"You've a strong budget and if you want to stick to petrol you could buy a very nice Golf GTi"
Funnily enough this was the first car we tested, as we have happy memories of a Mk2 GTi, one of our two favourite cars we have owned ( the other being a petrol Range Rover, hugely expensive to run but a lovely ride) but although I liked it my wife was less keen. Golfs are on the list still, perhaps a less sporty spec, although I did notice the 1.4 TSi is 150 hp ( or PS or whatever it is now called) which I'm sure the Mk2 GTi was. The Ateca is also available with a 1.4, although we tested the 1litre, which despite sounding on paper very underpowered was actually great to drive. The Tiguan is also available with a 1.4 TSi engine and is probably high on the possibles list, as my wife is keen on the SUV ride height. We have also had very good experience with out local VW dealer, and as customer service is important to us that does go in the Tiguan / Golf's favour. It is also a reson we ruled out the Quashqai, which does come in a petrol version but our experience of trying to deal with the sales staff at our local Nissan dealer put us right off. We did set out with the idea of buying new, and spending more than the 20k if necessary, but the inital depreciation on a new car has put us off a bit, and a 2 year old car seems a good compromise but does rule out the Alteca, which has only just launched.
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If BMW is on your list consider the 3 series GT - hatchback with a longer wheelbase than the 3 series, so plenty of rear legroom and boot space.
However I test drove a 320i and it was sluggish, there were a few ergonomic issues with the seat and dash layout and the manual gearbox was also not the best.
A 328i auto should be a better option.
Others to consider are BMW 2 series active tourer and Mercedes B class,
Edited by daveyjp on 22/11/2016 at 07:58
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We have a largish dog so need a 5th door ideally. I'm not a big fan of the 2 series tourer styling I'm afraid. We are both graphic designers and are very fussy about the way something looks, possibly too fussy but can't change the habits of a lifetime. I'm starting to look favourably at a Golf now, higher spec but not a GTi.
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We have a largish dog so need a 5th door ideally. I'm not a big fan of the 2 series tourer styling I'm afraid but the 3 series GT looks interesting and there are a few petrol versions around, including one in Norwich which isn't that far from me so thanks for that suggestion. We are both graphic designers and are very fussy about the way something looks, possibly too fussy but can't change the habits of a lifetime. I'm starting to look favourably at a Golf now, higher spec but not a GTi.
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If your wife likes the ride height of an SUV, then consider, RAV4 Hybrid, Kia Niro or Suzuki Vitara boosterjet.
I've tested the first two, prefered the Rav4 as I will be changing in Jan.
Personally I'm not convinced of long term reliability/costs on a BMW or VW group cars (They are all OK if changed every 3 years)
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The Ateca is brand new and likely to be in demand so should hold its value fairly well for the first few years while used examples are scarce plus I like the idea of a quirky small capacity 3cyl engine, I've a 3cyl Polo TDi the same shape as your own that's an entertaining wee car to row along the road. It's one I'd certainly be looking at.
As for the Golf. The reason I suggested the GTi has more to do with depreciation than performance. Higher spec petrol Golfs aren't that great at holding on to their value without that desirable GTi badge.
The versions I'd be looking at with a view to retention of value outside of the diesels and GTi would be the 1.4 TSi Match with the 122bhp unit or the newer 113bhp 1.0 as used in the Ateca. Both are plenty strong enough, offer low running costs and plenty of spec but don't cost as much as the GT.
I've had similar experiences with our local dealers too strangely enough. The VW branch can't do enough to help and our cars are always returned spotless with everything done efficiently plus several out of warranty goodwill claims have been successfully persued by them on my behalf without any effort on my part. The local Nissan dealer is the polar opposite. Irritatingly aggressive sales tactics and terrible after sales. The Qashqai is really a rebodied Renault Megane anyway.
If you want either of the VAG cars mentioned above then do so with the current generation of each as the firm have stated their intention to cost cut in order to absorb the cost of the diesel emissions scandal. Putting pressure on suppliers to cut costs and aiming for.lower design and build costs won't benefit punters one bit. VAG cars today are as good as they'll get for a long time to come.
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If you are considering a Golf one other car you should be looking at is the Seat Leon. We have had a 1.4 TSi 140 PS for 3 1/2 years and its been absolutely faultless. Does everything a Golf would do for a lot less money (when we bought it £5000 less than a Golf with the exact same engine). Bigger than a Polo so that part of your brief is matched, go and see/try one.
We have just ordered a new Skoda Superb. We need a bigger car but loved the1.4 TSi engine so much that in reality the Superb was the only sensible choice. ££££'s less than similar sized VW's and Audi's and every bit as good. Even with the 1.4 TSi engine the car is well capable of safely overtaking slow traffic on A roads which is always one of my requirements.
When my Leon goes into the trade next March someone is going to get an absolute bargain. Will be very sorry to see it go. Would probably keep it for the wife if the Note she has did not match her needs perfectly regarding carrying a wheelchair etc for her aged mother.
As for our local dealers the VW are pretty pathetic. Been 3 times now since June 2015, you struggle to get a sales persons attention and as soon as you say the "petrol" word they loose what bit of interest they might have initially shown. The Nissan lot were much better. Really keen on selling a car and did a deal that made brokers look expensive without much hard negotiating, located a car over 100 miles away and shipped it down for us. The Skoda dealer has been excellent especially when you consider we have been about 5 times in a week, tried 3 cars and have been very picky regarding the order details and spec. In the salesmans shoes I would have been thinking I was a tyre kicker.
We liked the Qashqai very much and we liked the new Tiguan, we even looked at the X-Trail which was actually my favourite of the breed. But I am not a huge fan of these faux offroaders (just weigh more and use more fuel than their hatch siblings) and the wife found that getting into the passenger seat in every model we tried caused hip pain, not a great feature.
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We'll definitely tale a look at Seat again, the staff were almost as helpful as VW, Nissan were so poor I wrote to the managing director to complain and although I had an email back from the local sales director inviting us back I'm afraid the damage was done. When the VW driver came to pick me up to collect my car after its last service he did comment that he goes to pick up customers from Colchester ( I'm in Ipswich) and Clacton as people like the local VW dealer here and are not happy with other dealers so it's definitely pot luck whether you have a dealer that suits, but good service is important to us.
Skoda still has a lingering bad PR image for me, however out of date and inaccurate that is, it's hard to shake off. I know they get great reviews and I will make the effort to go and look. Toyota Rav is a possible, we did look at one many years ago when they first came out but we bought a Freelander instead, purely down to interior quality, the early Rav's looked a bit plasticky we felt but again, will check them out as we have had 2 Toyota's in the past and had great service from them.
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Having gone through the process of choosing a biggish estate recently, I found the Audi A4, Mondeo and Hyundai i40 to be the most available petrol solutions.
In the end, I crossed my fingers and bought a new diesel A6. Doing mixed town and long journeys it has been cheap to maintain and reliable over 36k miles and 3.5 years.
I could sell it now to WBAC and have suffered £3.5k pa depreciation and be saying "What diesel problems?"
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I must admit a Mondeo estate is hovering on the bottom of the radar, a family member has a Modeo ST which I was impressed by, I do have a lingering irrational anti Ford prejudice for some reason, probably based on the rep-mobile image.
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I must admit a Mondeo estate is hovering on the bottom of the radar, a family member has a Modeo ST which I was impressed by, I do have a lingering irrational anti Ford prejudice for some reason, probably based on the rep-mobile image.
The Mondeo suffers horrific depreciation particularly the petrol variants. Certainly means there are used bargains to be had but I wouldn't want to invest much money into one.
A previous gen 1.6 ecoboost petrol Estate bought for the right money could make a good big family wagon. I'll admit to being tempted by an immaculate low mileage 2.5T Titanium at a Ford main dealer a few years back that they were literally throwing away. The 25mpg thirst stopped me.
The diesels have a tarnished reputation via problems with the now notorious 1.6 PSA units. The new 1.5 is apparently a redesign of this engine so hopefully Ford have fixed it properly. The petrol units are reliable however if looked after though I'm excluding the 1.0 3cyl which I can't imagine is man enough for the job and is developing a reputation as a soft engine too. Again it was hastily re-engineered which supposedly cured this but only time will tell.
Nice big cars to drive though.
Edited by SLO76 on 22/11/2016 at 10:12
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Avensis Touring? 1.8 Petrol appears to only be £16k on Drive the Deal.
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Avensis Touring? 1.8 Petrol appears to only be £16k on Drive the Deal.
I did see one the other day which I initially thought was a Mondeo from the rear, I'll definitely add that to the possibles as we have had good experience with Toyota in the past.
Edited to add (a) I'm not sure about the looks , particularly the front view, and (b) there are zero petrol models within 60 miles of me, only diesels.
Edited by lordwoody on 22/11/2016 at 13:00
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Drove an Avensis 1.8 Tourer back in 2010. Mechanically identical to todays cars but the front end was different. Even back then it was a gutless wonder. When the salesman swapped over with me he pulled into a laybye at the side of a dual carriageway. Pulling out into traffic would have been no problem for our Focus C-Max 1.6 TDCi, in the Avensis it turned out to be a bit like a Dirty Harry movie, "are you feeling lucky". Loads of revs was the order of the day but not a car I would recommend. Probably fine as a Taxi for town use.
The electric hand brake button was also in a stupid place under the steering wheel.
Compared to any VAG TSi its a slug.
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Skoda still has a lingering bad PR image for me, however out of date and inaccurate that is, it's hard to shake off.
Skoda had a deserved bad image until VW took over and started to put their DNA into the cars in the early 90's. Cars before VW's involvement were on the verge of being dangerous with their rear engines and swinging axles but since the first Felicia things have changed.
I know the JD Power type surveys have their critics (me included) but Skoda have been consistently at or near the top for over 10 years now so that must mean something.
30 years ago there is no way I would have bought a Seat or Skoda.
20 years ago I looked at both and they were close but not quite there with specs at the the time. Bought a Polo.
14 years ago looked at an Octavia Estate but at the time the rear seat space was very poor so left it at that. Bought a Mondeo
6 years ago looked at the Octavia Estate again, Plenty of rear seat space by then but noisy rear suspension/tyres so walked away. Bought a Kia Ceed estate.
3 years ago bought a Seat Leon, best car its its class without a doubt.
Now just ordered a Skoda Superb. Tried the Octavia again, hatch seemed fine but the estate still suffered from a noisy rear.
It might be hard for you to shake off the old image but a vast number of car buyers appear to accept the bad cars were in the past.
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Skoda still has a lingering bad PR image for me, however out of date and inaccurate that is, it's hard to shake off.
Skoda had a deserved bad image until VW took over and started to put their DNA into the cars in the early 90's. Cars before VW's involvement were on the verge of being dangerous with their rear engines and swinging axles but since the first Felicia things have changed.
I know the JD Power type surveys have their critics (me included) but Skoda have been consistently at or near the top for over 10 years now so that must mean something.
30 years ago there is no way I would have bought a Seat or Skoda.
20 years ago I looked at both and they were close but not quite there with specs at the the time. Bought a Polo.
14 years ago looked at an Octavia Estate but at the time the rear seat space was very poor so left it at that. Bought a Mondeo
6 years ago looked at the Octavia Estate again, Plenty of rear seat space by then but noisy rear suspension/tyres so walked away. Bought a Kia Ceed estate.
3 years ago bought a Seat Leon, best car its its class without a doubt.
Now just ordered a Skoda Superb. Tried the Octavia again, hatch seemed fine but the estate still suffered from a noisy rear.
It might be hard for you to shake off the old image but a vast number of car buyers appear to accept the bad cars were in the past.
For me, Skoda service and reliability is nothing but a myth. I've had exactly one Skoda (back in 2010) and it was utterly awful - unreliable, poorly built and with awful backup. JD Power is based on expectations and if you expect to see your dealer four or five times a year then.....
This summer I had Skoda hire cars (Octavia VRs petrol) for about 3000km - terrible, uncomfortable, noisy things. The first was replaced by one that was worse.
Ever the pragmatist I tried a Superb petrol a couple of months ago too, couldn't get on with it at all.
Hope you do better and it works for you.
Edited by Bianconeri on 22/11/2016 at 14:20
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Every brand, gets the odd lemon, no exceptions at any price - dismissing a brand because of a single lemon may not be a wise move - it's certainly not statistically sound.
Edited by RT on 22/11/2016 at 14:35
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Every brand, gets the odd lemon, no exceptions at any price - dismissing a brand because of a single lemon may not be a wise move - it's certainly not statistically sound.
Which is exactly why I tried another..... and didn't buy one......
Mrs BN has had one loathsome and unreliable car in her driving career - the Yaris that so many in here laud to high heaven. It was a car I would have cheerfully driven to the crusher
We still had Toyota on our list of possibles this year but the local dealers have been pretty abysmal.
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This summer I had Skoda hire cars (Octavia VRs petrol) for about 3000km - terrible, uncomfortable, noisy things. The first was replaced by one that was worse. Ever the pragmatist I tried a Superb petrol a couple of months ago too, couldn't get on with it at all. Hope you do better and it works for you.
As I said in the other thread I could not get on with the Octavia. The hatch was fine but for some wind noise (may have been a one off) but the estate was just plain noisy so we said no. The hatch had the 1.4 TSi just like my Leon and its was just the same magic engine. The Estate had the 2 litre diesel and it reminded me why I have not bought a VAG diesel since 1996. Had 2 ford diesels, a Kia diesel and and a BMW diesel all of which were great but all the VAG diesels I have tried have been truly horrid. Noisy, unrefined and incredibly poor throttle progression to name but 3 issues. Bothe cars rode well enough and the seats were identical to those my Seat so no issues there.
The Superb felt good from turning the key. None of the issues noted above, basically it met our brief.
For me, Skoda service and reliability is nothing but a myth
Seat service has been nothing to write home about, one out of the 3 garages has been fine, I would not visit the other 2 again. Reliability has been perfect. The local Skoda dealer gets good reviews (not perfect but who is - at least the wingers comments have been left on) and so far they have done all I have asked including modifying the order T & C's to match my requirements.
I go into car buying with my eyes open. Even the fabled Handa and Toyota have sold unreliable cars and I have seen our fleet guy have major issues with both of those brands in the past. You just have to hope you get a good one.
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Beekeeping friend ran an Octavia to 190k miles with diy only. Unsurprisingly he has bought another and plans to do the same.
Personally I would not touch them as I loathe VAG...
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For me, Skoda service and reliability is nothing but a myth. I've had exactly one Skoda (back in 2010) and it was utterly awful - unreliable, poorly built and with awful backup. JD Power is based on expectations and if you expect to see your dealer four or five times a year then..... This summer I had Skoda hire cars (Octavia VRs petrol) for about 3000km - terrible, uncomfortable, noisy things. The first was replaced by one that was worse. Ever the pragmatist I tried a Superb petrol a couple of months ago too, couldn't get on with it at all. Hope you do better and it works for you.
Not my experience:-
2001 Skoda Octavia 1.4 16v owned from new - still going strong 120k miles
2003 Skoda Superb 1.9pd owned from 18months - sold last year after 170kmiles - brilliant car, still on original exhaust, battery & clutch (new owner now at 190k miles!)
2014 Skoda Superb 1.4tsi - faultless thus far - now 37k miles
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