Next they'll refuse to have officers venture outside of a police station in case they get mugged or get mown down by a passing bus.
What about police horses? Surely there is a safety risk in possible falling of one?
And police dogs? What if the officer gets bitten? Or the dog hurts its leg?
Yes. Health and Safety has now gone mad.
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Someone might correct me here, but there's no where that I can see where it says that they are cutting them out due to "Health and Safety" (leglislation)... I know that particular leglislation comes in for a lot of stick, but in this case it seems innocent of any involvement...
What they did say is that they are cutting them out due to the increased risk a Motorcyclist runs compared with a car driver, which is true...
Having said that I do feel that its a backward step as Police 'Bikes definitely have their uses....
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Here in Sussex the force seem to have taken the opposite view as we now have a fleet of shiny new traffic bikes.
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There will be more to this than H&S, it's just that H&S makes a good story as, like this thread shows, it gets people into despair about where the Country is heading.
Northumberland is hardly the most built up areas of the UK, so bikes are probably not that necessary to get past congested traffic. What's it like riding a motorbike in February when the roads are icy? Is bike use permitted in such circumstances? If not then the whole resource is out of action for potentially weeks at a time over winter.
No doubt the Chief Constable has also looked at the stats and seen how many officer hours he is losing through to injuries sustained. Fall off and break a leg and that could be 12 months with an officer off sick, a replacement officer to pay for and when the injured officer returns he may not be fit for bike duty.
The police is now run as a business and any service which shows money isn't used effectively is potentially at risk of being withdrawn.
Edited by daveyjp on 08/05/2009 at 10:10
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Northumbria Police cover Newcastle, Gateshead, Sunderland and both North and South Tyneside. These are all built-up urban areas with high levels of traffic density, where motorcycles are ideal for police work.
Although Northumbria Police cover a large rural area, most of their activity is concentrated in the towns and cities above.
I feel that disbanding the motorcycle force is a poor decision and reflects the abandonment in our area of traffic policing to cameras.
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Essex police abandoned motorcycles (and horses) about ten years ago, but the bikes have since been brought back.
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Robin, the Essex force have also recently re-introduced their horses.
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A similar story where a Lancashire police officer refused to pose on a bike at a charity photo shoot because he had not passed his cycling proficiency test. A force spokeswoman said Pc Cobban was following "force guidelines". Insp Nick Emmett said: "Our officers are required to be appropriately trained and assessed prior to using bikes for patrolling in order to comply with insurance and for the safety of themselves and the public."
news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/lancashire/803...m
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Our Force has an issue with a certain make and model of bike that proved unstable when all kitted out but it ain't used anymore -there are no plans to get rid of bikes, don't understand it.
As for pedal bikes -I declined to use one in the early 1980s because I thought they were a waste of time and money for policing the town centre where i was -on foot was more effective to me.
The health and safety bit probably came after a PCSO was killed on a pedal cycle.
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the most frightening bobby you can meet is one on a real bike
they know traffic law inside out,can creep up on you in the flash of an eye and also do a good job
crazy britain------
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Especially the unmarked bikes. If they were a lot more of them on the roads, people might actually fear being caught out misbehaving!
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The community should have a say on how they are Policed. L is for lice....
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someone said >> The police is now run as a business >>
That would be ok if the police service were a business, but it's not.
It's not there to make a profit, but to provide a public service which includes activities which will sometimes put officers at personal risk. These include driving cars.
I don't think you can weigh the "cost" of having a copper off sick with a fracture against the benefit of having a copper sit on his bike at the side of the road, clearly in a position to catch up with anyone who's breaking the law.
If the police service were a business, I doubt complex cases would ever be brought to trial because they'd simply cost too much and a business wouldn't pursue them.
Edited by Optimist on 08/05/2009 at 12:37
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"I don't think you can weigh the "cost" of having a copper off sick with a fracture against the benefit of having a copper sit on his bike at the side of the road"
Agreed, but that's the way of the public sector world these days - it's what something costs which matters, not what it may or may not notionally save.
I've never known those making cuts put up their own job as a possible saving! Front line staff will always be first.
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There will be more to this than H&S it's just that H&S makes a good story >>
"Defending the move, Chief Superintendent Neil Mackay, head of Northumbria Police's operations department, told Police Review magazine: "A decision was taken on 7 April, with immediate effect, to dissolve the force's motorcycle capability to maximise the safety of officers.
"There will be no loss of service to the public. Everything that can be done with a bike can also be done with a car. "
So there we have it from the horse's mouth. It's unsafe to ride a motorbike, but safe to take a car anywhere a bike can go.
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Some years back I was the voluntary 'fleet manager' for a London Borough's police fleet (non traffic police). I reviewed the whole fleet and re-jigged things to our own advantage, in consultation with the proper 'area fleet manager' who managed a quarter of London.
I took a serious look at motorcycles. I was advised against it because of the servicing costs/time off the road of a bike compared to a car, plus the increased likelihood of injuries or worse of the riders, which meant they'd be off work sick (or worse) and increased training time needed. I made the decision... and if i thought we ought to have them, they would have been ordered, as my senior managers had been happy to delegate the task to me.
It wasn't an H&S decision, it was a common sense, what will work for us decision.
Having said that I do think traffic bikes are virtually essential in large built up areas. Tenner says in 3 - 5 years time, Northumbria change their minds.
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We have a number of off road bikes bought specifically for the job of dealing with nuisance off road bikers -loads of complaints every year about this - many bikes have been seized and people dealt with - the public seem to like it which is what it's all about I thought -it can't be "cost effective" necessarily, it's policing.
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No, they are not a business, but most businesses don't go out and spend money willy-nilly, surely all they are referring to is that they have to be accountable as to how they spend the money, which is no bad thing. The trouble with Gov run "services" is that they can become a bottomless pit unless some controls are put in... the key is ensuring that spending restrictions don't end up preventing a decent serice being provided... How many private businesses would have allowed the gross waste of money seen on many Gov "IT Projects", for instance?
There are good points and bad points in looking at Gov funded services from a private business aspect, the key thing is getting the right balance - I don't think they have in many cases, such as the NHS, but it could work...
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How many private businesses would have allowed the gross waste of money seen on many Gov "IT Projects" for instance?
Just about all of them from my experience. They're just better at keeping it quiet!
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another angle...5 or 6 years ago, one of my neighbours who i'd nod to and wave at , but had never really spoken with, came down the road for a chat when i was washing my bike...he knew what i did for a living.
he seemed a bit distracted
turned out the previous evening he'd found out his brother, a Welsh police motorcyclist, had been killed on a police rider training course...devastated didn't even begin cover it.
emergency service staff on motorcycles are definitely very, very vulnerable. It's bad enough riding around on one anyway without going through red lights and the wrong side of bollards etc.
Still think they're needed though.
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I'm sure it can be dangerous, but the riders are volunteers aren't they? They don't conscript ordinary coppers and force them to join the bike squad?
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I have to agree it is a said day to see the disbandment of this vital service and I do hope they change their minds sooner rather than later.
However if anyone happens to find out when these will go to auction could you please post on here, as we've been considering a Pan/BMW to add to the collection for some time.
Cheers
Boris
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I have posted before on our Monarch's outriders who have cut me up or made me stop with consummate, courteous efficiency on a couple of occasions over the years. They take HM's massive brick of a car through dense London traffic at a brisk lick, causing hardly a ripple or hold-up lasting longer than twenty or thirty seconds. Never a siren, just blue lights and these brilliant bikers, four or six of them, leapfrogging along all over the road clearing a rolling oasis of peace for the Queen's driver. It's just beautiful to witness.
Does anyone else have these top-class carriage dogs? I doubt if they will be disbanding them in a hurry.
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WP. Tenner says less than that. Royal visits? 2012?
Edited by Fullchat on 09/05/2009 at 00:41
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I remember reading a couple of years ago (might have been on this page) about a chase involving a police 4x4 (Leics IIRC) which abruptly had to be called off when the villains went offroad. It turned out that the police driver had not done the requisite offroad course and so was not allowed to leave tarmacked suburbia.
An experienced 4x4 police driver turned up but was also not allowed to drive offroad as the 4x4 vehicle in question was not equipped with offroad tyres.
Following this bizarre tale further I suppose there would eventually be calls to ban Police 4x4 vehicles "just in case". In Spain and France different police forces have jurisdiction in rural and urban areas and in the USA there persists the romantic outlaw image of racing to the county line to escape justice...
"Dukes of Hazzard UK" anyone?
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Perhaps they're getting rid of the bikes to make way for something else:
news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/8043126.stm
:-)
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Chief Superintendent Neil Mackay, head of Northumbria Police's operations department, told Police Review magazine: "Everything that can be done with a bike can also be done with a car."
How much public money is he 'earning' for spouting this drivel?
Edited by ifithelps on 11/05/2009 at 13:25
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I presume he's never ridden a bike.
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Focus -
Phrase 'sitting ducks' springs to mind!
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WP. Tenner says less than that. Royal visits? 2012?
2012 is the one isn't it....that decision won't go down well with the Home Office will it....
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Some BBC video on the original item and other forces views
news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/8044881.stm
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