My wife is an executor of her father's estate and it's fallen to me to sell his Peugeot 206. The family don't want to "give it away", neither do they want to hold out for top price. It's been valued for probate at £2,500 so (to prove my skill and worth) I'd like to get around £3k for it.
What none of us want is to be messed around by tyre kickers or no-shows. So, I'm assuming Autotrader is the place to go, but does the team think that I should put on a value and say Strictly No Offers, or the usual o.n.o. to allow for some haggling. Also would stating that it is an Executors Sale be a Good Thing, a Bad Thing, or would most people who'd be interested not have a clue what that meant?
btw the car is an '02 Pug 206 GLX 1.6 auto, 5 door, 28k miles, tax/MOT till (I think) March, FPSH, generally in good nick except a matching set of small parking dings front and rear (well, he was 86...). If any of our experts have a different view on the valuation I'd be pleased to hear...
Thanks
EDIT: The £2.5k figure was the Low Parkers valuation...
Edited by smokie on 23/09/2008 at 22:23
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I suspect the CO rating of this car might put a downer on the valuation.
I sold a 51 plate 206XSi with FSH, integrated satnav, full leather interior and 72k on the clock two years ago for not a lot more than what you hope to get. That was 161g/km and before all this taxation based on emissions really kicked in.
I suspect a 1.6 Auto is going to be in band E or F which is not good for a small car.
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Hmmm...everyone tells you there's a demand for small auto's but we couldn't sell MIL's Corsa auto when she gave up driving and neither could a dealer a family member knew. FIL ended up p/xing both their cars and getting one new one.
It's astonishing that in 1998 I sold a 1991 106 1.1XR (XR means nothing more than full door trims) for £3500 but yet I think your price seems very full.
On the probate thing: how do you prove (to the average punters satisfaction) that you're entitled to sell? Surely things like HPi checks will throw up anomolies which may well put people off?
Edited by Bill Payer on 23/09/2008 at 22:29
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Executor's sale should be a plus point - suggests an elderly, probably careful driver. The low mileage will be attractive for the wrong reasons: it's probably done lots of short journeys and could give more trouble in the future than one which has done an average mileage - but lots of punters don't know this, nor will the sort of person who goes for low mileage be aware of the high CO2 figure.
Maybe try £2,950 and accept something between this and £2,500.
Edit - on BP's point you'll need to make sure your wife has written evidence of probate: once probate has been granted the executor is the legal owner of the estate assets.
Edited by Avant on 23/09/2008 at 22:31
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Personally I find the "no offers" line a complete turn off. It says that the seller is either not serious or desperate to clear finance.
Decide, on the basis of guides, comparison and adcive offered here the minimum figure you will accept. Advertise with a good margin above that, make sure you know the cars plus points and be honest about any downsides. Be ready to haggle!!
If asked why you're selling be honest and open. We had to sell the MoL's Astra after she developed Alzheimer's and it was certainly an easier sale than my 205 which I offered privately to get the best cash price on the replacement.
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a quick check on Autotrader shows similar age cars for nearly £3,900 but these are with traders markup.
At the end of the day you just want to be rid of the car so advertise it with 'ONO' and 'quick sale wanted'.
Should anyone phone up you can then give them the info as to the genuine reason for sale. Always be prepare to haggle.
make sure you clearly state 'No Canvassers'.
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I woud second Avant's advice. Although the car market has slowed, I take it you don't desperately need the car sold in the next few days, or say by the weekend at the latest. It's not really any different to most sellers, who don't want the car hanging around for weeks (though many put up with it because they refuse to accept what their cars are now worth). I wouldn't personally put quick sale needed in the advert as it could open the floodgates for silly offers to come in.
An AutoTrader advert, perhaps magazine as well online if you feel the target market warrants it (plus local paper if so for the same reasons), worded well and priced sensibly should be agood start. If there is no interest whatsoever, the price can be dropped.
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I recently sold my car via webuyanycar.com and that was a 51 Civic with 128500 + miles on it. Have been looking for a new car with most dealers offering the same for the civic. Ending up getting £200 more via this mob no questions asked...
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It's the price/condition that is going to sell the car. I wouldn't garnish the ad with "quick sale needed" or "executors sale" (thick punter might think it was the local executioners vehicle). That sort of information is for you and the buyer, not every T,D & H that reads the ad.
Let the car sell on it's own merits, but don't pitch it too high else you'll waste a lot of your own time for nothing. Probate value is only an estimation in any case, not a strict minimum. I'd also have copy of probate to hand when it comes to doing the deal.
From a legal point of view, as Avant says, your wife is now owner of the car, so you can describe it as such when people call. Only when querying the V5 entry do you need to reveal the very personal details of a recent bereavement.
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Glass's gives a trade-in value of:
Part-exchange Price:
Excellent condition: £2870
Average condition: £2580
Below average condition: £2280
Please note: Unfortunately, we don't have a valuation for the requested mileage. However, we can value this car at 30,000 miles.
With only 6 months' MOT I think your probate valuation was a bit over.
I wouldn't put probate sale, or no offers, or ono on an ad. Everybody knows that an advertised price is just a starting point for negotiations. Price it at just under 3,000 and you'll get more hits than if you price at just over 3,000. Put stroppy comments on and people won't bother ringing. Just describe the car, people don't care. An ultra-low mileage auto screams elderly driver anyway.
Alternatively, put it on eBay with a no reserve sale if you're feeling brave.
Make sure the V5 is registered to the address where you sell the car from, some people won't buy from elsewhere, however good your story. I've seen people on here recommend not buying a probate car owing to questions over proving ownership.
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Local car dealers? Sometimes they will buy decent cars for cash. I'd give that a whirl before sticking it on autotrader. There is also the auction thingy that HJ recommends. They will pick the car up, auction it, then give you the money (or return the car if it doesn't sell). You can drop it off to them to save a few quid as they charge for collection. Not sure what the fees are though.
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Don't want to complicate matters (honest, guv) but who was left the car in the will? It's that person who's ultimately entitled to sell it and that person to whom the executor should pass it. If no specific bequest and it's a sell and distribute to beneficiaries will, then no prob. Sorry if you're an elderly female relative and we're talking about sucking eggs.
Why not check if any of the neighbours is interested? They'll have seen the car going to and fro, being washed etc and might offer a reasonable price without fuss.
Good luck.
Edited by Optimist on 24/09/2008 at 13:38
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Tax is Band E and then I. Ends up £210 in 2010 which is a lot for a small car.
As to sale can I add my personal experience.
I an taking from your post that everything is being sold and then the cash distributed to several people. This is a minefield and you will find family falling out permanently over a few quid.
You should not have stated a price you could achieve especially as I don't think you can achieve it but we are were we are.
Back off and agree that the car will go to auction and sell for what it can sell for. Then no one can argue that you did a good or bad job. Far better to lose a few hundred quid than start a family feud.
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>>You should not have stated a price you could achieve especially as I don't think you can achieve it but we are were we are.
Nice idea, but the law does not work that way. You have to start out by stating a price because you have to fill in the IHT forms and pay your IHT before you receive grant of probate.
Only once probate has been granted are you permitted to sell the asset - and then find out what it is actually worth. If the sum realised is lower than the sum in your IHT calculation you can resubmit your IHT calculation for a refund.
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No Map you misunderstand. The probate value was set at £2,500 the OP is stating he can achieve around £3,000.
Trust me a number of family members now have £3,000 in their heads and will be annoyed when it is not achieved and if sold to anyone even vaguely connect to the OP there will be whispers of a fix.
Been there done that. Auction it.
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Conjecture all you will about OP's family - and we can leave it to him to defend his family's honour - but please do me the courtesy of using my name in full, thank you Niallster.
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Thanks all, some useful tips there. Some points...
The estate is equally shared between the Mrs and her brother and everything has gone remarkably smoothly so far, I don't foresee any issues if I don't achieve the price - i simply am doing the legwork with a view to achieving £2.5k, if I don't it really won't matter.
One comment above said the car can't be sold until probate is granted. I thought we'd been told otherwise, but I suppose there would be questions over the registration document.
Will update with progress...
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One comment above said the car can't be sold until probate is granted
Note: Reply below is not referring to any of the replies in this thread, but is purely in reply to the comment by Smokie above.
Different circumstances, but this little snippet may help (credited to author Peter Crosland)
www.legalbanter.co.uk/uk-legal-legal-issues-uk/428...l
"The advice offered by others is like the curate's egg i.e. good in places.
Elsewhere it is just plain wrong. The executors are legally obliged to deal
with the estate assets in a way that the estate is not disadvantaged. As
long as the executors obtain a fair price then there is nothing to stop them
selling the vehicle now as long as they obtain fair price for it. Indeed
keeping it for months might well lower the value. In the case of the car
matters are complicated by the fact that the registered keeper is not
necessarily the legal owner as in this case. Currently the car belongs to
the executors who are responsible for insuring it if it is to be driven on
the public highway. I suggest you or your mother write to the DVLA telling
them the situation and ask them for advice as far the registration is
concerned.
Edited by jbif on 25/09/2008 at 00:16
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In the absence of a probate certificate, the purchaser cannot be certain that he is getting good title to the car.
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Maybe easier for you to assume ownership and have the V5 in your name. Price the car competitively and tell any buyers the full facts, I helped a relative in similar circumstances and had no problems selling, for what it's worth I used Autotrader rather than ebay.
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Just to close this one off...
I used the website mnentioned above (webuyyourcar) to get an online valuation, which came out at £2450. I thought I was fairly honest about the couple of dents which I could see...
Having read around, I told the executors (my wife and her bro)the value, with the warning that they would probably offer less on sight. They agreed to accept £2300 (for the sake of a quick and easy sale).
Made an appt to take the car in, on Saturday. I was 2 hours early (unlike me!) and ended up having to hang around quite a while. Then the chappie came out to see the car, bit of wheel kicking, rubbing tiny chips (on a 6 year old car!), making a few illegible notes, telling me the bonnet was out of alignhment (which I could see, once he pointed it out!) and, using a paint thickness measuring tool, demonstrated to me that the deceased had had more knocks (and cheaop repairs) to teh car than he'd told us about!
He then made us an offfer of £2200, which I initially rejected, but after discussion with the executors I went back in and accepted.
In the circumstances, it was certainly a very easy way to shift the car. Given some of people's comments elsewhere in this thread about it's value, and the overall economic gloom around these days, but, most importantly, the feelings of my wife and her bro, it was exactly the right thing to have done. I feel that with a bit of effort (e.g. cleaning the car inside and out, advertising, waiting patientyly by the phone for no-shows and time wasters etc etc) I could have probably got a few hundred more. But I don't feel hard done by, in this instance.
Mind you, I also got a value on the Vectra I paid £8.5k for a couple of years ago. Either they are completely wrong, or (more likely) I've taken a bath on it. As expected :-)
Lastly, regarding sale & transfer, and just for the record, you *can* sell a deceased person's car before probate is granted. You do not sign the tear-off part of the V5 and send it with a covering letter to DVLA. We also had to take copies of wills etc to the dealer to complete the sale. This prompted the funniest part of the process, where the guy called his boss to check the process, and the boss apparently asked "does the seller look honest", which he repeated out loud to me, and I replied "Of course - I'm not the car dealer!!" He very much saw the funny side...
Thanks to all who contributed to this thread. :-)
Edited by smokie on 06/10/2008 at 19:43
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