The engine was fine....so no worrries there!
but, everything else seemed to go wrong:
This includes (This is what I can remember off the top of my head):
(1) both coil springs snapping at the same time, breaking the suspension and slashing both tyres.
(2) The usuals stuff: clutch, belts, pully and tensioners replaced twice and all service intervals and MOT's
(3)Faulty EGR valve, Faulty Fuel pump.
(4) Three new exhaust systems (or part thereof)
(5)Brake pads (3 times) discs (twice)
(6) new fuse box system
(7) new ball joints etc
(8) new tyres (two sets of four)
(9) at least 10 hours of Lab tests at the dealer to diagnose various problems, the latest being the car refusing to start on cold/damp mornings: For this one I had to take the car back several times...(had one of there run around cars for 3 weeks) lstill the same problem..luckily it is now summer and starts after a few turns
(10) New battery, glow plugs (twice), and electric window regulator
The car when bought had 12, 000 miles it now has 120,000 mostly M'way miles!
There is more, I just don't want to pile through the various receipts
Best C.
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so you have a car that has done 118000 miles, and you are complaining its had to have pads disks and tyres?
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TourVanMan TM < Ex RF >
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Trust me on this....
if it was just tyres and discs I would be on here singing Pug's praises....if it makes you feel better take £500 away for those items and the bill is still over £5, 500 and hours of aggravation from a poor customer service. This is despite me being on first name terms with both the mechanics and counter staff!
Surely not acceptable for a car, regardless of just 20K a year (mostly m'way) miles?
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Although it sounds a lot, I'm with TVM on this. If my maths is right, maintenance has cost you 5p per mile. Assume you get £1k for it (pure guess...) then depreciation has cost you another 5p per mile. Another assumption: @ 45mpg it's cost approx 10p per mile for fuel. Total cost per mile so far is just 20p - doesn't sound to bad to me... What's insurance - another 2p per mile?
Obviously the hassle factor sounds high, but in pure financial terms I'm not sure there's too much to complain about (IMO)
Peter
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The costs are acceptable on a per mile basis because the car has done a large number of miles.
(1) both coil springs snapping at the same time, breaking the suspension and slashing both tyres - it's not surprising that they would have needed replacement but the sudden failure is both surprising and disappointing.
(2) The usuals stuff: clutch, belts, pully and tensioners replaced twice and all service intervals and MOT's - clearly no problem there.
(3)Faulty EGR valve, Faulty Fuel pump - one or other is probably acceptable, but you might have hoped to escape both.
(4) Three new exhaust systems (or part thereof) - one, maybe two - three seems like too many.
(5)Brake pads (3 times) discs (twice) - pad life seems okay, I'd have hoped for one set of discs only with another soon.
(6) new fuse box system - unlucky maybe?
(7) new ball joints etc - not a problem.
(8) new tyres (two sets of four) - nor this.
(9) at least 10 hours of Lab tests at the dealer to diagnose various problems, the latest being the car refusing to start on cold/damp mornings: For this one I had to take the car back several times...(had one of there run around cars for 3 weeks) lstill the same problem..luckily it is now summer and starts after a few turns - really shouldn't happen.
(10) New battery, glow plugs (twice), and electric window regulator - Batteries are semi-consumables, one set of glow plugs should have been enough, and an electric window regulator is frustrating but hardly uncommon.
In terms of what I would have accepted without question I get (at cheap, friendly mechanic prices):
Coil springs - £140
Usuual services - £180 for a clutch, £150 for a timing belt and tensioners, £120 for three MoTs, £1k for servicing
Exhausts - £120
Brake pads - £120 for pads, £100 for discs
Ball joints - £180
Tyres - £320
Battery - £40
Glow plugs - £80
The total of that, at the rates I would expect to pay, is £2,550.... which leaves £3,500 for a labour premium (my mechanic is very, very quick and still charges less than £30 per hour) and questionable reliability. Allowing £1k for extra chargess in labour, that means that the maintenance bill has been roughly double what I'd have hoped for.
It's hardly a great result but even with that I wouldn't call the car a dog, merely "below average"
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Thanks for the breakdown Dave,
but again this was just an estimate of what the recepits look like, and believe me, there are far more! So much so in fact I am thinking seriously of taking away three quarters of the receipts before presenting them to any prospective buyer!
Dishonesty is not, however, a quality I admire!
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Your math is spot on, and I don't want to sound too much like I am complaining (although I am), but it was the shear amount of things that went wrong in four years
remember, I had to take the car to the dealer on seperate occasions for most of these items; inc. the service trips....sometimes twice/three times for the same problem...
I have had VW'S, rovers etc and have done similar miles in them all, but never had I amounted those types of bills in such a short amount of time!
C
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Actually I've worked out my parents' maintenance bill over 83k with a 52-plate Ford Focus from new, always using (expensive) Pirelli tyres and running a 6k oil change regime.
It's under £2k but only just and in need of four new tyres and a timing belt fairly shortly.
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The wife had one of these 206s last year as a "courtesy car" from the insurers when hers was in for an accident repair and I have to say it was the nastiest, tinniest, loathsome piece of tat I've ever had the misfortune to drive. Cheap, plasticky and with the seeming structural rigidity of a chocolate teapot. And it wasn't a basic one either - it had lots of electric bits and alloys and stuff.
Seriously, I would rather walk than own one of them.
It also reminded me of a Citroen Saxo I once had on another accident repair (I must add both accidents were no faulters). One day going to work in light snow the windscreen wipers flew off. Never seen anything like it.
Most of all it made me seriously worry for the fate of all 17 year olds running around in these contemptible items of junk as they are so flimsy any sort of half decent accident is going to finish them off. No wonder the teenage death rate on the roads is so high.
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Cheap plasticky and with the seeming structural rigidity of a chocolate teapot. And it wasn't a basic one either - it had lots of electric bits and alloys and stuff.
This has always been my opinion on PSA cars as well when I've driven them.
One thing that struck me was that whilst people complain about the "plasticky" interiors on Far-Eastern cars, at least they are almost universally -- Korean or Jap -- well nailed down. The Citroen Xsara I nearly bought, although a nice car, felt as if it was made out of used Kebab boxes, and this is coming from an Accent owner.
Still, this part of the French "ownership experience" I could put up with -- but to then try to claim that such a dash has "flair", well I find it funny anyway.
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and with the seeming structural rigidity of a chocolate teapot. >>
Haha this really made me chuckle!!!
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Clachnacudden, It does sound to me as though you have been to only main dealers for all those items, am I right?
If you have you are bound to have paid top dollar, a small local independent wiould have probably halved your costs.
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I've never quite been able to reconcile why people are prepared to keep a car when they are unsatisfied with its reliability.
The first major issue on a car and it's out the door as far as I am concerned -- to heck with the lost money.
Having said that, this one deosn't seem to have had any major issues, just a steady stream of niggles.
Just seems to be par for the course on a Eurobox really!
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Either you were unlucky, or I was very lucky.
I had a 2001 206 XSi bought at two years old (27k miles) and sold at five (73k) probably when most of your problems started.
In those three years and 45+k miles it went through the usual consumables of one set of front discs and pads, new set of tyres, 1 lot of belts and pulleys and one cat back exhaust system which was shot at 4 years and 60+k miles.
The only other things it required were:
- Wiper stalk computer scroll button gave up after one month, replaced under warranty
- Aircon service at 4 years old (could be classed as a consumable)
- New ball joints at 5 years old.
I did go into the dealership with the intention of buying a diesel, relieved I bought the petrol judging by the issues you had.
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Thank-you guys and girls for your replies...I am off to pick up my new (used) Audi a3 (2000) on Thursday!!!! Wish me some luck.
I know everyone has their opinions and I agree that, maybe, I should have taken the car to an independent mechanic or, indeed, sold the car on...but the bottom line is money and trust....and I am short on both. I decided to sell when the dealer could not look me in the eye after 3 weeks in their shop in relation to staring problems, which still persist. I know they were simply stumped by the car, and could come up with no reason why it refusesd to start in bad weather.
I, therefore, conclude by saying that I will never, and I mean never, buy another Pug again...
Thanks all for your time,
Clach.
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Either you were unlucky or I was very lucky.
Some friends of ours have just ordered a brand-new 206, their 3rd. They went to look at 207 but didn't like it, and mentioned to the dealer that what they'd really like is a new 206. He said 'no problem, 206 is still being made'. They're thrilled to bits to have been able to get a new one!!
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No doubt that some 206's, hold together better than others, but for me that simply was not the case!
Best,
Clach.
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The 206 was a good car and did the job I bought it for which was to cut my fuel bills while working in London.
I left London and needed a bigger car to fit the family in and a car in which we can cover upto 1k miles in a single trip.
Only two things I could fault the 206 on :
1. Horrible elephant bottom print plastic on the dashboard.
2. Flimsy metal work - open the drivers door and you can flex the front wing with your finger tips.
I do understand that Peugeots can literally fall apart after 70k miles so it's possible I sold it at the right time and if I still had it now may not be singing its praises so much.
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I am off to pick up my new (used) Audi a3 (2000) on Thursday!!!! Wish me some luck. maybe I should have taken the car to an independent mechanic or indeed sold the car on...but the bottom line is money and trust....and I am short on both.
So after your experience with the Pug, are you going to find an independant Audi/ VAG specialist for your A3? It will hopefully be more reliable for you than the 206, but when it does require work Audi main dealer prices have even more potential to make your eyes water...
My Dad is now very happy having his A4 serviced at a local indie Audi specialist, after he fell out with a main dealer over a service bill.
;o)
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Yes, indeed, I have already found one in Iver.
I did phone the Audi dealer to ask about a 40k service, they quoted me £500 (mostly likely a little on the high end, but I got the message....) ;-)
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Good Luck ! with your new A3. Hope it's a better car for you than your last one.
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Cheers, and thanks to you all for your useful comments.
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Further News: on one of my last journey's home in the aforementioned car last night, and an new' rattling' noise is starting to appear from the passenger side front wheel.....like I said, not very bolted together this one and even tougher to try and sell on now!?
Anyone know how I can sell a car worth (apparently) 2K quickly?
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