars exceed the magic 200. Before long the benchmark will move to 300 miles, which would cover most peoples' motoring needs

In winter very few meet it. Or are you talking unrealstic makers' numbers which no-one achives are are meaningless?

fan of the BMW i3? - SteveLee

I know someone with a Prius hybrid who lives a couple of miles from me, her commute is 4 miles each way, she hardly ever goes further than Chester (25 miles away), and she puts the car on charge in her garage every evening.

She's told me she filled it up with petrol soon after getting it, and it was a year before she filled it up again (whether that is any good for fuel tank/pipework longevity is another matter, I suppose)

For her though, even if she wants to go on a long trip, it's not a problem, she just runs on the engine part of the hybrid.

Unleaded fuel starts to go off quite badly after six months, running a range extender model without actually using the internal combustion motor is asking for trouble.

fan of the BMW i3? - corax
Unleaded fuel starts to go off quite badly after six months, running a range extender model without actually using the internal combustion motor is asking for trouble.

The answer would be to add a fuel preservative, similar to one that that lawnmowers use to keep fuel fresh over winter, these also stop the ethanol in modern fuel attacking pipes e.t.c. although I would presume that modern vehicles fuel systems are made of materials that resist the effects of ethanol.

 

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