My dads neighbour owns a 3 series BMW which cannot cope in snow and ice. The chap has taken to borrowing my dads ancient Rover 216 estate to get the 20 odd miles to work and back.
He is toying with the idea of buying a small four wheel drive car for use when the going gets tough. They all live up a narrow country lane so there will be other times when something a little higher up and rugged would be useful.
I would reccommend him a Fiat Panda but are there any other small 4x4's around which are equally as good and cheap to tax, insure and maintain?
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Sounds like a job for a Suzuki Jimny.
Unless he feels like trying some, wait for it.....................
.......winter tyres on the BMW.
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Something small and japanese maybe, like a Suzuki or Daihatsu. If they are not going really off road then a non-turbo Subaru Impreza can be cheap, tough and reliable, with the bonus its good to drive on normal road conditions.
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Not had any personal experience but the Suzuki Jimny is popular round the edges of the Peak District. Looks very compact and handy in dodgy conditions.
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I have two fwd cars and a 4x4. All, especially the Qashqai cope fine in the snow. I am moved to wonder though if modern snow must be slippier than the old kind ? Back in the motoring dark ages we mainly had only rwd cars. I certainly don't remember getting more stuck than now. I clearly recall driving through Glencoe in a drifting blizzard in a Cavalier Mk1 without too much trouble.
;-)
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I like the idea of "slippier snow" :-)
In my limited experience of driving in snow (last 8yrs), cars do seem to be getting worse at getting through it.
My first car was a mk2 Astra GL, which probably weighed a lot less than my current Golf. The Astra went around like a mountain goat, where as my Golf's ESP trips on at the slightest thing and makes it struggle over a frozen puddle.
I also attribute a lot of lost grip in snow to the wider tyres on new (er) cars not giving as much grip. I think my Astra had 175's where as my Golf has 205's............
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You are of course correct Nick and I'm really only teasing. I don't genuinely think the modern generation are all lily livered wusses. Some of them are of course.....
;-)
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Too late - it will be another 15 yrs before it snows again ;-)
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Someone I know has just sold their 02 Golf TDi for an 04 Jimny. The already have an 01 soft top, now they have a hardtop version aswell. They live in the middle of nowhere and seem to rate them very highly.
I drove one once, not a handler by any means, but a spirited little thing and I can see why people find them useful. Daihatsu Terios is similar vein, just a slightly bigger 5dr and better equipped usually.
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One of the best small 4x4's was the original Panda 4x4. Very lightweight, skinny M+S tyres. Cars are so much heavier and usually with wider wheels so not so good in the snow. Especially in the UK on the all-purpose tyres we use even in winter.
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One of the best small 4x4's was the original Panda 4x4.
IIRC wasn't it also one of the slowest, >20s 0-60? Not that it necessarily matters in places where you need 4wd.
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It amazes me that people can go the extent of buying a different car for winter yet they won't invest in winter tyres!
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Set of winter tyres for BMW 3 series: 500-600 quid, I guess.
Suzuki Jimny - £2000 or under.
The OP did say some extra ground clearance would be helpful, so if he's got the extra 1500 notes to spare, and the space to store the Jimny, why not? Not everyone makes every decision based on cost alone. Might even get a cheap one myself, seeing as we run two cars and to get them fully winter tyred would cost over a grand, easily. I've got room in the garage too so could SORN it most of the year and buy daily insurance when needed.
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WRT 'winter tyres' are we talking about what used to be called 'town and country' (i.e. chunkier tread) tyres, or proper studded snow tyres? I could cope with changing all four wheels twice a year, but not twice a week!
Here in the sunny (allegedly) Isle of Wight, everything has ground to a halt with the biggest snowfall in about 30 years. The main roads seem passable, although there is no public transport and the problem with most journeys is the last half-mile, especially if there's a hill involved. I'm staying put!
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Winter tyres are not necessarily studded. The ones I use are simply a different compound that behaves better in low temperatures and a tread pattern optimized for snow and lots of rain. They are not that expensive because normally one gets a narrower profile than the alloys on the car. For a BMW 3 series it should be possible to equip the car with a set of tyres for 250 quid, plus maybe 150 for the steel rims. Something of that order. You only need to buy the rims once, of course. After that putting winter tyres on doesn't add to the expense because you are using them only when you are not using the normal tyres. It's not hard, and it works.
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movilogo, you're not wrong with your amazement. A set of winter tyres will probably last a few winters and sticking them on some old wheels will mean your nice alloys never suffer through the winter.
If we had more winters like this I might do the same if it was my car I was driving. If I opt out and take the cash then I might just do winter tyres. My newish front tyres on the Mazda6 seem to be doing quite well.
As for the Panda 4x4 being slow - so what ;-)
A relative used to have a house on farmland and the road up was "poor" so they got an old Land Rover that they used for the trip up to and from the house and then got in the car. It was private land so no insurance needed for it. Cheaper than building the road.
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I like the idea of "slippier snow" :-)
It's called having much wider tyres, lots more power and drivers who have no idea how to drive in adverse conditions..
My Austin A35 had less than 40bhp and 145 (?) tyres at best.. and went through snow easily helped by its high ground clearance..
A modern 1.0Yaris has 175 tyres and 55 bhp.. and less ground clearance...
Edited by madf on 06/01/2010 at 15:27
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My Mazda6 (diesel so around 143bhp and lots of torque - 360Nm) is fine on very little or no throttle where appropriate. But on tricky roads you still get the silly drivers trying to make you go faster. There are so many that don't understand how to drive on the roads when the weather has been like this.
Most cars with the right tyres and more importantly with the correct driving style will be fine.
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"I would reccommend him a Fiat Panda"
So would HJ, it seems:
www.honestjohn.co.uk/carbycar/index.htm?md=883
FWIW, I think they look 'right' - the 2WD Panda looks chic, IMHO, but 4WD looks purposeful as well.
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" was trapped in Atlanta (Stone Mountain, actually) one Feb (?) weekend about 20 years ago when a snow-bearing hurricane blew in. State of emergency in 12 eastern states. Impressive. No flights out for 4 days. Lived on doughnnuts, wearing coats, in a motel with no electricity.
When we did get power, ALL the TV stations were on weather and nothing else at all. A senior cop came on appealing for 4×4 drives to STAY HOME because ?Your all-terrain ve-hi-cull simply means that you can can stuck in places other ve-hi-culls can?t get to. Including ours. That means you will be in bad trouble longer than anyone else. Please stay home.?
www2.politicalbetting.com/index.php/archives/2010/...0
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Read my previous posts re my Jimny. Brilliant little thing, bought for the shooting season lugging 2 labradors about (AND I FANCIED ONE ANYWAY!!!) Have survived 22 years in rural North devon without 4x4 but for sure I wouldn't be without it now. Got to work today to earn a quid. Got a colleague home last night ('S' type no go on snow) and of course I can get out to assist family, neighbours, friends and even get to the shops.
My 4x4 good. Blonde tarmac 4x4 carp. But who am I.........................
MD
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Martin, do tell us, which labrador do you fancy????? :)
I remember 23 years ago, my sister was due to give birth and weather was like it is currently. One of her friends had a Suzuki SJ413 and he was on standby and eventually ran her into hospital when her time was due. It was the canvas top version as well!!
Was great fun in the snow and from what I remember , proved very effective in particularly deep snow drifts.
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Martin do tell us which labrador do you fancy????? :)
Bobby G. I DON'T LIKE YOU!! Fancy that eh!. That's another mistake I made in my efforts to post too quickly!! lol
For just a grand (£) it is a sterling little machine and has more benefits than just a 4x4.
Bonus 1. I can fit in it!
Bonus 2. Two adults can sit in the back without discomfort for those short trips without me having to scarifice MY legroom.
Bonus 3. Park it anywhere.
Bonus 4. Easy access and egress.
Bonus 5. I can get to the Off Licence when it is snowing!!
Cor. When did you last hear of Off Licence? Answers on a post card please.
Best regards to all....MD
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We used to have a late MkI (99V) 5dr auto 2.0 RAV4 GX which was pretty good.
Permanent 4WD with switchable gearing ratios and it had high profile skinny Dunlop Grandtreks on steel wheels. No problems at all on snowy/icy roads.
It was an excellent car in all respects that we would still have now if it were not for the need of three proper rear seats.
Should be able to pick one of these up cheaply (not sure if the 3dr is similarly specced however)
Edited by Marc on 06/01/2010 at 23:26
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What about a second hand old style CRV? 4x4 when you need it, 2WD when you don't. And based on the old civic floor pan, isn't as big as it looks. And being a Honda, it'll go on forever.
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Just a thought for the OP, but as he's proved that the old Rover 216 works just fine, then surely the answer to his quest is.... and old Rover 216??!!
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