Lexus 200D versus Lexus CT200h - Is it worth buying a hybrid | Motoring discussion | Back Room Forum

Tue 16 Apr 2013 12:40

Lexus 200D versus Lexus CT200h - Is it worth buying a hybrid - Richard Burfitt

We live in a rural area and have 2 cars : a 1L Yaris for short journeys and a 6 year old Lexus 200D for longer journeys. We get ~46mpg from the Lexus (on the meter).

I am thinking of changing the Lexus for a CT200h but I'm not sure that this will give me any fuel savings. Our journey split is, roughly, as follows:-

0-5 mile None

5-10 miles 12 journeys pa x 7.5 miles average = 90 miles

10-15 miles 24 x 12.5 = 300 miles

15-25 miles 48 x 20 = 960 miles

25-50 miles 48 x 37.5 = 1800 miles

50-100 miles 24 x 75 = 1800 miles

100-200 miles 18 x 150 = 2700 miles

200-300 miles 8 x 250 = 2000 miles

Total 9650 mile pa

I think that, because most of the journeys we do with this car are generally quite long, then I wont get the same fuel saving that I would with short journeys in an urban area.

Please advise.

regards

Richard Burfitt

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Tue 16 Apr 2013 12:47

Lexus 200D versus Lexus CT200h - Is it worth buying a hybrid - madf

On rural roads, a CTH is likely to be very uncomfortable.

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Tue 16 Apr 2013 13:01

Lexus 200D versus Lexus CT200h - Is it worth buying a hybrid - TeeCee

I think that, because most of the journeys we do with this car are generally quite long, then I wont get the same fuel saving that I would with short journeys in an urban area.

I think you'd be right! The Toyota HSD equipped cars can give startling economy figures around town, but are not that impressive "on a run".

I reckon that I can easily wring in excess of 60mpg out of the fleet Prius around town in traffic but the overall average I get is a shade over 50, as I do more motorway journeys with the "lead welly" on.

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Wed 17 Apr 2013 10:44

Lexus 200D versus Lexus CT200h - Is it worth buying a hybrid - puckdrop

Well, assuming your 200D is diesel, and taking minimum prices for fue from petrolprices.com today l, and assuming you'd average 58mpg from the 200h, your current fuel bill would be around £1,303 and the 200h would be £996

So £300 per year fuel saving.. I would suggest your reason for change ought to be a little more than "cutting the cost of fuel". (even if you were to average 70mpg - very unlikely, your fuel bill would still only drop to £825 per year ).

Personally, I went from an R reg diesel vectra to a 57 Prius (1.5 HSD rather than 1.8 in the new ones and 200h ) it already had 90k on the clock, and don't regret a single moment.

I've gone from average 45mpg to averaging 60mpg in my mix 70/30 non-dual/dual carriageway type roads.

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Mon 29 Apr 2013 23:21

Lexus 200D versus Lexus CT200h - Is it worth buying a hybrid - clip

if you like some power from the throttle pedal, i'd stick with a diesel

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Mon 29 Apr 2013 23:51

Lexus 200D versus Lexus CT200h - Is it worth buying a hybrid - Avant

Have a look at the road tests of the CT200h, in particular HJ's test under 'reviews' on this site. It's not just a matter of economy - you need to be sure you would enjoy driving it.

In general, hybrids give of their best in town. On long journeys you're better off with a good diesel if your mileage is over about 15,000 a year, or a good petrol if it isn't. I do about 12,000 a year and my petrol Octavia vRS will give 38 mpg on a motorway run.

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Thu 2 May 2013 13:25

Lexus 200D versus Lexus CT200h - Is it worth buying a hybrid - Ed V

There's an interesting video link on the Telegraph site - Honest John and Andrew English talking cars for 30 minutes. They say the early hybrids are bullet-proof as they were so over-engineered, and have very few parts that go wrong. Honda Insight particularly so.

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Thu 2 May 2013 13:48

Lexus 200D versus Lexus CT200h - Is it worth buying a hybrid - TeeCee

Hmm, one of my colleagues has the Honda Civic hybrid, which shares its drivetrain with the Insight. He found the pitfall.

It lost the Hybrid drive entirely. When the Honda garage plugged in the diagnostics, it returned that the Hybrid system and the battery had gone up the spout. They changed both at phenomenal cost (fleet car, like he cares). Once they'd done the work, they were rather surprised to find that it still didn't work and even more so when they plugged the diagnostics in and it reported that the Hybrid system and battery were toast(!)

Further investigation revealed a cable from the ECU to the Hybrid drive had chafed through due to poor routing around the engine bay. As the ECU could not get a response from the Hybrid/battery system to its diagnostic enquiries, it reported them as faulty.

Actual fix: One 25EUR cable and 30 minutes to fit. Wasted effort attempting to fix the problem: Several grand in parts and three days in labour.......oops.

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Thu 2 May 2013 14:15

Lexus 200D versus Lexus CT200h - Is it worth buying a hybrid - Collos25

Insight and Civic have a different drivetrain to each other and different batteries due the formentioned fault with the Civic drivetrain.The chaffed cables was an also but not the main culprit.

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Thu 2 May 2013 14:37

Lexus 200D versus Lexus CT200h - Is it worth buying a hybrid - Ethan Edwards

It's generally accepted that the Honda Hybrid isn''t as good as the Toyota version.

Jazz hybrid or Yaris Hybrid...I plumped for the Yaris.

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Thu 2 May 2013 20:03

Lexus 200D versus Lexus CT200h - Is it worth buying a hybrid - colinh

Have an Auris HSD and live in a rural area. If I keep away from motorways mid-60s mpg is easily obtainable without using any special techniques. However when I do long motorway journeys across Spain (using cruise control at 90% of speed limit) consumption drops to low 50s. Approx. 2/3rds of my annual mileage is motorways, and my fuelly.com stats are showing 54.5 mpg overall.

Why I chose hybrid - don't like diesel - like automatics - my region of Spain gave a subsidy which covered the hybrid price premium. So I was getting a petrol automatic which was giving better consumption than previous diesel automatic, and at a lower cost.

Edited by colinh on 02/05/2013 at 20:05

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Fri 3 May 2013 00:46

Lexus 200D versus Lexus CT200h - Is it worth buying a hybrid - Avant

Impressive figures, Colin. I had a good long test drive in a Prius a few years ago and was impressed with it. The only major concern I had was that when you wanted to give it a bit of welly, the combination of engine and CVT made a loud frenetic noise as one accelerated.

Is it less of an issue with the Auris HSD or have you learned to live with it?

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Fri 3 May 2013 08:56

Lexus 200D versus Lexus CT200h - Is it worth buying a hybrid - colinh

Given the Auris is using the same drive-train as the Prius, I guess it'sd going to be the same. Most noticeable on long climbs when the natural instinct is to expect a conventional auto gearbox to drop down a gear, whereas the "CVT" given keep up the same note.

P.S. I don't think hybrid drivers do "welly" ;<)

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Fri 3 May 2013 09:36

Lexus 200D versus Lexus CT200h - Is it worth buying a hybrid - TeeCee

I found I got used to that quite quickly with the fleet Prius.

As you said, only happens when the thing's on full chat anyway. More disconcerting is the behaviour of the Atkinson Cycle engine, which only runs well at specific points on the rev band. The electronics "know" this and fiddle the power bias in the epicylic transmission to swap the thing between its most efficient points almost instantly. The effect is that it sounds for all the world like it's changing up and down a conventional multiratio gearbox, even though it isn't.

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Fri 3 May 2013 10:13

Lexus 200D versus Lexus CT200h - Is it worth buying a hybrid - unthrottled

More disconcerting is the behaviour of the Atkinson Cycle engine, which only runs well at specific points on the rev band.

It's just an ordinary engine with the camshaft events retarded! Accoustics aside, where's the problem? The electric propulsion unit mated to the CVT mean that low end torque is a non issue, no?

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Fri 3 May 2013 12:38

Lexus 200D versus Lexus CT200h - Is it worth buying a hybrid - JOGON

Company Car = yes

Private buy = no

We've a company Prius, our second and it is superb. Quiet smooth, little / no car tax and 51mpg mainly motorway. Good size family motor + lots of under boot storage.

To buy privately wouldn't stack up.

The lexus is nice but to my eye looks v expensive. And small. Sooner go for hybrid (new) Auris which looks same size.

But then again I'd go for the Prius.

[Edit]

Forgot to mention that if needed Prius has a 'power mode' button - this throws all the 1.8 engine + circa 1L battery and it really goes.

There's also an eco mode where everything is toned down.

Edited by JOGON on 03/05/2013 at 12:41

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Tue 11 Jun 2013 21:45

Lexus 200D versus Lexus CT200h - Is it worth buying a hybrid - clip

fuel consumption on CT200 on a long motorway run at a steady 70mph was 46mpg, same journey in a much larger audi diesel was nearer 60mpg.

round town the mpg is even worse 44mpg. the audi was early to mid 50s.

cant think of any reason to but a CT200 unless its a company car, the car is slow, boring, expensive, noisey albeit nicely put together with loads of gadgets.

ours won't be replaced - back to bmw or audi and in our experience good, pleasant and helpful dealers, not something I would say about the supplying lexus dealer of our car.

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