Who else, as a private buyer, buys either brand new or delivery mileage pre-reg?
I think we are definitely in a minority here but I'm just interested to see how large/small a minority.
Edited by andyfr on 15/01/2009 at 16:21
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Used to, don't anymore. Prefer to drive my second hand car to the airport long term car park a couple of extra times a year.....
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In the last two years, SWMBO and I have bought pre-reg ,zero mile, Hyundais for substantial discounts. Getz & Coupe. Two satisfied owners.
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Until recently ago I used to buy 1 year old cars. Since then my policy is to buy brand new at a big discount (eg a Focus) and keep for about 8 years. Depreciation is then minimal and I have the advantage of a good car of which I know the history.
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always depends what deal you can get at the time too
sometimes the price to change to a new one is so good it would be pointless to go nearly new
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sometimes the price to change to a new one is so good it would be pointless to go nearly new
What sums are you talking about - a few hundred? One thousand? Two thousand? More. Just curious.
My last car was a Fiat Brava bought in 1998 for just under 15K on 0% finance. It died last June. I would have to be keeping a car this long in order to buy new nowadays and instead will opt for a 1 or 2 yr old car. Having said that, the pre-reg Focuses at Motorpoint that I saw a few months ago were a bargain. Shame I can't fit in one.
I am begining to consider bangeromics seriously though I have to admit. Safety is a top priority in a car though and I will probably pay more for the perceived safety of airbags all over and a good NCAP rating.
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Tawse, am I reading right, you paid £15k for a Brava 10 years ago??? Seriously?
And people still think this is rip-off Britain nowadays?
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As I wanted a Fiat Panda Cross that was too new to appear on the second-hand market I bought new.
However I obtained a 25% discount and intend to keep this car until it falls apart (no anti-Fiat quips please).
I feel I got a good deal and will enjoy low-cost motoring for many years to come.
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I buy new now, with as much discount as I can get and keep it for a long time. I like to know what has been done to the car.
When I bought the Passat and the Golf I looked at used cars. The price for 6 month old cars, with 12000 miles, "our demonstrator sir" usually with an East Anglia reg was more than I could buy a new one.
I laughed when I read a thread which said that "I like to buy a car nicely run in", how many drivers have run the car in? The vast majority of 6 month old cars have been on daily rental, one previous owner Hertz, Avis etc.
Not that there is anything wrong with ex rental cars, but I'd sooner have a new one.
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The price for 6 month old cars with 12000 miles "our demonstrator sir" usually with an East Anglia reg was more than I could buy a new one.
This is a standard motor dealer trick - they always have a couple of overpriced nearly new cars on the forecourt , so you work out it's cheaper to buy a new one !
I didn't think anyone still fell for that old trick ;)
MVP
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>>>didn't think anyone still fell for that old trick ;)
Now then, now then, I looked on Autotrader and the prices of the new Golfs was more than new. I couldn't get a nearly new Golf for sensible money.
I bought the Golf from a broker (Carfile) and did not see the car or the dealer.
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>Not that there is anything wrong with ex rental cars, but I'd sooner have a new one.
Why not, if they are OK? In 40 years of buying cars, I have yet to buy new, and I doubt I shall now. The closest I have come is an 8-month 1988 Prairie (don't laugh - we needed the space for student kids' travel) and an 8-month 2008 Pug 207 last month.
Among those ~30 cars, I think I regretted buying 3 enough to move them on quickly. The first was a 1971 Maxi which I found to have rotting sills (I was still relatively naive then), a Pug 206 Garros whose seats became uncomfortable after about an hour (longer than the usual test drive) and a Pug 106 which was simply too small. Both the Pugs were decent cars, they just didn't fit me. I don't think buying new rather than used would have made a better choice.
If one becomes a reasonable judge of a car, one which has been 'run in' and bought under warranty should have had any problems fixed, and the engine loosened up. The Prairie was a run-out demo vehicle; the 207 a NCR rental car with 13K miles. I haven't had it long enough to tell yet, but it looks fine so far. At over £5K below list and about £2½K below best broker price, I am happy.
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We bought brand new once, and still had no end of problems and niggles with the car. Given that and the fact it soon feels old (or no better than nearly new at least), we don't bother anymore and go down the nearly new route instead.
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Ive bought three new cars over my 11 years of driving.
The first was a Daewoo Matiz plus with a stack of options back in '98. I bought it because it had the free servicing package and at the time, I had started a new job so had steady pay. It was to replace a string of old bangers that were costing hindred a month, so at the time £250 all inc seemed like a good way to keep costs in check.
Second is really two cars - bought a Smart Fortwo in 2005 with high spec for my wife - shortly before delivery she became an ex-wife, so I sold it at a high loss with 3k on the clock and bought my Suzuki van.
Got a good deal on the Suzuki - bought it at cost due to the fact that due to new legislation on emissions, they couldnt sell the vans past Jan 06. Loved the van, great vehicle.
Last one was the misses Sirion. We got it pre-reg, 50 miles on the clock at a discount that works out just a shade under £2k. Happy with buying it new as my misses said she didnt want to spend good money on a car someone else has owned and we know that we will look after it extremely well.
For me, buy new or pre-reg or buy cheap banger - anything in between is really good moeny for someone elses cast off.
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not for me.
I don't really see the benefit/cost. Some folk like to know every mile the car has done, I don't care as long as it has 'istry and has had the necessary stuff done on time. More of a gamble, of course, but if you avoid popular rental/rep choices and insist on history, maybe look at cars popular with older people(and not popular with the young..) you can help minimise the risks. Flexibility is key, and each to their own.
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Of the five cars that I've owned in the last 8 years, two have been bought new and account for 6 of the 8 years. The others, well one was left to me by my deceased grandfather and was a good car but somewhat spartan. The other two I just regret having paid money for.
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Bought a new Octavia last year - Don't buy secondhand anything if I can afford not to
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I go through phases. I have bought new in the past, then got frightened by the depreciation when I sold, driven bangers for a while, then got tempted by something shiny and expensive again. When I sold my M3 about 18 months ago I gave myself a big fright by calculating the daily depreciation over the 3 years I owned it and thinking about the evenings out I could have financed instead.
Normally I buy at 1 to 3 years old. I have to say, though, the feeling of driving away in a car with 10 miles on the clock is pretty special. On the other hand, the feeling of being the one who causes the first scratch is similarly depressing.
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I recently worked out the depreciation over the last 10 years of my car ownership and the figure was in excess of £80K :0 (and that figure excluded any costs of the finance).
I said "NEVER AGAIN" and put the money in my pension fund and this has now depreciated by 30% too!
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I said "NEVER AGAIN" and put the money in my pension fund and this has now depreciated by 30% too! >>
Glad someone has mentioned this point. Saying it partly to cheer myself up, of course. I feel a bit overawed by this thread, as so many people seem treat buying a new car as a sort of habit; I just haven't had that many cars. But I bought brand new and to order in March 2007 (V6 Mondeo, last off the line) because (1) I wanted a car I had really chosen, not just what was on offer, and (2) although I was perfectly ready to go down the 1- or 2-year old route, there just weren't any there. And I too found that the 'nearly new' business was a trap. Although perhaps not absolutely more expensive than brand new through a broker, the nearest I found ("Director's car", 6000 miles) was one which was not to the specification I wanted and at best a few hundred pounds cheaper than new. This by the way from a place that didn't sell new (though I noticed this morning that they do now).
Haven't regretted it yet. Even if I did, the wife would kill me if I said so (Humph, take note).
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>>I said "NEVER AGAIN" and put the money in my pension fund and this has now
>>depreciated by 30% too!
The only consolation is that the pension fund will (most likely) bounce back again if/when the stupid economy picks up again, but the money into the cars has gone.
Hopefully there are still some happy driving memories.
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The only consolation is that the pension fund will (most likely) bounce back again if/when the stupid economy picks up again but the money into the cars has gone.>>
Yes, but in the long term we're all dead.
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I've only ever bought new 3 times in my 47 years of driving. An early Fiesta which was a load of rubbish, a Peugeot 106 which I kept for 3 years and traded in after 3 years as I wanted more space. I then got a new 2002 Civic which I still have though it will probably go this year so depreciation hasn't been too bad. The next car will be a low mileage 1-2 year old though, I' m living on my pension now!
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I alway's buy brand new & if its has to be transfered from another garage I alway's insist its trailered. I have alway's belived the first 1k miles is crucial in the way a vehicle is treated to mapping out the vehicles life. So far so good, even with vehicles that have had notorious reputations ( TDCi's) never a problem even up to high milage.
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I would think there's something rather obvious not discussed here ----that effectively it's down to how much money stashed or income coming in you have?
I never quite understand how so wide a % of people think of and actually do buy new..I'd love to know how people esp those with sprogs and family sized houses afford it.
I could never justify it - I could afford it but won't - savings are there for a rainy day and these days the forecast shows alot of people should prepare for inclement weather. i read once that something like half the adult population has 500 pounds or less in savings or something like that. Wonder how they sleep at night.
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I had my mid life crisis nearly 3 years ago I spec'd and ordered a Ford Mustang GT V8 and imported it to the UK with the intention of keeping it forever. The car cost me £23K (incl taxes and fees with a good £ to $ rate at the time) it is now worth approx £15K (another £8K gone) but the car only has 7000 miles on it as it only comes out in the fine weather (not too much of that over the last 2 years). If I were to replace it today it would cost north of £30K so I am hoping that by the time I retire I will still have a car that feels newish, is immaculate and one I can have some fun with.
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Pica, you are Richard Hammond. I claim my five pounds. :)
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We bought new in 07 for the first time in 36 years, only occasionally have i bought nearly new as i'm pretty tight about depreciation.
My other car is now 13 years old and i bought at 6 or 7, thats probably my norm.
I'm no longer sure about buying many cars made after 2000ish especially diesels, years ago i didn't worry, if i bought a motor with dodgy whatever i'd just strip it and repair as needed, its no longer that simple the electronics in diesels going faulty can scrap a car over 5 years old.
My opinion at the moment is that i would only buy a used petrol engined car made after 2000, i wouldn't want a used CR diesel at all unless i personally new the previous owner.
Not trying to sir up the old petrol/diesel debate but the differences count for this thread.
You only have to browse various forums to see that many are selling their used diesels when they experience the early symptoms of doom.
Pica, i like the cut of your jib, something different, how refreshing.
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We've always bought new.
One of our cars is now about 7 years old, the other is over 5 years old. I would hope that we would get at least a dozen years out of each.
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I do really like the idea of a new car because you know the history, if I had the money I would buy a new car like a Panda as they are cheap don't loose much and should last a good ten years. I am sure over the years this is a much cheaper way of running a car, I would do 6 month oil changes,
I would also like the added safety benefts. However I also like simple engineering and I generally do not care about things like bodywork so some of the benefits will be lost on me.
I just want a car which is safe and reliable that said I do miss power steering, electric windows, remote boot release and central locking.
So yes if I had the money I would buy new and plan to keep the car till it drops. If I was after a Focus then it would probably be nearly new.
My dad once bought a nearly new Punto and it wasn't really any better than his bangers, it was very reliable but then all my dads cars have. That said we used to get every little niggle fixed with the Punto, but with his banger now we don't.
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My wife and I both have cars but tend to car share most of the time. The main day to day commuter is a 53 mpg diesel hatch and the other is a 43 mpg diesel four wheel drive for the winter (we live in a secluded highland glen at 1,000 feet) and the long trips.
Each of them does 8,000 miles a year and we change around 5 years old and 40,000 miles so the depreciation has started to level out by this time. I know diesel doesn't really make a lot of sense these days with a low milage but we just love the low down torque of diesel engines. I even prefer the smell of diesel to petrol.
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My opinion at the moment is that i would only buy a used petrol engined car made after 2000 i wouldn't want a used CR diesel at all unless i personally new the previous owner.
What if it is a low mileage, say ex-demo, diesel with just a few thousand miles on the clock?
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What if it is a low mileage say ex-demo diesel
Motors like that sound nice Tawse, but the sheer amount of rental cars that come back in misfuelled gives me the heeby jeebies, and if you think about it a demo diesel could well be the first diesel a user has tried and to me the risks just arn't worth it.
Yes i'm probably a little paranoid about vehicle sympathy and care and maintenance, and i daresay the vast majority of cars will be fine, just not for me.
Our new vehicle was a hilux pick up, i would have been prepared to accept a good used model as the chances are any user would most likely have been an experienced diesel user anyway.
As it happens we bought new from the dealer cheaper than we could get used, it doesn't often work out that way and i don't suppose it ever will again.
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LOL
I am 6ft 2" !!!
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LOL I am 6ft 2" !!!
You look smaller on TV.
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"I have always believed the first 1k miles is crucial in the way a vehicle is treated to mapping out the vehicle's life. So far so good."
Thanks, Injection Doc - glad to see someone else shares this view. I'm lucky enough to have had new cars since 1971 (although 7 of these were company cars from 1980 to 2001).
Finance isn't the only issue, although obviously you have to be able to afford to pay cash or borrow. There's also the above point aboiut running it in oneself, having the warranty, and (yes, I know there are exceptions) the greater chance of reliability for my 20,000 miles a year.
And....I LIKE new cars.
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wa hey some one who agrees! couldn't agree more. The only cars I have had trouble with is sechond hand ones & always ended up spending to keep them going.& I have kept some of them from new for years & never been a problem. the longest I owned one was 20 years & it was a Fiat panda 4x4 bought for £5500 & it covered 200,000 miles & it was only rust in the last year that put it to bed! so it pays to buy new & look after them.
I have probably just lost 10 k on a a new freelander 2 but my pensions have lost more than that & the house has lost more than that so I might as well enjoy life rather than worry about a few bob. I may not last long enough to enjoy it anyway so i enjoy it while i can. Might win the lotto on saturday!. Oops there goes a pig!
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>>I have always believed the first 1k miles is crucial in the way a vehicle is treated to mapping out the vehicle's life
Yes, there's a good chance that if the engine is thrashed hard from day 1 it will be properly run in.
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A very true statement now that so many engines are factory filled with synthetic oil. The wear rates with these oils are such that piston ring packs will never bed to the bores unless run fairly hard from the outset.
I must have one of the few VAG PD diesels which will run the duration of the oil change interval (10k miles - my choice) without needing a top up. I bought it second hand as an ex dealer rep mobile, no doubt thrashed up the M1 from Milton Keynes to whichever naughty dealer needed attention. The original oil stayed in the engine for 20k miles until I bought it.
I would find it hard to be so unkind to a new vehicle I had just paid for, but this engine seems to be in fine form.
659.
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I must have one of the few VAG PD diesels which will run the duration of the oil change interval (10k miles - my choice) without needing a top up.
My Passat PD (115) never used any oil between changes, (usually about 9000 miles according to the automatic service indicator). It had just completed 100,000 miles when it was written-off in a shunt.
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My S reg octavia tdi with 151000m on doesn't require oil top ups. I check it every sunday run it daily for work covering between 50 and 170m a day. Rural roads at a decent pace normally. Have run it like this for the last 5 years 100000 miles. I have stretched service intervals from 10000m to 15000 miles(about every 9 months) to try to keep costs down but still looking after it I hope.
Was purchase by me from the retired guy who paid almost £16k new did 47000m in 5 years and I bought it for £4700.
Edited by loskie on 16/01/2009 at 10:50
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>>I have always believed the first 1k miles is crucial in the way a vehicle is treated to mapping out the vehicle's life Yes there's a good chance that if the engine is thrashed hard from day 1 it will be properly run in.
Motor Cycle News ran a feature a few years ago where two new identical Japanese 1000cc fours, (I think they were Honda Fireblades) were compared after several thousand miles. One was thrashed from day one and one was "properly" run-in, both were serviced as required.
When they were put on the dyno. after several months/miles (I cannot remember how many), the thrashed bike had about 5% more BHP!
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It's a personal thing. I've been lucky enough to have three brand new cars provided by companies over the last 10 years (now I opt out), and while it is a nice experience, I wouldn't be fussed about doing it with my own money. That brand new feel (and smell) is lovely, but the feel part has gone after a few weeks (once the dust gets in the heater vent slats and around some of the dash buttons for the first time, it's never the same again). In the case of my last company car - a Megane dCi - that was a far nicer car to drive with 10k on the clock than it was with the 17 miles when I got it. Quicker, smoother, more frugal, more responsive and with a far nicer gearchange, yet still tight and with that "new car smell" inside.
As for running in, I can tell you as an ex company car user that most company car drivers beat the wotsit out of cars from day one. It's a rare exception if they don't go off to auction with 100+k on the clock and still running perfectly.
From a personal point of view, buying new is attractive mostly because it allows you to get the *exact* combination of spec, options, colour and trim that you want. It's also a nice thought that you know exactly how it's been driven every mile of its life (apart from the first half dozen or so). Again, speaking personally though, it doesn't offset the significant savings you get buying at 6-12 months old. It does to others though, and who's to argue?
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>That brand new feel (and smell) is lovely ..
I don't agree. I've never bought new, but when travelling in others' new cars, I always wish the smell would go away - too plasticky. Likewise I ask the valeters of any used car I buy not to try to make it smell 'new'.
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Until I retired I bought new.
My current car (now 5.5 years old) was bought at 16 months old, 4000 miles, for about £1000 less than the book price. Its previous owner was Ford Motor Company and it had been run by one of their employees. They auction them off. I just told my local dealer what model, variant, colour, and options I wanted and he found me one. Of the options I specified, the only one I didn't get was a sunroof.
The only defect was very rusty brake discs, but they cleaned up satisfactorily with use.
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With virtually no one buying new cars at present there is going to be a major shortage of decent second hand cars available which will eventually force up thei price . I suspect the price gap between a nearly new and new car will narrow making a new car the more sensible option for many.
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With virtually no one buying new cars at present ...........
I wonder what new car sales figures actually are.
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I've stopped buying new.
I like to see the actual car that I'm buying and this has not always been possible with new cars. I guess that my annual mileage is now so low that owning a car is now a low priority.
With those people who buy new so they know the history - does that include the six months that the car may have been parked up waiting for a sale ? Perhaps axle deep in water.
Now, I just look for reasonable transport - it might be new, but there's very few new cars that I want to buy and even fewer dealers that I want to do business with.
But I do hope that most of you continue to buy new cars and please get rid of them ASAP for the new models ...
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With virtually no one buying new cars at present there is going to be a major shortage of decent second hand cars available which will eventually force up thei price
Just as many people can no longer afford new cars, the same holds true for those buying one year old/two year old cars.
Don't forget all those car sitting on airfields that will probably appear as "pre-reg" throughout this year.
I would like to know the "real" sales figures for last year, i.e once all the pre-reg / registered by manufacturers etc are taken out of the equation, and how many new or almost new cars are available for sale
MVP
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Don't forget all those car sitting on airfields that will probably appear as "pre-reg" throughout this year.
All Ford cars are made to order ~ dealer or customer ~ so never sit in airfields.
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> I suspect the price gap between a nearly new and new car will narrow making a new car the more sensible option ..
But we are always told that dealers' margins are better on used cars than new, so the scope for that is limited ? HJ ?
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The narrow gap is true for motorcycles. At 6-9 months old, something like a Suzuki GSX-R1000 with a couple of k on the clock will still be up for £7000 at a dealer, yet is readily available brand new for £7500. Bikes don't have that cliff-like initial depreciation like a car.
In that case, I would spend the £500 and get a new one. Handy that I'd get most of my money back when I got banned a few weeks later, though. :-)
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The narrow gap is true for motorcycles. At 6-9 months old something like a Suzuki GSX-R1000 with a couple of k on the clock will still be up for £7000 at a dealer yet is readily available brand new for £7500. Bikes don't have that cliff-like initial depreciation like a car.
But did you ever meet anyone who paid £7000 for a 2nd hand one?
This is the standard dealer trick to make you believe it's better to buy a new one, no one ever realy pays £7k
MVP
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Rattle>>I am sure over the years this is a much cheaper way of running a car, I would >>do 6 month oil changes,
Man with too much money. When did you last hear of a car dying because of failure to change the oil often enough. Modern cars last forever until something expensive kills them off: airbags, ABS, e/ws etc.
On the running in, this can take a long time. My Vectra used a good litre every 1,000 miles if driven hard (75mph cruising for 500 miles) until it had done about 25-30k miles. Now, at 10 years old, it doesn't use oil at all.
In the current climate, I am thinking of replacing it with a youngish car - probably 3 years old. Doesn't seem any point in running an old car, when you can buy a nearly-new car for not much more.
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>>In the current climate, I am thinking of replacing it with a youngish car - probably 3 years old
Why not get a 1 year old Vectra for 7 grand!
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One big advantage of buying a brand new car (although not one already in stock at a dealer) is that you can specify options. And if you specify options you can be fairly sure it's of recent manufacture, made specially for you, and hasn't stood around in the open on airfields.
Edited by L'escargot on 17/01/2009 at 08:00
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Exactly L'escargot! I can remember when we were ordering a new car the dealer tried to get us to change the colour as he would be able to get it (from a nearby field) quicker. I said that one of the few advantages of buying new is being able to get the exact spec and colour wanted.
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Since the very early sixties, I've always bought new cars (with two exceptions) and would not dream of buying a 'used' car - more fool me, I know. On the other hand, I have not really had that many cars since 1958 (my Ist 2nd hand car) - probably no more than twelve, altogether.
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Exactly L'escargot! I can remember when we were ordering a new car the dealer tried to get us to change the colour as he would be able to get it (from a nearby field) quicker. I said that one of the few advantages of buying new is being able to get the exact spec and colour wanted.
Please keep buying new! It reduces demand for nearly-new cars, thereby keeping prices low for those of who like a bargain. :)
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Please keep buying new! It reduces demand for nearly-new cars thereby keeping prices low for those of who like a bargain. :)
NowWheels, see my earlier post dated Fri 16 Jan 09 and timed at 09:19.
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>>>And if you specify options you can be fairly sure it's of recent manufacture, made specially for you, and hasn't stood around in the open on airfields...
Good point, L'escargot.
I've only ever bought two new cars and have not specified options on either. I might in future, though, to make sure I don't get one that's been standing in a muddy field for six months.
Clk Sec
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made specially for you and hasn't stood around in the open on airfields.
Althought I've never bought new (never owned a car less than 8 years old) we have a family member who does this and won't buy new from stock. She started doing this after a VW garage sold her a car that had hay under the wheel arches, this was when VW had a reputation for reliablility but no longer deserved it IMHO.
After that car she always made sure that her cars were ordered from the factory and never bought another VW.
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I used to always buy new but have now bought my Ist pre-reg 23 mile on the 1st April this ye incompetant biased & corrupt press say the full spec. Caliber is the only 2 litre auto Hatchback worth the price. The car has more standard equipment than any other that I know of including what should be standard on every car.Tyre pressure monitor gauge extremely accurate press a button ,displays shows trye pressures and a small drop in pressure immediately shows up, a vital safety feature also a very efficient auto dip mirror. . Unfortunately the idiots at Chrysler deleted the TPM & Mirror from the 2008 models. Despite its few faults, hard plastic etc. I am delighted with the Caliber so much so that I am now on my second one.
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interesting thread for my household....because.... i'd got to the stage in life where a new car was likely to be the way forward.. having for many years bought 2-3 years old, then last time with my wife's car, which is the main household vehicle, we bought a demonstrator with a load of extras on it.. and we had it early, so 6 weeks old (instead of 3 months that the manufacturer insisted on, just had to 'borrow' it first, then pay for it 6 weeks later at the reduced rate for a 3 month old used car)...
but...looking at the value of her car (now 4 years old), the depreciation on it to date and the cost to change, i can't see me being willing to pay/lose that much. In about a year's time it will be decision time: 1, keep it very long term, well maintained..or ..2, new one from somewhere like Drive the Deal...3, PCP and treat it as a permanent hire car accepting that the PCP payments are a similar loss to the same depreciation/finance/ loss of interest on savings costs as if i'd bought one
can't honestly say which way i'd go...things have got complicated haven't they
My own car, used as a second car, is now 9 years old and i can see myself moving into a form of 'advanced bangernomics' by which i mean i maintain it very well, even the minor things, to keep it in very good nick with absolutely nothing wrong with it... so that i still enjoy it, it's still reliable and to a degree desirable.. but is not depreciating anything like a newer one would e.g I'm prepared to pay £500- £600 per year on minor niggly things that many people wouldn't cough up for on a car that age...safe in the knowledge it's depreciating about £300-£500 per year now, rather than the £4,000 p.a. it would be if I traded it in for a newer one. I do though intend to keep it forever and eventually run it as a 'classic'.
Edited by Westpig on 17/01/2009 at 11:51
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