Assuming GM survives, it looks like Vauxhall brand won't be swallowed up into Opel. www.autocar.co.uk/News/NewsArticle/AllCars/236904/
Edited by Webmaster on 14/01/2009 at 12:38
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I bet they keep the Saab name and put it on other cars to try and improve sales.
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But Vauxhall is a brand (same cars as Opel) but Saab is a separate manufacturer. Although they share GM platforms etc. Saab could be sold if someone would pay enough for it.
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The whole Saab thing is very sad. I remember lusting after 900 Turbos as a kid in the 80s:What a classy and well made car! The fact there are still many (maybe on their second turbo) still giving excellent service at 200K plus is a testament to the old firm. When GM came in the products became bland and quality sipped but they kept their high price and the rest is as they say history.
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There's been a bit of discussion about this on Saab forums. The Swedish government has said it will 'support' Saab, but whether that means buying it from GM or not isn't clear. Saab employ 140,000 people and account for 14% of Swedens exports apparently. It would be a great shame if the brand disappeared.
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GM have completely screwed Saab up IMO - I think they are making Cadillacs in Trollhatton at the moment ! Regarding the point above about keeping the name and putting the badge on their other cars well they are all the same cars anyway. Saab already use GM parts and not much else that you would call pure Saab anyway. It seems to be the way of the motoring world at the moment. I don't know of any other industry that would get away with making the same car and then charging differently depending on what badge you put on it.
Getting back to the Saab story though - GM took a car maker that was doing reasonably well because of the type of cars it sold, then completely changed the car and expected it to sell in great numbers against the 3 series. People should let BMW do what BMW does and concentrate on developing their own thinking. Who knows what brilliant cars we might be driving today if the Saab designers had been allowed to design Saab cars instead of designing a 3 series copy.
Once again that is why I like Honda although I have to say they have also caught the 3 series bug with the Accord and tried to compete against it.
Go back to making Honda's for crying out loud and stop copying the 3 series (and I thought my ranting was over with for today).
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>>I don'tknow of any other industry that would get away with making the same car and then charging differently depending on what badge you put on it.
I believe this is actually very common practice in the business world, it's simply a matter of trying to extract the maximum amount of money from all classes and types of customer with as little investment as possible in different products.
It's not just the motor industry. When I had access to the database of a high street outdoor retailer, I could see the exact same product for sale at different prices depending on which of its differently branded shops it was sold at. E.g. at the low-end brand it was sold cheaply, mid-range sold reasonable and high-end (fashion side) sold high.
This is explained quite well in the book, The Undercover Economist.
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>>I don'tknow of any other industry that would get away with making the same car and then charging differently depending on what badge you put on it.
Corporate Computer, networking, PC and laptop makers did it for years. Still do. Called badge engineering.
Its very very common in all areas of retail as well. The value of a brand is how much more you can charge for the same product. Very common in the supermarket too, you dont think tesco produces its own brand foods?
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Well other than food, general retail, electronics, white goods and motoring etc etc I don't know of any other industry that would get away with...........
I didn't think that through properly did I. :-)
Edited by Pendlebury on 14/01/2009 at 17:12
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VAG for a long time seem to do very well from this. Even the Bentley Continental/Flying Spur has Phaeton DNA (more than DNA I know - same chassis, engine, etc).
If GM had let Saab (and maybe they did) take the common parts but be a little individual then they would have done well. I am surprised they say they never made a profit.
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Agreed - DSG (PC World / Currys) do this with their 'Advent' range of computers. They just stick a different badge on them and re-price accordingly. My first (and last) laptop from them was a rebadged ASUS IIRC.
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Saab could be sold if someone would pay enough for it.>>
Of course, but who is going to?
We had an almost brand-new Saab 900 which was almost a great car, and I think the best they ever produced. Certainly better-looking than the Dame Edna's now lined up sadly at the local dealer. But even then one had to face the fact that it was racking out an old Triumph engine to its absolute limit, and a Swedish acquaintance told me that it was absolutely incredible that, with its sky-high labour costs, Sweden could support two major car and truck firms. So I don't buy the 'GM wrecked Saab' line.
Still miss those glorious seats, though.
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SAAB produced their own version of the Triumph slant 4 engine from 1974 onwards. It was a complete redesign with no commonality of parts and was done properly. As an example, the SAAB B20 engine had a duplex timing chain, water between all bores and bigger bearings. The truly obscene Triumph cylinder head design using angled head studs and bolts parallel to the bores was of course not continued.
I really miss my SAAB which was running well at 140k miles when I sold it. That car had so many simple features which were designed with care and thoughtfulness by the designer - all put there for good reason.
No money to GM from me - I replaced it with a big VAG diesel. Wonderful engine but the car is like a camel. Designed by a committee and feels like it.
We can't put the clock back for SAAB - it's gone.
659.
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Will this see the end of the Saabaru - the Saab 92 which is am Impreza with a Saab front end?
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Will this see the end of the Saabaru - the Saab 92 which is am Impreza with a Saab front end?
I think that was only a temporary aberration from a few years ago, US market only and a very strange looking vehicle indeed when you saw one in real life.
If you want to see a real nail in the traditional Saab coffin, check out the US market only Saab 9-7X. This is basically a Chevrolet Trailblazer, a ladder frame SUV free of any redeeming features whatsoever, with a Saab nose grafted onto it. Truly nasty.
GM seem to be pathologically incapable of managing any of their premium brands successfully. It's not just Saab which has been left to rot. Even in the US no one under the age of about 90 takes Cadillac seriously any more. Also Buick which used to be about style and value, kind of like a US Jaguar, is now just something you get as a rental car from the airport.
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The inevitable consequence of badge engineering combined with globalisation.
The sprawling BLMC empire brought inefficiency and years of in-fighting between brands (Rover vs Triumph, Austin vs Morris, Wolseley v Riley) whilst the 80s saw Vanden Plas and MG become trim levels on other cars rather than marques in their own right.
In the USA the Plymouth and Oldsmobile brands are long gone and Opel/Vauxhall cross the pond as Saturns. Saab has become "just" another GM brand in an already overcrowded market place; it just happens to be from Sweden rather than Michigan. The individualism and innovation of years ago has been lost; heated seats and headlamp washers don't cause a ripple any more - the centre console ignition key and dashboard lights down-to-speedo-only are the only USPs of this great marque.
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