Well,
I suspect that I might be better to wait until 2010, unless super dooper offers pre end '09
cheers
M
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VAT increase of 2.5% is the least of your worries.
The £ is down 10-30% on the currencies of some manufacturers.
Cars on sale here just now could be new, 12 months old on 0 miles. When they have gone the new stock could be 30% higher in ££s as against $ / ? Yen......................
A clearance 2009 model might be a lot cheaper than 2010 fresh but bought with a devalued £
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When they have gone the new stock could be 30% higher in ££s as against $ / ? Yen......................
Although this (just) might help locally manufactured cars, Vauxhall, Honda, Toyota, Nissan and JLR perhaps, maybe Ford if the content is high enough ?
Remember that demand curves usually have a negative gradient, if prices are too high then volumes will be low and this is a problem for manufacturers and distributors as much as for customers.
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Manufacturers will push up their £££ price to compensate for devalued £ but how much they can increase the RRP depends on other manufacturers to increase their prices to keep the present pecking order.
It is a brave manufacturer that leads - that said the discounts available might compensate for the increases in the RRP. Ford have had more than one increase in 2009 HOWEVER
I have just seen Pre reg 1.6 Mondeos (4 dr) for £11,000 with del mileage. That is cheaper than some new model Fiestas which have RRPs of up to nearly £15,000
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Can you please let us know where you've seen those, FB? Thanks.
Edited by Alanovich on 05/11/2009 at 14:42
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Motorpoint are doing 1.6 petrol Edges
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I have just seen Pre reg 1.6 Mondeos (4 dr) for £11,000 with del mileage
A big heavy car for a 1.6 petrol engine though. Now the new 1.6 turbo will be nice.
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but how much they can increase the RRP depends on other manufacturers to increase their prices to keep the present pecking order. It is a brave manufacturer that leads - that said the discounts available might compensate
It's 'game theory' - an oligopolistic market I think ? Truth is people will attach a certain £ value to a particular car e.g. a Focus, they'll not be prepared to pay more in real terms than that value - relative utility I think it's called.
So, list prices might rise but actual sale costs have a ceiling if the manufacturers / dealers want to maintain volumes - or at any volume in fact.
They can adjust the supply curve to match - at the cost of (for instance) 10,000 Opel jobs - this might imbalance the whole distribution/dealer network too of course
They can accept lower margins or work to reduce costs through manufacturing in lower cost locations (e.g. the UK with a weak £) or reduce the specification of the cars (e.g. BMW) - however the latter is just tinkering around the edges.
I suspect it's all cyclical really and this years problem with the £ will be next years problem with the Euro or whatever else so they'll fudge it, unless this is the time for a real disruptive change.
So, on balance - cheap cars in 2010 still ? I think so unless recovery (in the UK or elsewhere) is very strong and quick which I don't think anyone is predicting (no political comments intended)....
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I've been wondering about this myself as we're in the market to change SWMBO's car, seems to me that 'non-scrappage' marques are actually doing some good deals at the moment (BMW for instance) but may be in an even more parlous state once this artificial stimulus ends and VAT rises ?
We're kinda tempted to wait, don't need to change the car (it's purely a vanity I'd admit).
By 'non scrappage' I mean 'less likely to be attractive to those who would habitually run a car of 10+ years age' - not meant to be an insult as thrift is laudable, I'd also accept it's a generalisation.
Will probably shop around a few dealers now and if we're not tempted then try again sometime in the New Year, it's a discretionary purchase after all.
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VAT may go up slightly but consumer spending as a whole is predicted to be flat over Xmas and maybe decline next year.
If UK based factories which have started up again want to keep the lines rolling, they may have to swallow the VAT increase in an incentive to dealers.
All depends on how uncommon what you want is, I suppose.
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I'm in a a similar situation. Pretty much decided on either a Skoda Octavia VRS or Mazda6 2.2d Sport as a replacement for my Pug coupe.
Mazda dealer wouldn't negotiate at all, I've yet to try and wave a DtD quote under the Skoda dealers nose. However, I was thinking of waiting either immediately before or after Xmas when I assume the market will be very quiet. I would have thought that dealers would be more interested in a sale.....saying that, some just don't seem interested.
(
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>>saying that, some just don't seem interested.>>
What happened to "you want my money more than I want your car"? Always worked for me.
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What happened to "you want my money more than I want your car"? Always worked for me.
Works for me too. Hence why my money is still in my wallet and they haven't made a sale! :)
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Try a different Mazda dealer. The guys in Sutton Coldfield were friendly and arranged a test drive but wouldn't really negotiate. The guys in Derby were happy to do a deal on the phone when I called with a very specific spec. Guess who I bought from?
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Well the Skoda guy is keen to deal
he faithfully phones me every Friday afternoon
Cept
Its
Keen to deal on his terms
Hmmm
the Octavia 1.6 diesel Greenline is currently the favourite ( pity about the DPF)
It now qualifies for the £3500 scrappage (it didnt before)
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Slightly O/T MLC -but it doesn't seem 5 mins since you bought the Pug coupe - i remember clicking a link to the pictures you provided at the time - tempus fugit & all that.
Anyway, co-incidentally, I was thinking of buying a Skoda too - either a Yeti 2.0d 4x4 or Octavia estate 160TSI - I did the usual DtD thing and got prices that seemed to make the Skoda dealers I spoke to shudder in horror. I know it's case of 'they would say that wouldn't they', but the impression I got was that they genuinely couldn't even get close to DtD prices -odd as I thought DtD were simply quoting pukka participating Skoda dealer prices, so someone must be able to sell them for that amount. Incidentally, the Skoda dealers I spoke to were v. large well-known dealers in the Midlands/N.W - so if anyone would 'play' I thought it might be them.
Not sure what I draw from the above, but I'll probably hang on until after the New Year now anyway - I don't think the VAT increase will make much difference either way though.
The currency exchange rates are another red-herring too in my book - if Skoda can make 'Vat Off' equivalent offers while the pound was near parity with the Euro - and it's rising again now - I don't think with flexible production facilities & hedging options, that will have much impact in the future - within 'sane' limits of course.
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DtD can get prices that low because they bulk buy cars, in effect, by introducing lots of people to a couple of individual dealers. That means the dealer is guaranteed to make their manufacturer bonus, which means they can safely sell the car at a loss and make their money on the bonus. Simples.
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Woodbines- It'll be three years in march and I'm happy to say it's been absolutely faultless. (Cleaned it today as well as it's gleaming!) There in lies another issue. My car has such a high spec, it's going to be difficult to leave it behind. But time and growing kids etc etc!
I believe DtD use a dealer in the south east. It's all about reducing depreciation in my book. I want a few options and the DtD quote comes in at £16800. Regardless, that's as far as I would want to go financially. (Hence why I'm not having a BMW 535d on the drive!!)
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If it's all so 'simples' though GM - why don't lots (or more..) dealers do it? i.e. get on DtD's 'books' to sell in bulk.
It doesn't concern me much though - I'm just after a good, competitive price - but I'd be slightly miffed I'm sure, if I was a low-ish volume dealer.
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I have a couple of cars to buy in the near future, including one supermini type car that I could do with buying perhaps at the beginning of the 10 registration issue in March.
I'm hoping that the softening of the German market as their scrappage scheme has ended will free things up a bit - predictions are that the German market will be decimated over the next 12 months.
Edited by Bill Payer on 06/11/2009 at 17:10
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