As I come to the end of my search for new car (I think I'd decided on an Octavia VRs-the Mazda 6 was too expensive), I've suddenly had a fly thrown into the ointment.
Somebody mentioned an X Type estate. You can pick up a main dealer, 09reg, 2.2d sport premium estate for approx£17500. Fully equipped with leather/sat nav etc etc. I know the Jag is going out of production, but it seems to now be the car it always should have been.
I don't buy into the pipe and slippers image, the sport looks pretty good. But the million pound question is....is it going to be a depreciation disaster. I've also no idea what a Jag costs to service...I expect it's a premium rate.
So opinions as always welcome.
Edited by midlifecrisis on 18/11/2009 at 20:58
|
mlc,
Have had one for nearly 5 years (2.0 diesel SE estate). Had it virtually from new (demonstrator) and now showing 50k mileage. Wife's car, but we use it for all long journeys.
Well happy with it. Willing to give you the gen in an e-mail if you wish. Ask a Mod nicely and send me your e-mail if you wish and i'll send you a full reply. I can dig out the service sheets and go through the history file.
There are no real problems with it, it's been very reliable. Couple of pernickety things e.g. rear boot window catch x 2.
|
Sent MLC your e-mail.
Rob
|
|
|
Do they have al wheel drive or was that only the 2.5 petrols?
|
2.5 and 3.0 petrols were AWD.
2.1 petrol and both diesels (2.0 and 2.2) all FWD
|
Almost 6,000 miles covered in my 2.2d SE auto estate since July and I've enjoyed every one of them. Being an auto it's a bit heavier on fuel round town (30ish), but the standard kit and comfort more than make up for it. It's a real motorway mile muncher, but not a car you feel you want to drive at break neck speeds and I can get mid 40s mpg on a motorway run.
I've had one minor issue with a faulty door lock which was replaced under warranty.
I was quoted £313 for a main dealer 12,500 mile service when they called me saying it was due. The first one was free as it fell within 4 months of me having the car.
There are plenty of Jaguar specialists out there who will service it for less and I have a good one not far away so will be using them.
BTW in recent weeks I have given a lift to a couple of people, neither believed it was a diesel - the cabin is very quiet once the engine is warmed up.
|
|
|
|
Make sure you have a good run in the X-type, MLC. It's a tribute to an Octavia that it can be compared with a Jaguar, and I have to say that I prefer the Octavia vRS to drive.
The X-type I tried had a very fierce clutch, unsupportive seats and some dodgy finish where you weren't supposed to look (the boot carpet, for example, came from the same stable a a Ford Ka). But Westpig and Daveyjp love theirs, so as ever it'll be a matter of your personal taste.
Depreciation - What Car's table suggests 34 % retained value after 3 years for the X-type, 44 % for the vRS, but if you buy nearly-new someone else has taken a slice of that loss.
Again according to What car, servicing over 3 years presuming average mileage, is £869 for the Skoda, £1,218 for the Jaguar.
There's also a 0 % VAT deal on Skodas at the moment, and they sometimes do free servicing offers (as fortunately applies to mine).
|
Jag is much smaller inside and has much smaller boot, and it is the previous model Mondeo underneath so expect some ribbing.
VRs has the performance and more space.
Depends what you want, the two are not really comparable.
Would also expect Skoda dealers to be better to deal with.
|
I would sit in both cars and see how they make you feel (i'm sure both cars are very competent)
You will know the one you want to live with for the next few years
Would you choose one wife over another because she was going to cost you an extra £100 a year?, go with your heart, and enjoy
|
Would you choose one wife over another because she was going to cost you an extra £100 a year?
Probably! :)
A person on another forum has just had a service on a 2.2 sport and it cost £400. My primary concern is that in 3-4 years time, the Jag will be a 'forgotten' model that will be difficult to sell on.
Westpig-email on it's way.
|
|
|
I looked at and test drove the 2l X Type estate but ended up buying an Octavia Elegance. With the Mk1 Octavia I found the rear leg room in particular was cramped for passengers, especially as I am 6' 3" or thereabouts. The jag was very nice but the cabin was cramped for the driver and I found the top of the windscreen was low, although headroom OK due to a domed effect, which could easily lead to neckache I thought. Also in the Jag with the seat set up for me there was no, and I mean no, legroom in the back. Also the Octavia as you will know has a cavernous and deep boot which more than matched the X Type estate for my needs. So overall the Jag did not exceed the Octavia in any significant respect apart from the wood and leather finish. I have no reason to regret my purchase, and incidentally bought a DSG with the MFSW that I know you are after. In fact, I find with the radio buttons being so close to hand there is no real need to use them, and the cruise control on the stalk is much easier to use than the steering wheel controls on my previous Octavia.
MGs
|
|
What does your heart say ? Forget this sensible approach !!!!
|
|
Heart says an Alfa 159 Ti sportswagon, but I'm afraid that's right out of the price range! :)
|
Make sure there's enough room for your feet in the pedal box of the Jag.
The manual saloon I looked at had no room to the left of the clutch, which ruled it out for me.
I test drove an auto - very agreeable - but just too much money for my budget.
The auto in 2.2D form is meant to be slightly de-tuned becuase the auto box can't cope with the torgue of a fully tuned 2.2D.
Still went well, so I reckon a manual 2.2D would have plenty of poke.
I reckon a Jag still has a certain something that the likes of Ford(!), Skoda, Vauxhall, etc can't match.
Edited by ifithelps on 19/11/2009 at 09:46
|
>Avant: Depreciation - What Car's table suggests 34 % retained value after 3 years for the X-type, 44 % for the vRS, but if you buy nearly-new someone else has taken a slice of that loss.
Maybe an idea to look at a few 3-year-old Jags and save yourself 66%.
|
I had a few diesel X-types & the 2.2d was by far the best. Seriously full of grunt & very quiet & very smooth. In fact the guy that bought my 2.2d had a V6 x-type & he assured me the diesel was quieter & definatley performed better than his 2.5 V6 AWD!
The 2.2 has 400nm torque at 1900rpm! & the 2.0d 320-360NM Approx with over-boost
The auto 2.2 is detuned to approx 340nm.
I thoroughly enjoyed mine. Reliability was excellent. I has one boot lock & headlamp bulbs & the first one needed one injector recoded at 70k but that was it!
Cramped in the back for tall people but I never sat in the back because I always enjoyed driving it.
All cars loose money & all cost money to service but we are not in this world for a practice run at life & life is short so may as well enjoy. I always follow my heart!
|
|
|
>>> Maybe an idea to look at a few 3-year-old Jags and save yourself 66%.
Why not get a brand new one and save 25%? I am.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I spent three weeks looking around for a new car. I don't want a French of Italian car as usually when I set out to drive somewhere I want to get to my intended destination. I ended up probably going for a Skoda, but the showroom reflected the apparent popularity of them. On a Wednesday afternoon at 2.30, it was like B&Q on a Saturday. When eventually I tripped up a salesman rushing to a customer, I did get served, and went for a nice test drive. They are doing VAT off, i.e 15%, but if you order in November you might be lucky and get a car in January. Anyway I suddenly had an idea. I dashed off a quick email to my local Jag dealer saying I have £17k to spend on a diesel estate and I don't suppose they have anything, but I would hate to find out afterwards, that I could have bought a Jag. I got a quick reply that they have one in my 'budget range'. OK I thouhgt, it will be a demonstrator at £17,999. It turns out to be a new unregistered X type 2.0 Diesel Estate with a Convenience Pack included, at £17250 on the road including a years road tax. That makes it over £6000 off list, which is about 25%. I collect it on Saturday.
If anyone wants a Jag for less than the price of a Mondeo or Skoda, you can get them from Sturgess Jaguar, in Leicester. And you get several cups of coffee in cups and saucers when you go there. And the receptionists and service ladies are a cut above the average, in every way. The salesman is perfectly competent, polite and even tactful enough to laugh when I asked what a Convenience Pack is - "Does it come with a toilet in the back?"
I just hope that by the time the warranty expires, someone will have made a flywheel which is one solid block of cast iron instead of two tin lids stuck together with chewing gum. Does anyone know why they exist?
|
Have had a lift in a new Octavia estate, no way does it have more room than an X-Type estate.
I reckon the Ford 2.0 / 2.2 chain cam diesel engine is a peach, a very good reason to buy a (manual) X-Type diesel. And as for the 34 % retained value after 3 years for the X-type, 44 % for the Skoda, that Jag is retaining 34% of nearly 30 grand so should be worth £10k after three years, more surely that the Skoda that costs maybe 20 grand new, 44% being £8800.
£20k Skoda for £17.5k, £30k Jag for £17.5k, hmm lets see ... ...
|
Gasgas a little more realistically thinks he's saving £6,000 (rather than £13,000), so 34% of list price is something like £7,750.
But good luck - the X-type is a good car, perhaps not developed and improved as much as it might have been. Better than an Octavia in some ways, not as good in others.
If Midlifecrisis is choosing between these two he shouldn't regret his choice whichever way it goes.
|
|
They are not in the same class as a Skoda they took everything that was bad of the mondeo and added a few more bad bits.Its no wonder they have stopped making it.They look nice and thats where it ends.I could honestly say having had a 2.0d estate it was the worst car I have ever owned Lada build quality and as reliable a Trabant.The mondeo is a much better buy thats why they fetch more secondhand,my advice is don't buy one. Look on the x type forums to hear some catastrophic tales.
|
|
|
|
I don't want a French of Italian car as usually when I set out to drive somewhere I want to get to my intended destination. I ended up probably going for a Skoda...
I helped my daughter buy a new SEAT Ibiza, which is basically a VW Polo / Skoda Fabia of course, thinking that it would be reliable. It's broken down 4 times (so far).
Edited by Bill Payer on 27/11/2009 at 10:00
|
>> I don't want a French of Italian car as usually when I set out to drive somewhere I want to get to my intended destination. >>
Well, I've had a (high spec) french car for nearly three years and it's been completely faultless.
That Jag deal sounds interesting. However, the biggest problem I'm having at the moment is that all of the cars I've tested are not £8000 better than my Pug (which is the average price to change).
I must be getting old!
|
vRS is brilliant car, got one myself, my favourite car, and I get to drive most stuff withing reason (we dont get many lambo's or Konigseggs though). Unless you are doing over 20000 miles a year then go for the petrol rather than TDI.
We regularly see vRS that have been hard driven with megamileage and still running sweet - very few stock faults. Mine has Revo stage 1 (250bhp), Whiteline rear ARB and WALK on front, great bit of kit for not much money.
As regards loss of value, you will always find a buyer for a proper vRS, young family blokes like them, Jags are a harder to shift, never mind what the motoring rags say. Thats why you get a Jag for the price of Skoda in the first place.
Edited by Dynamic Dave on 27/11/2009 at 13:16
|
The x-type is soon to be discontinued. Used values of discontinued cars are generally lower than those of current models. I know where I'd put my money.
FWIW you can get a new vRS estate (petrol) for under 16k and I don't think it'll be hard to shift in a few years.
|
I've considered a the X-Type Estate a number of times but always discounted it, I love Jags and still hanker after an XF next time I change but the points regarding ageing / discontinued design are all fair. Being based on the Mondy III I'd see as being a great positive.
The Octavia VRS in petrol form seems something of a bargain although (hobby horse) you'll have to pay extra for a full compliment of airbags.
I think I've read somewhere that the Jag isn't well suited to towing but that may be not be an issue, my money would be on a petrol Octavia VRS I have to say.
|
I think I've read somewhere that the Jag isn't well suited to towing
That's in the CarByCar here:
www.honestjohn.co.uk/carbycar/index.htm?md=901
|
I have used 3 X-types for towing & lugging a twin axle caravan 1550Kg over thousands of miles on the continent & Uk.
I have had Jaguar detachable tow bars fitted with twin elec's on everyone.
Never experienced any towing problems or electrics issue's other than when I fitted the third tow bar with jaguar pack the indicators wouldn't work & the dealer was worthless, spent more time explaining to me how I had void any warranty on the car by fitting myself! So i disconnected battery & refitted & problem solved.The Jaguar towing electrical pack was plug & play & fitted very well in the boot & even came with all foam wraps for the cables so nothing rattled!& very good fitting instructions.
The car was well suited to towing due to the torque from the engine. Never had any DMF issues either
X-types have been for me the most reliable of any vehicle owned.They were mostly covering 1k miles a week. Quality build was brilliant, dealers questionable!
I would have another any day oh I miss my 2.2d
|
|
|
|
|
Welcome to the forum, WorkshopTech. I love my Octavia vRS diesel (CR 170) but there's a bit of me that wonders whether I should have had the petrol. Lots of low-down torque suits my driving style, and I do 15-20,000 miles a year, so this is my fourth diesel car in a row.
But that particular VAG petrol engine is particularly torquey and I believe pretty economical despite the excellent performance. Some diesel / petrol choices are no-brainers as one is so much better than the other, but in this case it's a hard decision.
|
>>Lots of low-down torque suits my driving style>>
Avant, by a process of elimination I reckon you would be happier with your diesel, the TFSi produces 280nm torque from 1700rpm compared to the CR170's 350nm. By way of comparison my Focus ST produces 320nm at 1800rpm and pull like train (read jet fighter above 3500!!) though I am still impressed with the low down pick up of the 350nm Mondeo TDCi when I take it out.
|
|
Are you open to suggestions or have you exhausted all other options?
A few to consider maybe (new or nearly new)....
-Seat Exeo estate TDi
-Vauxhall Insignia estate 2.0 CDTi
-Ford S-Max TDCi
-Ford Mondeo TDDCi estate
-Saab 9-3 estate
-Avensis tourer
-VW Passat estate
-Citroen C5 HDi
-Octavia VRS TDi
All of these are available within your budget if you're prepared to settle for an '09' reg with up to a couple of k on the clock.
Frankly though, this is what I'd have - tinyurl.com/yz47a4g
......or this - tinyurl.com/yggc5oz
Edited by Hector Brocklebank on 28/11/2009 at 10:35
|
|
Of those two I would take the Octavia rather than the underdeveloped X-Type. I don't think the X-Type is anything special to drive, and if it was my money I would buy something with rear wheel drive. However, whenever I park my car in the underground carpark here I always stare rather wistfully at my neighbour's car next to it. It is a Ferrari red Alfa 159 Estate with tan leather interior and is absolutely gorgeous.
|
>>It is a Ferrari red Alfa 159 Estate with tan leather interior and is absolutely gorgeous.>>
The problem with the Octavia is that it might be 95% of an A4 and 105% of the said Alfa though it is not well proportioned or at all visually attractive and looks count for so much these days. The Jag on the otherhand is a great looker.
|
The problem with the Octavia is that it might be 95% of an A4 and 105% of the said Alfa though it is not well proportioned or at all visually attractive and looks count for so much these days. The Jag on the otherhand is a great looker.
I guess it's down to personal taste.
The Octavia is not the best balanced design out there, but I personally don't find the X-Type's combination of scaled down XJ + Volvo V40 rear end + added Hyundai particularly easy on the eye either. I also find the latest Octavia interior both visually more appealing and better finished than the Jag's.
Driving wise I personally prefer the Golf to the Octavia anyway, but I get the impression the OP is looking for something larger.
|
|
|
|
Funny isn't it how even subtle elements of looks affect our opinion of a car. For example, my Qashqai is an excellent tool, can't really fault it in any way. I just don't like looking at it much. Dumpy styling. Nice inside though. My old Mondeo estate is also a fine car but is neither strikingly good looking nor in my opinion anyway, particularly unattractive. It's just a car and a very good one at that. I too could be seduced by an Alfa, they are quite beautiful in some configurations but might not be so satisying in other ways.
|
|
|
|
|
Logically, a car's looks shouldn't matter that much. When you're in the car you can't see it (although you'll know about it if the stylist has decreed that the view out to the rear is restricted, e.g. Honda Civic, new Fiesta) - and when outside it you shouldn't be so sad as to spend a lot of time looking at it.
But then we aren't all logical....And people do buy cars on looks: the Fiesta is selling well despite the rear view out being appalling.
|
|
|
