A neighbour has just got one - sat inside and played with the buttons, what an amazing bit of kit !!!
I hope the electrics are relaible, because the cars' an electronic device with a few mechanicals tagged on
MVP
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I think the XF is wonderful and I wonder why I don't see more on the roads. People still go for the Germans and harbour these prejudices against Jaguar but a family member has a S Type Jag 2.7 D with over 100K on the clock and nothing has gone wrong. Jaguar also do very well in the US JD Power surveys now so there is absolutely no excuse. I would go for the 270 Diesel: All that power and huge torque with good emissions and up to 40 mpg, or if I won the lottery the XFR. I can't see the atmo petrol holding a candle to the Derv in Europe, good engine that it may be. All respect to HJ but to quibble about a torque trough below 1500 rpm is a very minor gripe. Most Turbo Diesels have some lag at extremely low revs.
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I am seeing quite a few of them now.
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All respect to HJ but to quibble about a torque trough below 1500 rpm is a veryminor gripe. Most Turbo Diesels have some lag at extremely low revs.
YES, but the Jag (in the right spec) avoids it!! I may only drive a diesel VAN, but the lag below 1600rpm is a ruddy pain. If this has been cured then it is worth every penny, believe me.
'twill soon be time for hot milk and a story, almost night night!....MD
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harbour these prejudices against Jaguar buta family member has a S Type Jag 2.7 D with over 100K on the clock and nothing has gone wrong.
It's not prejudice, it's a matter of reputation. These days, even in run-of -the-mill cars which are kept properly oiled and watered, nothing much SHOULD go wrong during the first 100,000 miles.
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>>nothing much SHOULD go wrong during the first 100,000 miles. <<
Perhaps, but a quick read through the CBC, owners forums and Watchdog alone suggests its not reality.
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I know a few owners of S type 2.7, one has had a new turbo - 07 reg. Other than that they all seem to perform well.
I drove the XF 2.7 last year and it did seem underpowered on the motorway, lacking real shove from 50-70 - the 3.0 appears to resolve this.
As the 2.7 is now old hat our local dealer has an offer on the XJ - fully loaded unregistered for £36,999.
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So is the 240 Diesel a better drive with smoother torque than the 270?The latter sounds extremely rapid but the engine choice for Diesel seems to be the lower tuned engine if I'm Reading correctly. To john I know a guy who persists with a certain german maker of high repute. One car a 2.4 v6 blew it's engine to bits almost immediately and the other a 39
3.0 Diesel blew a turbo almost immediately. People still think the German cars are paragons of reliability when they are not yet still dismiss Jags despite massive improvements.
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>>People still think the German cars are paragons of reliability when they are not yet still dismiss Jags<<
I just laugh at the arrogance and stupidty that swallows it. They are just average cars cleverly marketed to the insecure at comical prices.
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I agree. I personally like VAG cars but am not so keen on Mercedes and BMW. Many people I know have been left with huge bills with these. I'm not saying Audis don't go wrong but they seem to be less hassle. Would i buy one though: no because I am not into image. I like understatement and this is why I would go for a Jag. I hate the body skirts on my Fabia VRS and next time will probably get an Octavia in Elegance spec with the 1.8 TSI (why pay over £5k more for an A4 1.8 TSI)
I am not and never have been swayed by marketing. I look on the forums, read the press and listen to recommendations.
(P.S back on the PC now so hopefully no typos)
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A 3yr old XF SV8 will be a great used buy in another 18 months. As long as one can stomach the tax and fuel costs, I'd expect they could be had for around £22K, maybe less. A huge amount of performance, luxury and toys for the money, and a proven high performance engine.
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I agree with you on the SV8 and if I had the cash I would have an XFR as well. Decadent but in the words of Omar Khayyam : "we only have a little while to stay". If you can afford either of these cars 400 quid a year tax is a trifle. Having said that the 270 Diesel does sound fabulous. I am confused over this torque business though as this engine has 100 nm more than the 240 and both engines give peak torque at 2000rpm
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As fas as a general statement can be made, if you want reliability go for a Japanese manufacturer.
That said, all modern 'high' performance diesels are very complicated beasts - I am yet to hear of 'bullet proof' engines. Every manufacturer has their share of problems.
Just think about it: twin turbos, DPFs, dual mass flywheels, intercoolers, a plethora of electronic modules, etc. etc... too many things working within tolerances that are unheard of a couple of years ago - it will be sometime before we get to 'bullet proof' stage. Perhaps, we might never get there.
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I want as XF as well - can't quite believe I'm saying this after my previous views on Jaguars in general and the old S-type in particular. And I think this - impressive as the paper figures and the positive reviews are - is the crucial factor: it's making people who, like me, were put off by the stuck-in-the-past designs of the Geoff Lawson era think again.
There are details of the XF I'd quibble with - the shark gills look out of place and the cat badge ought to be on the wings, leaping forwards, not on the boot going sideways - but the package as a whole looks superbly contemporary while keeping touch with its heritage. That, to me, is how design and branding ought to work.
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Rubbish- I wouldn't call the e90 BMW an average car stunorthants26. Or the Merc C-class. Or the Audi TT etc etc. They may not be quite as reliable as the Japanese or Korean marques but the vast majority of the germans that are faultless are a damn site better to drive and nicer to sit in than any endlessly reliable rubbish.
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I wouldn't call the e90 BMW an average car stunorthants26.<<
I would. The leather is of no higher standard than a Pug 206 and interiors wear terribly with family use - I know, I see it everyday in real cars. Thats not quality for £35k, thats average at best.
I suppose you need a nice car to sit in while you wait for the AA, as an Audi A4 driver was with their 57 plate motor the other afternoon found out. Dream on, thats not quality, its just poor perception.
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Our 5 Series BMWs get hammered. Interiors still like new and they never break down. That's not perception, that's reality!
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Obviously you dont have quite the ability of three school age kids then - no natural disaster can compare :-)
At the last count, there were three bits of trim fallen off and stuff under the passenger seat, the rear door trim has come adrift, trim on the side of drivers seat is hanging off, colour has flaked off the side bolster on drivers seat, cup holder broken, trim around the i-drive and door handle worn away and ashtry will no longer stay open.
None of it major stuff, but on a car just two years old with 25k, its a fast wear rate for what is supposed to be the best of the best. Car is a 2007 535d estate. I also clean a 523 saloon that is a year older and doesnt have a cup holder left among other things, but thats done nearly 40k so I guess thats to be expected given the state of the other at a much lower mileage.
It just doesnt seem great when I clean other cars ( the ones that spring to mind are a Jaguar XK8 05 and a Range Rover diesel V8 07 ) that despite much higher use - the Jag does 20k per year and yet it is like new and the Range Rover is used for going across fields, transporting dogs and all manner of countryside junk, yet the trim is still very much intact. All these cars are regularily cleaned and liked by their owners, its just that some 'quality' cars are trimmed and designed with some intelligence about daily use.
The key I would say is children though, they are mighty destructive. Im soon to clean a two year old Xsara Picasso and it will be very interesting to see what the three kids who travel in it have done with the interior - these are much younger than those in teh two BMWs I clean which generally means less care on their part - maybe if the Citroen has worn better, quality perhaps doesnt mean durability?
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"Our 5 Series BMWs get hammered. Interiors still like new and they never break down. That's not perception, that's reality! ".-Have to agree on that, I like my new Mazda, but two previous BMW's we had from new for 8 and 14 years respectivily in the family, were more solidly built and were extremely reliable. Admittedly the last BMW was twice the price of my Mazda, so reliable,comfortable and well built yes but value for money-not so sure.
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I cleaned one of the new Mazda 6 models the other day - lovely looking thing in the flesh albeit with rather lardy dimensions. Only thing that disappointed was the main part of the door trim was made of some of the nastiest hard plastic ive seen in a long while - it seems that moving up the price structure no longer means improved trim, just a bigger car, as it was the sort of material that would be ok in an 8 grand car, not so much in a 20 grand one. The shame of it is that I also clean a Lexus IS and for not much more money, you get a whole lot less of the recycled ice cream tub plastics inside.
I know which id have.
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I've said this before, but the interior on my BMW530d was like new when it went back after 3 years and 150,000km. The cup holders spring out from the dashboard and the only way you could conceivably break one is to sit on it.
A colleague has a Lexus IS250 which he decided on after years of BMW 3 Series, basically because he wanted a change. I actually found the interior very disappointing and more reminiscent of a 90s Toyota rather than a modern premium priced car. The steering wheel looks like it came off a Corolla, the screen on the navigation system has the resolution of a Commodore C64 and there is lots of Amstrad style silver plastic around.
To be honest I preferred the interior of the old IS200. It was chaotic but original, right down to the remote control for the navigation system rather than the touch screen on the present one. A sort of forerunner to the BMW i-Drive system.
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Our 5 Series BMWs get hammered. Interiors still like new and they never break down. That's not perception that's reality!
apart from the turbo hoses constantly blowing off?...in fairness though that was the earlier ones
the BMW's are far far more resilient than the 3.2d Vectras, which constantly had auto gearbox faults
current 325d's are awesome...but... do have a fault....sports suspension and run flat tyres = have to slow down for speed humps, no choice....which is no good if the thing you're chasing doesn't bother
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