VW Touran - gear box failure after only 28,000m, repair £3600 - hanazono100

Hello,

The gear box on our VW Touran (2006/56) failed after only 28,000 miles, and the garage tells us it'll cost £3600 to get it repaired.

We bought it at about 26,500 miles from autoquake.com about 7 months ago and only did about 1,500 miles since then.

We think the car was not fit for purpose under the sales of goods act, and would like to take someone to small claims court over this. Who should we take to court - autoquake.com from whom we bought it, VW Newbolds in Mansfield who sold the car to the previous owner (only one previous owner), or VW for making such a shoddy product in the first place?

Many thanks for any advice!

VW Touran - gear box failure after only 28,000m, repair £3600 - LucyBC
It looks like AutoQuake took title to the car in which case the claim is against them. Above 6 months ownership adds complications as to failure. Can you provide additional detailed information as to what happened?
VW Touran - gear box failure after only 28,000m, repair £3600 - hanazono100

When we drove recently we suddenly had an error saying something like "engine fault, stop vehicle, oil pressure, garage now". It sounded very dramatic and we were quite worried. A bit before that we had a bit of a crunchy noise when we switched gears. We took it to the garage because of the error message and also mentioned the crunchy noise. The garage checked it and set that the error message was just a settings problem in the trip computer, but the crunchy noise is caused by a fault in the gear box. Frankly this comes as quite a shock as we've not had any problems with the car before and have only run it for about 1,500 miles since we bought it. It just passed its regular service a few weeks ago with no problems.

VW Touran - gear box failure after only 28,000m, repair £3600 - SlidingPillar
"Crunchy" noises on gearchanging in my experience are the clutch. A much more likely failure although I'd not expect it at that milage.
VW Touran - gear box failure after only 28,000m, repair £3600 - LucyBC

£3600 is a very large price for any mechanical fault. Has anyone told you what the precise failure is?

VW Touran - gear box failure after only 28,000m, repair £3600 - hanazono100

The garage said that to repair the gear box will cost nearly the same as getting a new one, and a new one is apparently £3600, including labour etc.

VW Touran - gear box failure after only 28,000m, repair £3600 - LucyBC
Well I don't know where you live but if you look at this website they will supply and fit a reconditioned one for a Touran for £895 plus VAT

www.reconditionedgearboxes.com/gearboxes/volkswage...n?

Before you buy it be aware that complete gearbox failure should not occur after 28,000 miles so you need to be talking to the firm who supplied the vehicle and probably also to Volkswagen. Is there any warranty on the car?
VW Touran - gear box failure after only 28,000m, repair £3600 - hanazono100

The manufacturer's warranty has expired (the car is about 4 years old), but we bought an extended warranty and we expect it'll cover this. But already we're having a few problems: the garage is telling us that we should put a new gear box in right away (which would take 2 days), as getting the old one repaired will be nearly as expensive, but the insurance company insists on getting the gear box checked to find out what the exact problem is, which will take about two weeks (the gear box has to be sent to a specialist investigation company, then returned for the insurance company's engineer to inspect it), and as a result we need to hire a car for our summer holiday starting next week.

But what I really want to know is if we have any case against VW or the firm who supplied the vehicle, in case we have any expenses caused by the gear box failure (like the car hire mentioned above) or an excess that the insurance company will not cover - because as you say, the gear box should not fail on a 4 year old car with only 28,000 miles. I've read up on the problem on German blogs, and it seems to be a common problem with Tourans built in 2006 - so it's really up to VW to get this sorted, they've made a shoddy product not fit for purpose, not of merchandisable quality.

VW Touran - gear box failure after only 28,000m, repair £3600 - LucyBC
The garage is attempting to charge you £3600 for a repair which I have indicated others will do by providing and fitting a replacement gearbox for £900. Does that not tell you anything?

Furthermore if you proceed with the garage's version of events - which they are clearly rushing you into - you have no prospects of claiming on the warranty or against the firm who sold you the car as you have to offer them an option to resolve it.

Furthermore VW are unlikely to help unless the issue is dealt with by prior agreement and (assuming you get any support from them) they will understandably want it dealt with by someone within their dealer network so they have some control as to the quality of work undertaken.

In terms of advising you the problem is you are coming on here with half a story.

You have given no indication as to the precise nature of the problem.

You should spend less time reading German blogs and more on finding about what the issue is in order that we can give practical advice about who to approach regarding fixing it.
VW Touran - gear box failure after only 28,000m, repair £3600 - bonzo dog

My question is this: is the garage who is asking you to pay for a new box the same who did the service? It's just they they would have a vested interest in NOT allowing the warranty co to inspect the car. My view would be to insist on a warranty inpection as this will tell YOU what has caused the failure. What does the garage believe has caused it?

VW Touran - gear box failure after only 28,000m, repair £3600 - hanazono100

Actually neither we nor the garage know yet what's causing the problem, it's simply a noise when switching from first to second gear (but not every time we switch). The insurance company have asked us to instruct the garage to take the gear box out so that it can be sent off to a specialist company that disassembles it. Only then will we know what the actual problem is, but we will have incurred a lot of costs just for all the labour involved (that's what's prompted the garage to say it'll probably work out not much more to put a new gear box in). But the insurance company want us to do it this way as they say they have to know what the problem is. The garage have a very good reputation (so people say who I've asked about it), apart from being a bit more expensive than others.

But my real point is how can this happen on a 4 year old car with 28,000 miles, and shouldn't VW be dealing with it straight away, as the gear box is obviously of poor quality? Shouldn't the insurance company get VW to deal with it? And we obviously would prefer a new gear box to a repaired one from a model year that is known to have problems - how long till the next problem will occur with a different gear?

VW Touran - gear box failure after only 28,000m, repair £3600 - LucyBC

VW have no liability in this. They may make a contribution as a gesture of goodwill if it is to be fixed by a dealer but the only recourse you may have under consumer legislation is against the garage which sold you the vehicle.

If you are to pursue a SOGA claim - and I am far from sure that you have one - you have to give them the chance to rectify it. You cannot just take it to someone who will charge you 4x the going rate to fix a fault that has not even been diagnosed.

It seems the warranty companby believe you may have a claim on their warranty and they have given you a course of action which you must follow if they are to pay out.

If you don't follow that course of action they have every right to refuse your claim and leave you with the £3600 bill meaning you will have no recourse against anyone.

VW Touran - gear box failure after only 28,000m, repair £3600 - hanazono100

> VW have no liability in this. They may make a contribution as a gesture of goodwill if it is to be fixed by a dealer but the only recourse you may have under consumer legislation is against the garage which sold you the vehicle.

Thanks for the info, but why do VW have no liability in this? And why are you not sure I have a case against the garage which sold the vehicle, or against VW? The garage may not have noticed the problem during their checks. After all, we only noticed it a few days ago, and the car is still driving fine (even in second gear). In my eyes VW are at fault as the gear box should have lasted much longer.

I'm happy to follow the course of action the insurance company have given me but I'm worried that they'll try hard to find a reason not to pay out, considering the large amount of money involved, leaving me with a huge bill caused by something which really is not our fault and that the dealer or VW are responsible for.

VW Touran - gear box failure after only 28,000m, repair £3600 - oilrag

Hi, Hanazone, Welcome to the Forum.

Just a note (as I`m not sure you`re aware) to let you know that LucyBC is the forum`s official legal expert. She`s a lawyer working in a law firm as well as advising here.

We will will likely be doing some changes to the site to make that more obvious in the near future.

Hope you soon fiind a resolution to your problem.

oilrag ( Moderator)

Edited by oilrag on 26/07/2010 at 07:48

VW Touran - gear box failure after only 28,000m, repair £3600 - hanazono100

Hi oilrag,

>Just a note (as I`m not sure you`re aware) to let you know that LucyBC is the forum`s official legal expert. She`s a lawyer working in a law firm as well as advising here.

Thanks for letting me know, no, I wasn't aware of this!

Hi LucyBC,

Thanks for all you advice, however it would be very helpful for us to understand why you don't think we have a case of a SOGA claim against VW or the dealer. Many other posts I've read on the Internet say that a failed gear box after only 28,000m on a 4 year old car is a case of "not fit for purpose".

VW Touran - gear box failure after only 28,000m, repair £3600 - oilrag

"Thanks for letting me know, no, I wasn't aware of this!"

That`s useful feedback on how we (the Forum) are perceived by new members, Hanazone, Thanks.

VW Touran - gear box failure after only 28,000m, repair £3600 - LucyBC

The contract is with the person that sold it to you. Volkswagen may make a contribution on a vehicle with this mileage (depending on the fault) but unless you can show a widespread defect in manufacture their liability is likely to be limited to the warranty period.

The Sale of Goods Act gives you some protection for the first 6 months after purchase from the firm that sold it to you but that it is a four year old vehicle (albeit with limited mileage) will be taken into account.

Had you been reporting faults throughout the time you owned the vehicle then the court might well have accepted that there was a pre-exisiting fault at the time you bought it but on a second hand vehicle the further you get into the six months the less likely the court are to make the garage 100% responsible for the repair.

You appear to have bought the car in January and we are now (almost) in August. If the fault occurred after the six month period then the onus changes - a SOGA claim is still possible but you have to show that the fault was there when you bought the car - it is not for the garage to prove that it was not.

In any event if you just instruct the garage to repair the car you will not have fulfilled either the conditions of SoGA nor indeed the warranty nor indeed fulfilled your legal duty to mitigate your losses (by minimising the costs) and will have little or no chance of recovering anything from anyone.

VW Touran - gear box failure after only 28,000m, repair £3600 - hanazono100

Dear LucyBC,

Thanks very much for your detailed replies. We'll certainly wait and see what the insurance company says - we very much hope they'll say they'll cover it, but we're afraid that they'll say it's a pre-existing condition (ie the gear box was faulty all along right from the beginning, it just didn't show until we came across the noise last week and it also didn't come up in the regular service that we had done in June) and they'll use that to wiggle out of their obligations. We just want to be prepared for this case - otherwise we'll suddenly have a car in the garage with no gear box in it, the insurance not paying a penny and us not knowing how to proceed. We should know the result of the inspection sometime next week.

>You appear to have bought the car in January and we are now (almost) in August. If the fault occurred after the six month period then the onus changes - a SOGA claim is still possible but you have to show that the fault was there when you bought the car - it is not for the garage to prove that it was not.

We bought it in late November but hardly used it until February as we were away most of the time, and even since then only used it for about 1500 miles. I guess the insurance company will provide the solution - either they'll pay for it, or they say something like the gear box was faulty all along and won't pay - in which case, would we have a case against the dealer despite it being more than 6 months?

VW Touran - gear box failure after only 28,000m, repair £3600 - m yeomans

I have followed all the messages relating to the VW g/box fault. We too suffered the total failure of our g/box in April this year. VW Touran 2007 car was 2 months out of warranty, full VW service history, with 58,000 on the clock. Our failure happened with no warning causing massive spillage of oil on the road and the total siezure of the box whilst travelling. We could have been seriously hurt. Several things have come of this. One I quickly realised this was a well reported and known fault and that VW would be very difficult to deal with in terms of goodwill towards repair costs or complaint on safety issues as other owners have had a similar negative response to compaints or requests for financial compensation. VW have a very aggressive and defensive customer care system. New g/box etc was £2,500. Amongst other things I have raised this as a safety issue with VOSA, who have invited me to find out if anyone else who has suffered sudden and total g/box failure whilst driving have been injured or created an incident /hazard for other road users. VW are saying this is a low speed failure (if it occurs - though they say it is not a commonly reported fault) and is not a safety issue. I believe this is not the case.It is an intrinsic fault at either manufacture or assembly of which they are well award. I can give anybody who feels they can contribute to this the contact details of the technical representative at VOSA, who you can contact direct. It is not necessary to go through myself as a third party.

VW Touran - gear box failure after only 28,000m, repair £3600 - bob disdell

If the car is less than 6 years old,has been regularly serviced according to manufacturers spec and providing mileage is reasonable.say less than 60,000 miles,then under the sale of goods act you can argue the goods are not fit for the purpose.

Specifically,gearbos and diff components really should last life of car,certainly more than 100,000 miles.

Take the dealership to court under small claims action,dont let VW CUSTOMER SERVICE PUT YOU OFF.

We took VW Dealership to court for a gearbox failure on our VW Touran after 28,000 miles and 12 months out of warranty and won full cost of repair plus court costs.

VW know of these faults but continue to say they have never heard of these faults.

Bob Disdell

VW Touran - gear box failure after only 28,000m, repair £3600 - bob disdell

If the car is less than 6 years old,has been regularly serviced according to manufacturers spec and providing mileage is reasonable.say less than 60,000 miles,then under the sale of goods act you can argue the goods are not fit for the purpose.

Specifically,gearbos and diff components really should last life of car,certainly more than 100,000 miles.

Take the dealership to court under small claims action,dont let VW CUSTOMER SERVICE PUT YOU OFF.

We took VW Dealership to court for a gearbox failure on our VW Touran after 28,000 miles and 12 months out of warranty and won full cost of repair plus court costs.

VW know of these faults but continue to say they have never heard of these faults.

Bob Disdell

VW Touran - gear box failure after only 28,000m, repair £3600 - bob disdell

We had gearbox faul on VW Toran after 26,000 miles and 12 months out of warranty.

Took VW Dealership to small claims court and won full cost of gearbox plus repair,despite having car repaired at a non VW Garage,and having servicing done by non VW Garage.

It took 15 months,but under sale of goods act up to 6 years from new the car gearbox was not fit for purpose.

Simply take out small claims court summons against garage you bought car from.

Bob Disdell

VW Touran - gear box failure after only 28,000m, repair £3600 - LucyBC

It's simply not true that any gearbox failure within six years will automatically justify a claim under the sale of goods act.

Factors variously coming in to pay will include age of vehicle, mileage of vehicle, service history and nature of fault.

If the servicing is of an acceptable standard - by which it means it matches the manufacturers requirements and recommendations - then where the vehicle has been serviced will not matter - indeed it is illegal to discriminate against a serviceing garage because they do not have a franchise - but it can come into play on super-extended warranties which make dealer servicing part of the terms of conditions of getting the warranty.

Under any SoGA claim you must give the supplying garage the option to fix the fault - you cannot just take it where you want.

VW Touran - gear box failure after only 28,000m, repair £3600 - gfewster

Pray tell, how much 'service history' would anyone expect to see relating to a gearbox. I doubt if the schedule even includes ever checking the oil level, let alone changing it. There is no 'servicing' on a modern gearbox.

VW Touran - gear box failure after only 28,000m, repair £3600 - Collos25

I would suppose they would say because the car was not regulary serviced that they did not have a chance to to tell the customer in their opinion the gearbox was developing a fault.

VW Touran - gear box failure after only 28,000m, repair £3600 - LucyBC
As Andy says it is a visual and aural check.

I was making the point that there is no automatic right to claim for a failed gearbox under the Sale of Goods Act for up to six years (as had been wrongly claimed in previous posts).
VW Touran - gear box failure after only 28,000m, repair £3600 - Simon Joy

Hello Everyone,

I saw this thread stopped in 2010, but i am hoping it can be reopened and help from others greatfully recieved.

We bought a VW Touran with DSG gearbox in early Novermber 2016, and the car was a 2012 model. In late April 2017 the gearbox just went while driving (30mph) and after stopping i was just left with 2nd and reverse.

I bought the car from a privite dealership, which was RAC approved and the car came through with a 3 month all parts cover from the RAC after purchase. The gearbox failed approx 6 and half months after purchase.

The car has a full service history, 57,235 miles at time of breakdown, and is 5.5 years old. It has a clean bill given to it by the garage and the RAC before selling. It had 2 owners before i purchased it.

I spent £2,450 getting this fixed by my local serviving garage who i have always used. They had to send it to a specialist to get repaired. 3 and half weeks later the gearbox wnet again, and it is back at my local servicing garage who have sent it back to the gearbox specialists.

So my questions are, after reading al the threads, can anyone help with my next steps, should i.....................

a) Contact the original garage to ask them for a contribution to the repairs from the 1st breakdown.

b) if the garage says no, can i seek a SOGA claim against them?

Basically is there anything i can positiviely do to try and recoup all the costs that i have been left with? Such a shame as the Touran is a lovely car!!!!!!!!!

Thanks

Si

VW Touran - gear box failure after only 28,000m, repair £3600 - RobJP

a) Contact the original garage to ask them for a contribution to the repairs from the 1st breakdown.

b) if the garage says no, can i seek a SOGA claim against them?

Basically is there anything i can positiviely do to try and recoup all the costs that i have been left with? Such a shame as the Touran is a lovely car!!!!!!!!!

Thanks

Si

a) No. They have zero liability to you in law. If the fault had occurred within 6 months of purchase, then it would be a different matter - the fault would have been presumed to have been 'present or developing' at the time of sale. But basically, the CRA states that presumption runs out after 6 months for a used vehicle. You could try for a 'goodwill' contribution, but I suspect your letter would be filed in the bin.

b). No, you can't. Even if the fault had occurred within 6 months, you would HAVE to have given the selling garage the first right to attempt a fix. The CRA (consumer rights act, SOGA no longer applies these days) does not allow you to unilaterally go elsewhere, get a fix carried out, and then go back to the vendor to claim a contribution to that fix.

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news. Those gearboxes are pretty notorious for problems. A few minutes of reading in the 'what's good/bad' section on here for VW DSG autoboxes would have stopped you buying in the first place, I suspect.

VW Touran - gear box failure after only 28,000m, repair £3600 - Simon Joy

Thanks Rob for that,

And yes talking to a few people and mechanics now, Gernerally all DSG's are pretty bad. I wonder when the manufacturers will go a different route.

I was chekcing the timings on the purchase problems, we bought the car on the 09th Novermber and the breakdown was actually on the 25th April so that does fall within the 6 months i believe.

But when i had the breakdown, i still wasnt aware of the whole story with DSG's in gerneral and VW, so i took it on myslef to get the car fixed without goign to the delaership. I was aware that the warrenty had expired and so decided to get this fixed myself.

From what you have mentioned, i maybe falling within the 6 month time period which will help, but have i ruined my case by not contacting the dealer first when the problem first happened?

Thanks

Simon

VW Touran - gear box failure after only 28,000m, repair £3600 - skidpan

but have i ruined my case by not contacting the dealer first when the problem first happened?

In a word yes.

In law you are required to give the seller the opportunity to fix the problem. Getting it fixed elsewhere give them a get out of jail free card.

Best to put this one down to experience.

VW Touran - gear box failure after only 28,000m, repair £3600 - RobJP

but have i ruined my case by not contacting the dealer first when the problem first happened?

In a word yes.

In law you are required to give the seller the opportunity to fix the problem. Getting it fixed elsewhere give them a get out of jail free card.

Best to put this one down to experience.

As skidpan has said.

Whilst you might, possibly, get lucky if you took it to a courtroom, and a judge could potentially make an award in your favour, I'd not think it very likely. But apart from that, you'd be relying on any 'goodwill' that the garage might decide to contribute.

Put yourself in their shoes. They sold you a car, and never heard of any problems. Seven months after the sale, you rock up on their doorstep, and say "Sorry, the gearbox broke. I've had it repaired, here's the bill for £2,500. Any chance of a cheque ?"

They've not had a chance to inspect, to potentially put the car through their own workshop (possibly reducing the repair costs). Hell, as far as they might know, you and the repair garage owner might well be working together to rip them off.

VW Touran - gear box failure after only 28,000m, repair £3600 - gordonbennet

And yes talking to a few people and mechanics now, Gernerally all DSG's are pretty bad. I wonder when the manufacturers will go a different route.

Only when people stop buying, and that has to be the used car buyers or those who keep the cars long term, those who buy new and sell at warranty expiry it doesn't matter how poor the product.

The problem being most people don't do their research before buying.

VW Touran - gear box failure after only 28,000m, repair £3600 - scot22

I hold my hand up to that. My car choice was based on very limited knowledge. For example, I hadn't a clue how unsuitable a diesel is for my motoring. Fortunately I discovered this forum - never bought another car since ! I know I will do and be better informed.

VW Touran - gear box failure after only 28,000m, repair £3600 - gordonbennet

I hold my hand up to that. My car choice was based on very limited knowledge.

Hasn't it involved some hours of reading investigating and digesting information Scot, to furnish yourself with that knowledge, much of which of course will be out of date again in but a few years when they've shifted all the goal posts in the name of progress, so it's a constant thing.

Then there's the question of where do you get your info, and what vested interests might be behind whatever advice you are reading at any time, it's a minefield out there, look at the differences here in our little community in how we decide on what to buy and how to look after it.

Confess i'm way out of touch with the modern vehicle, i'm lumbered with modern lorries in my work, and thats more then enough exposure to reverse progress thanks all the same, and have no wish to be involved with anything built after the mid noughties for my own personal transport, hence why i'm more inclined to overmaintain in order to help my older cars last as long as possible.

Edited by gordonbennet on 09/06/2017 at 22:09

 

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