I've had a Citroen ZX TD Volcane for the last 85k miles having bought the car at 100K. It uses no oil at 185K (running synthetic diesel engine oil which incidentally is approx. 20% cheaper at French hypermarkets along with all PSA filters). But two problems -
1. The engine cuts out occasionally when decelerating to idle (at stop junctions etc);
2. There is a significant vibration coming from the front wheels which is road speed related (as opposed to engine speed). I've done the obvious (wheel balance, changed both driveshafts and N/s front wheel bearing without improvement). Before I change the other bearing any ideas? Second guessing at the answer is a gearbox failure resulting in vibration likely (no metallic pieces in drained g/box oil)? Apart from a slight whine the g/box is slick.
Other observations applying to all TD PSA engines is that the rads MUST be changed every three years or 90K miles (all rot then burst at base with catestrophic consequences at the head gasket). Consequently treat with as much respect as cam belt changes! Also has anyone experienced a disintergrating swirl chamber (akin to a dropped valve in consequences). I've seen it happen as the chambers are pressed into the head....
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re speed related vibration - are the tyres ok, not been kerbed and got a bulge in the tread? Can be v. hard to spot without taking the wheel off and looking for it. Had said problem on our Xantia, looked and felt great on the car, off, a different story.
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I'm with Ash on this one. You need to carefully and slowly spin the tyres when jacked up. Put a brick or something almost touching the tyres so you can detect and out-of-round or variation across the tread. Both new and old can be quite poor in this respect. This situation can be apparently balanced out on the tyre fitters machine but once on the road will cause a vibration.
You seem to have checked almost everything else for the vibration problem. Are you 100% sure it is the front end?
David
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Somewhere in this thread is mentioned a side to side problem. I had this many years ago with Firestone radials on a Maxi (stop it you lot!). On investigation, the carcass deformation was appalling - you could revolve the wheel and see the tread wandering around the periphery of the tyre.
One other thing - doesn't the Citroen/Pug installation have one drive shaft longer than the other and an inboard support bearing? Could there be a problem with this, or have I mixed my cars up?
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Thanks Ian - you're quite right as to the longer (O/s) driveshaft and intermediate support bearing. Both d/shafts have been changed without improvement. Tyres are new all round (no pun intended and apologies for not making this clear). Wheel rims themselves appear in good shape. Am I going mad or should I proceed to replace all wheel bearings? Could it be something obscure like a gearbox/engine mount? Does anyone know of a cheapish torque wrench that reads up to the 300+nm for the front hub nuts? Local garage advised that the exact torque should be "***ing tight" (a technical term I'm not familiar with!).
TC
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Obviously not trained up in the Birmingham car trade world then ??
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I'm no expert but I tend to think a noise/whine is g/box or bearings, whereas vibration is nearer the wheels. That would leave wheels, brakes/discs and suspension. I gather there are 3 bushes per side in the front suspension and that they can need replacing at reasonable mileages - could they cause enough play to resonate? I personally have never had to replace one single bush in my life, so I don't know what the symptoms are, but I know of people who seem to do it regularly on ZXs. Perhaps I'm easily satisfied.
I've had an engine mount go on a boxer engine (Sud Sprint) and you could feel the engine moving sidewards, wouldn't have thought a transverse upright wouldn't have such a great effect tho.
Re big torque wrench - I "borrowed" (for 5quid and a 50 quid deposit) a local garage's 4 foot bar and socket to get the front hub nuts undone on an old rustly VW bus. Even then took two of us swinging on it and then we split the socket - I've never seen a torque wrench with that kind of grunt. Might be quite cheap to rig something like that up (it was one huge socket thought).
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Before major expense, get the wheels double checked for balance at a reputable Garage.....
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TC wrote:
>
> I've had a Citroen ZX TD Volcane for the last 85k miles
> having bought the car at 100K. It uses no oil at 185K
> (running synthetic diesel engine oil which incidentally is
> approx. 20% cheaper at French hypermarkets along with all PSA
> filters). But two problems -
>
> 1. The engine cuts out occasionally when decelerating to idle
> (at stop junctions etc);
If I remember correctly from the Pug 306 Haynes manual, there's a
check on the diesel pump that should be done every 12000miles.
The main check is to adjust the anti stall speed, and a secondary
check after doing this is to rev the engine (by manually operating the
speed control) and then suddenly letting go. The engine speed should
then decay to idle after a number of seconds.
Either of these items could lead to the engine cutting out when dropping
to idling speeds.
The only problem with adjusting the anti-stall is that you need a
reasonably accurate measure of engine speed (i.e. better than your
dashboard rev counter) - Not easy on a diesel!
/John
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TC
Agree with Ash and David. Had similar problem on AX at 88K miles, but complicated by left driveshaft needing replacement. Vibration may have caused that, don't know. Spinning the wheels and viewing from front of car showed the tread apparently moving slightly from side! 3 of the original Michelin Energy tyres had carcass faults. The garage couldn't believe they were original at the mileage - they must be made out of granite or something.
2 new driveshafts and 4 new Bridgesone tyres and it runs sweetly again.
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Dyslexic keyboard strikes again!
I meant from side to side ...
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TC,
had a similar problem once on vibration and I cured it by replacing the front dampers.....
However the same problem arose about two years later on the same car with vibration etc.
Had the wheels balanced with no improvement and reluctantly changed the front dampers again this time with no cure.
Took the front wheels off and there were bulges in the inner walls on both side.
How the wheel balancer missed it God only knows.
Replaced the front tyres and problem solved.
Alvin
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Can I suggest swapping the front wheels with the rears and or rotating (!) the spare - this should eliminate the wheel/tyre as a factor in the vibes.
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Firstly, I would suggest having the wheels balanced ON the car with a dynamic on car balancer. This has sorted out/identified many vibration problems for us!
JK has it spot-on with reference to adjusting the anti-stall speeds on the fuel injection pump. Could indeed be tricky without an optical tachometer - don't know where you are based TC but you are welcome to borrow ours.
Rgds
David
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It is fun swinging about on the end of a bar doing those nuts up esp the rears on VW buses, plus its amusing seeing visitors faces when they see this sodding great socket hanging up on the wall. Mine went to a car boot by mistake, nearly caused a terminal rift in the family that one! :-(
I know this has been mentioned above, but even though the tyres are new it is still worth checking v v v carefully that they are round in the manner suggested above by David Woollard and others. I have been through this hoop several times and its has always been the tyres in the end.
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