Volkswagen Golf IV - cam belt replacement - bru

My golf is virtually 4 years old - mileage 35000 - when should the cam belt be replaced

Volkswagen Golf IV - cam belt replacement - Collos25

What do VW say

Volkswagen Golf IV - cam belt replacement - piston power

Vauxhall and ford say 100k im sure this is similar do ring vw service department or look in your handbook.

Volkswagen Golf IV - cam belt replacement - 659FBE

The problem is that the printed service book stipulates a change interval of the order of 80k miles without time limit and a scruffy bit of paper (at least in the case of my vehicle) from the importer at M-K + lots of dealer hype, places a 4 year time limit on the belt's running time.

Nowhere else in the world, to my knowledge, does this apply (I've checked) so in my view, the 4 year interval is a VAG UK-based scam. They were probably miffed at a fall in potential servicing revenue when variable servicing came out and so dreamed up this policy to compensate.

It's a clever scheme - it doesn't affect the all important fleet market who offload before the time limit, it catches the original owner within the "pride of ownership, dealer treatment only" period and finally it utilises that humanitarian dead cert - fear.

I have a 1.9 AWX diesel and I used to test engines for a living. I've seen hundreds of camshaft drives of all types. I changed the cambelt on my AWX after 5 + years and made a careful examination of the removed parts - belt, all rollers and water pump. All parts were in perfect condition except for the small roller which was lacking some grease due to its insanely high operating speed. As it's very lightly loaded, it doesn't matter.

My opinion, and my policy in future, will be to abide by the recommendations printed in the service book supplied with the vehicle. The M-K version is not an update, it's a scam.

659.

Volkswagen Golf IV - cam belt replacement - Collos25

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The reason for the update to 4 years was the large number that were failing whether it is the belt or ancillary equipment better to be safe than sorry.They need changing at some point and its not an expensive procedure just like changing your oil sooner than later.

It can prove rather expensive repair if it does break or a component fails and you have to ship the car home with a broken engine.You cannot beat a well serviced machine.

Edited by Andy Bairsto on 02/08/2010 at 17:43

Volkswagen Golf IV - cam belt replacement - corax

>> made a careful examination of the removed parts - belt, all rollers and water pump.

>>All parts were in perfect condition

So did you not replace the water pump 659FBE? What about those cars that have been in a higher wear environment, like city driving?

Volkswagen Golf IV - cam belt replacement - madf

VW made idlers out of cheese.. so after 4 years they were shot..

Ckint had it right about cambelts (and tensioners and pulleys and idlers and water pumps) "do you fell lucky today,punk?"..

Says it all.. Companies which use plastic impellers in water pumps are not to be trusted.

Volkswagen Golf IV - cam belt replacement - 659FBE

The water pump was replaced with a pattern part fitted with a metal impeller. As stated above, there were no defects in the removed component which had a plastic impeller.

As the pumps are cheap and the access tedious on these cars, renewal is an obvious precaution and adds about 15 mins to the job.

"VW idlers made out of cheese" - mis-informed over simplification. Some of the petrol engines (eg. ABS) used plastic-wheeled idlers supplied by FAG which were not fit for purpose.

The diesel engines have always used metal idlers, the PD tensioners being supplied by Litens of Canada and fitted with Japanese NTN bearings (the best). The PD anti-flutter roller is supplied by INA.

These components are as good as any available - the NTN bearings are arguably the best that money can buy. I've tested a few in my time...

659.

City driving makes no difference to a camshaft drive system. Engine acceleration and deceleration stress is many times lower than the cyclic belt stress caused by the cams. If correctly set (the VAG diesels have an automatic tensioner) the number of cold starts is the highest factor which shortens the drive life - but even then,not by very much. The drive on the PD engine is, in my opinion correctly rated for the mileage stated in the vehicle service book supplied by the makers - not importers.

Edited by 659FBE on 03/08/2010 at 00:22

Volkswagen Golf IV - cam belt replacement - bru

Thanks for the response - anybody know a specialist , non franchise garage in the Dartford area who might replace cambelt at an affordable price

Volkswagen Golf IV - cam belt replacement - Collos25

Doesn't matter whether its better or worse in the city or not your first statement was incorrect regarding this type of vehicle .The warning was given in good faith and for good reason I would sooner follow that than your perhaps,maybe,no need attitude a few bob spent on service parts is a darn sight better than having to pay for a new engine.I worked in the middle east and on a regular basis would go to boilers that were on the otherside of the road because they blew up because of attitudes to servicing like yours a recore was about tenth of the price of a new boiler plus the downtime a none booked outage caused.

Volkswagen Golf IV - cam belt replacement - geordie jim

My 1.6 golf was 8years old when Honest John said cam belt should be replaced at 4y.o. or 40k. I did so immediately but was informed it should be changed again in 20k. as replacement parts are not of the quality of new.

Getting to know the truth is not easy!

Geordie Jim

P.s. its cheaper to replace belts than engine top end rebuild!

Volkswagen Golf IV - cam belt replacement - jonny10buds

My understanding is it's due at 60,000 miles, 35,000 seems a bit premature although they have been known to break sooner. My worry with doing it early is are the replacement parts/belt tension etc going to be as good as the factory built engine?

Volkswagen Golf IV - cam belt replacement - pcjcunited

I have just recently checked whether mine is due and have looked in the service manual where it states it had new cambelt fitted @ 48500 miles. I am now on nearly 78000 miles and do about 12-14 k a year max. The book states, i think, that cambelt change is every 60k in Golf Diesels so mine was initially changed early anyway.

From an experts point of view, and without knowing what i am looking at from a physical check, could you guys give me an idea when it is probably due again and ultimatly that what the book states is correct?

Cheers in advance!

Volkswagen Golf IV - cam belt replacement - 659FBE

As stated earlier in this thread, my opinion based on the examination of components I have removed from several engines, including my own, is that the change intervals as dictated by the VAG (D) documentation supplied with the vehicle is reasonable.

Other information provided by the importers is not, in my opinion reasonable and has been put there for profit.

60k miles is well within the capability of this drive; the importer's 4 year limit can have no relevance - after all, belt technology is common to all makes of engines and some will run for 10 years with the sanction of the engine builder.

I would prefer, however to change a belt after 6 years' use. The idlers and tensioners together with the water pump are a greater source of weakness than the belt itself.

659.

Volkswagen Golf IV - cam belt replacement - pcjcunited

Thanks 659!

Volkswagen Golf IV - cam belt replacement - Collos25

I guess that you haven't looked at many used cambelts.

Volkswagen Golf IV - cam belt replacement - madf

"after all, belt technology is common to all makes of engines "

No . There are differences in width of belts.. and some do last much longer than design lives.. and some don't.

And some makers fit dodgy tensioners which are part of the technology.

And some idiots use water pumps to tension the belts (GM)..

Any suggestion that GM are a competent design company is of course a bad joke..

Volkswagen Golf IV - cam belt replacement - 659FBE

Don't confuse materials technology with applications engineering.

VAG M-K will argue that the belt material degrades significantly after 4 years in operation - hence their stipulation of a belt change after this period. This, despite the fact that belt drive systems fitted to competitor's engines use precisely the same belt materials, idler materials and bearing lubricants.

The key factor relating to technology considerations is simply that no engine manufacturer makes either the belts or the rollers. The materials used are the same in all cases for a given life requirement.

Applications engineering is entirely different. Belts which are too narrow for their duty, belts which have a total number of teeth integrally divisible by the number of crankwheel teeth and poor quality idlers with poor lubricant retention are all examples of bad applications engineering. There are many others.

Other than the number of belt teeth, I have not identified any dubious applications engineering in the later VAG diesel (not petrol) timing drives. The maker's maintenance recommendations would appear to support this. The importer's recommendations are replicated nowhere else on the planet to my knowledge, for an identical range of engines.

659.

Edited by 659FBE on 23/09/2010 at 18:51

Volkswagen Golf IV - cam belt replacement - Collos25

It does not matter a jot about engineering and all the previous clap trap,belts deteriate for whatever the reason and differently with different use and car manufacturers correctly give a average lifetime before the belt and ancilliries have to be changed to be safe.Like I have previously said you have not looked at many destroyed engines due to the lack of cam belt changing.Just for the record to my knowledge there are four european belt manufacturers with Continental making the so called no change belt but even they say change at 150k km to be safe

Volkswagen Golf IV - cam belt replacement - 659FBE

I wonder how you know how many or how few engines I've examined which have suffered broken camshaft drives?

Continental are an OE supplier to VAG whose UK importers recommend a belt change after 4 years of use. Lifetime belt - there's an inconsistency somewhere here...

Has it occurred to you that VAG are unique in supplying 2 sets of cambelt change recommendations with each vehicle they sell in the UK - one in the printed service book and another from the importers/dealers?

How decomposed do you need the rat to be?

659.

Volkswagen Golf IV - cam belt replacement - Collos25

There are people who err towards safety and those who take unesserssary wrisks ,with the average cost of a belt change probably around £250 and the cost of a new engine at many thousands of pounds I know which course I would take.Theory is all very well but its the real world that counts.