Any - Badge of Honour schemes your veiws please. - laldog

Hi i run an independent small workshop and would like some feedback from the public motoring and the trade.

There are so many of these code of conduct scheme's being banded around that even as someone in the trade it can be baffling.

We joined The Motor Codes and actually won Garage of the year regional final last year but since then i have become disillusioned with The Motor Codes.

One of the Motor Codes recommendations is that we as a trade should not charge for "simple tasks". This can include bulb replacing and wiper blade replacing as long as there is not a lot of dismantling required (RE Renault's for instance!!).

We saw evidence of a local dealer who charged a customer £35.00 + vat to replace the front 2 wiper blades on a Ford Ka!!!!

We also have a customer who over 2 years down the line and adhering to the Motor Codes requests is now resorting to legal action against a Motor Code registered garage after the Motor Codes have come up with a blank and they are meant to be independent in such cases?

We also have been informed that they (Motor Codes) are actively seeking to get more fast fit chains on board even though they have a reputation of fitting parts that are not needed.

I have many instances from (now my) customer's who have come from said fast fit centers with huge bills of work that has been carried out for no apparent reason other than to boost sales of course.

I as many other small garages are passionate,open and honest in the work we do, work that i am sure the general motoring public tend not to appreciate how complex and technical this can be.

I work hard for my reputation and it has now made me realise that my long earned reputation has more clout than any badge of honour scheme.

I would be interested in your views and more so any experience you may of had in the past with said schemes,good or bad,thanks for your input.

Any - Badge of Honour schemes your veiws please. - gordonbennet

Very good post.

My only experience of these sorts of thing is when my old mate went from delivering building materials and the like to helping out with certain jobs, and after learning the very basics of the trade he established himself as a small specilaised type of building company.

Within weeks he had joined some sort of association, fancy seal to put on his letterhead and his van, and he knew only the basics of the job...however over the years he's done well for himself and good luck to him.

What amazed me was that he knew so little but could join this association which made him appear to be some time served font of all knowledge, no checks were made, no one came to inspect his work or anything like that, the shield and membership meant absolutely nothing, other than a bit of cheap image.

Anyway, getting back to cars, i'm a big fan of small car workshops who try to offer what you do, and you are so right about reputation, its worth all the shields and associations put togther, you can't buy it, you can only earn it through constant good work and customer care.

I run an old MB, have run them for manyy years, i'm lucky enough to have the services of one of the oldest established MB indies in the country, he doesn't advertise, he doesn't have dolly bird receptionists (pity 'bout that..;), the only floor coverings are muck and old parts and the place looks like a scrap yard, but his work is exceptional and his knowledge amazing, he charges reasonably and he does the work well, he doesn't fit parts willy nilly till he happens upon the bit that had failed. He repairs parts where he can, in short he's the best thing since sliced bread in the MB indy game.

See those of us who know like him just as he is, we don't want fancy coffee and deep carpets and shiny tiles, we want our cars fixing properly for a reasonable cost, we want servicing performed competently with 40 years of common sense and knowledge even if it differs from what the book says.

He's always stacked out with work, we as customers recommend him to others, but we are protective too, in that we vet potential customers if we can.

Don't need to tell you about bad payers do i, they grate me as much as they do my indy, he is a gentleman of the old school, his word is good, his handshake on something is as good a guarantee as you will find in this land, he deserves customers who appreciate what they have found.

The chap in question needs no scheme membership either, he has earned his spurs times over.

Edited by gordonbennet on 15/07/2012 at 17:19

Any - Badge of Honour schemes your veiws please. - laldog

Good reply.

Odd that,i have an SLK 200 in at the moment with 41k on the clock and Mercedes wanted 5k to repair it,new cylinder head required with no offer of goodwill either.

We are in the middle of a repair that will half the cost to the customer even though i have spent 3/4 hours researching the fault/repair that to be honest i never charge for as i love to root out a repair path rather than a replace only attitude.

You made me laugh when you said you vet new customers!!! very good.

Any - Badge of Honour schemes your veiws please. - oldroverboy

Do you pay for your badge of honour(s)?

I started in the motor trade in an auction ring, sometimes pushing/bump starting the cars through, then got into van sales, then into parts, did a few years in switzerland too, and believe me Good garages don't need to advertise, but i have seen personally a few crooks at very close quarters. Here in west wales we have an excellent indie as well as a good peugeot/chevrolet dealer, and an exceptionally good vauxhall dealer, I send people to all three depending on the car of course.

All power to your spanner arm!

Edited by OldRoverboy on 15/07/2012 at 20:39

Any - Badge of Honour schemes your veiws please. - laldog

Yes they have a sub to pay and The Motor Codes uses the RAC to carry out checks on your premises. They also carry out,or at least they say they carry out spot checks too.

I had a customer who had a clutch release bearing fail on a 2 year old 206 it was obvious to the point a trainee could have diagnosed it yet the local dealer bullied her into not taking it to them as "if we find it is wear & tear then we will charge you for removing the gearbox".

We did the job and yup you guessed it the release bearing had failed. Independant engineers report got her no where so yet another customer who i filled with confidence regards the code let down.

Any - Badge of Honour schemes your veiws please. - oldroverboy

I saw a mechanic in collusion with a workshop manager in a major dealership tell an elderly customer that he needed a new cylinder head, and the mechanic was going to fit the old head on his own car, as (coincidentally) his cylinder head had cracked. I told my own boss, (parts manager at the time) and then went over his head to the owner of the garage who dealt with it. shortly after that the workshop manager was escorted off the premises.

Just makes me tend to believe the horror stories i read. Here i can watch my oil changes being done, and the people who do service the car i trust

Any - Badge of Honour schemes your veiws please. - RT

I sympathize with the OP and all the other good workshops - whether customers know a little or a lot about cars, it's difficult or impossible to tell in advance how honest the work will be so the bad guys keep on getting a disproportionate amount of work.

I don't give "badges of honour" any credence at all because it doesn't seem to make any overall difference.

I don't know what the answer generally is - there are places in HJ's Good Garage Guide that I won't use if hell freezes over because I've been screwed there in the past - they'll say they changed since then, maybe they have but maybe they haven't, no-one can tell without giving them work to do at the risk of giving further opportunity to be screwed.

Wherever possible I put all my family's work into an independent who I found by accident 20 years ago and are miles better than anyone else I've used in my area, big or small, franchised or not - they're not perfect, I don't expect them to be, but they put things right with no fuss if they've made a mistake but that's only twice in 20 years.

Edited by RT on 16/07/2012 at 11:01

Any - Badge of Honour schemes your veiws please. - NARU
There is a real need for a trusted scheme to point people to the best garages. Unfortunately, so many of the schemes are just a con.

I've had good and bad from main dealer, independent and fast-fit chain.

Motorcodes seems to me to be the best we have.

Any - Badge of Honour schemes your veiws please. - gordonbennet

''There is a real need for a trusted scheme to point people to the best garages. Unfortunately, so many of the schemes are just a con''.

Thats a fair comment Marlot, about the only reason we still run MB is because of our indy, there are far more reliable and durable cars out there IMO, but he makes the difference worth while for us.

Make specific forums are a good source of where to go, but not all makes are well served in this and you have to be careful to read between the lines, some indies might have some connection to the site and equally anothe rindy might have animosity with the site mods.

I've toyed with Subaru, Lexus, Cadillac all sorts but ended up coming back to the conclusion i'm better off where i am for the time being at least.

Who would have thought that a good make specific indy could in reality make you stay with a make you'd otherwise avoid.

Any - Badge of Honour schemes your veiws please. - NARU
Who would have thought that a good make specific indy could in reality make you stay with a make you'd otherwise avoid.

Or even a good main dealer! One of the reasons I run a Toyota Landcruiser rather than a Landrover is the quality of my local Toyota dealer. I know several people who drive past the other local Toyota dealer (ironically part of the same group, but based in town) to take their car to the (village-based) main dealer. He's always busy.

I've changed the main dealer I take my mazda to. Interestingly, the new dealer has an optional additional service 'top up', which does the things which good engineering practice would say they should but which are not in the official mazda service schedule. Like rotating the wheels, greasing all the cables underneath, greasing the sliders for the disk brakes etc. They charge an extra £20 or so for this. They've been quite clever, and price the official service about £10 cheaper than the other local dealer - so effectively that's £10 towards the £20 anyway.

Any - Badge of Honour schemes your veiws please. - gordonbennet

''Interestingly, the new dealer has an optional additional service 'top up', which does the things which good engineering practice would say they should but which are not in the official mazda service schedule.''

Oh i like that, and would dearly like to know who was responsible for this excellent idea...must be someone very old school lurking about, pity its chargeable and not part of normal service, but all power to them for letting people know the differences between an inspection, of sorts, and a service..

In my kerbside cowboy days that's exactly what i used to do anyway, a service to me meant going right through the car doing sensible preventative maintenance as well as the accepted normal items, what else is a service about if not that.

I wonder if our OP does things like greasing brake sliders as part of a standard service too, to me that particular item should be part of an annual brake strip clean and inspection anyway, those who do such work properly (even DIYers) seems to be getting rather lonely these days.

I've never quite understood how peering through or from behind a wheel can inspect brakes properly, especially inside drums and short of removing the pads how does anyone know how well attached the friction material is or how free the pistons are, but maybe the X ray specs The Beano sent out 40 years ago these garages still have..;)

Edited by gordonbennet on 16/07/2012 at 16:30

Any - Badge of Honour schemes your veiws please. - laldog
Some great points to take on board.
In answer to your question,yes as i was raised by a guy who always stripped,cleaned and greased brakes and always had a pot of grease for pipes etc handy this is still something we do today.
I worked in a dealership for over 3 years (and please take it from me there are some fantastic dealerships out there) and we were told in pretty plain English that if we had reason to remove a wheel it had to be paid for,in other words look at the brakes and if they looked ok through the wheel then leave them be,otherwise something had to be sold to justify the time to take the wheel off,suffice to say i hated it there!!!!!

I am sorry when i talked about badge of honour scheme this is a generic term that covers many many codes of conduct schemes.

As an independent i have no other way of "taking on the big boys" if and when required so i saw the likes of The Motor Codes as a kind of big brother,sadly this is not the case.

Thanks for the input so far i really do appreciate your views.
Any - Badge of Honour schemes your veiws please. - concrete

Good points raised by laldog. I am really lucky to have a really good main dealer for my main car and an excellent indie for other family vehicles. Due to age of my main vehicle I am now considering just going the indie route until it expires. Reputation is all, hard won by word of mouth and can be damaged just as easily. All I can say is support these local gems all you can and tell your friends to do the same.

It reminds me of an old friend, no longer with us unfortunately, who owned a furniture business. If a customer returned with a problem he made an immediate fuss of them, sitting them down, tea and coffee, take all the details and assure them he would sort it out. Even the most beligerant of complainants would leave his shop feeling satisfied. He would then send them a bunch of flowers and a bottle of wine. He would contact the manufacturer and arrange a visit to determine the problem and take the necessary action to resolve it, no matter what it was. He had nearly all repeat business, his reputation was famous. All because he took the trouble to be receptive to a problem he would have to solve anyway. His son now runs the business along similar lines, so it works to be fair and helpful when customers have problems. Cheers Concrete

Any - Badge of Honour schemes your veiws please. - Bobbin Threadbare

I've never heard of the Badge of Honour scheme! I am aware of the 'female friendly' garage scheme which relies on reputation really. The best and most reasonable work I've had done on a car was by some chaps who operated out of a shed, and the worst has to be Kwik Fit, but then other chains such as ATS and HiQ have been great.

I have never had a new enough car to have dealer servicing, although the previous owner of my MX-5 had all the servicing done at a Mazda garage and it's sufficiently close to where I live to make me consider doing that too.

Any - Badge of Honour schemes your veiws please. - RT

I've never heard of the Badge of Honour scheme!

I think it's a generic term.

Any - Badge of Honour schemes your veiws please. - Ed V
Totally ignorant, me. But I can smell a "jobs-worth" idea from quite a way off.

My guess is that this is primarily a well meaning scheme, or was at the outset, but like most of these umbrella schemes, with only a few exceptions, they turn into bureaucratic, catch-all, nightmares of box-ticking madness.

If they're clever, those who run the schemes, many turn them into empire-building careers, with slots on breakfast TV etc. etc., while claiming to "represent" whatever industry they're on about.

Personally, I go on word of mouth, and on occasion word of reputable website posters' personal recommendations, such as HJ or Which?

However, only you can know if your reputation is good enough to rely on the old method, or whether it will be worth the hassle of Motorcodes to catch a few, time-pressed, less well informed people who may be driven your way.
Any - Badge of Honour schemes your veiws please. - barney100
Simple, I use a garage I trust, if I get the idea I'm being ripped off then that garage loses me and word of mouth gets around. for instance, charged for topping up windscreen fluid when I'd made sure it was done before I took the car in. Main dealer telling me I need to spend a grand or more when all I need is a sensor changed. What we need is for honest tradesmen to form a group that is self regulating and honest, garages, plumbers, etc etc.....pie in the sky though.