I wonder if the much improved products from the likes of Hyundai and Kia and others, especially with their across the board superb guarantees have affected the sales of many mainstream makers.
There was a time when cars looked and drove differently, and had good and bad points depending on whose product you chose.
Fiat's mainstream cars used to rot, but would have lovely sparkling engines often far in advance of most others, remember driving a 124specialT (IIRC), absolutely storming vehicle, very little on the road could live with it, they were a really different car to own.
Had a regatta diesel, so far ahead of the competition of its time, would leave fast petrol cars in its wake, unheard of economy for that performance too.
The spares prices were ridiculous at the time though, and i've never had one since, but i do like the new Bravo, and was quite shocked at how fast the hot punto's are.
But lots of makers now have vehicles just as nippy, pretty, light and nimble, should imagine if i was going to buy a Bravo, i'd end up giving my hard earned to Kia for a ceed, or Hyundai if i was into high car mileage.
Not so sure that this sharing of engines and other parts always benefits the company in the long run, maybe sharing development costs outweighs any others.
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Poor sales in the last few months have blighted nearly all European car makers, what with belts tightening and fuel prices rocketing. The plants in Torino (MiTo) and Cassino (Bravo and new Delta) arent included in this, nor is the Polish 500/Panda factory.
Of most car makers Fiat are the best suited to higher fuel prices, as they have lowest emissions/consumption
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Its just with the very average/poor quality of the Fiat product there are less and less people that will take a chance and buy it.Ask yourself the question,why would you buy a Fiat product before just about any other brand out there?
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I asked that question re my Panda. My answers: Well built. V economical. Cheap. Reliable. handling. Character. Different.
Peanut.
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I've had 2 Fiats, a 125 special (1972), and a 131s (1978). The rust and constant petty problems mean that even after 30 years I still would not buy another-theres just too much other choice, irrational or not.
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M
nice cars in many ways. That 131 still looks modern.
JH
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"Ask yourself the question,why would you buy a Fiat product before just about any other brand out there? "
Because its galvanised and best value in its class for the price.
hydraulic tappets, camchain, 81mpg Leeds to Sheffield at 2,000 revs this week. (76mpg return)
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They still sell Fiat cars in the UK?? Never see one? Though they only did flimsy vans now.
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Plenty of other manufacturers suffering just as much as Fiat, or even more. Tough times for all of them.
That said, I had a rental Bravo for 3 days last month and wasn't overly impressed - it felt disappointingly cramped inside, nothing like as spacious as I would have expected.
But you still can't beat a Panda, for the money!
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"Ask yourself the question why would you buy a Fiat product before just about any other brand out there? " Because its galvanised and best value in its class for the price.
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But is a FIAT really such good value for money, when you've factored in the depreciation? I'd expect any modern car I bought to be galvanised, regardless.
As a benchmark, I bought a Jan 2004 Corsa SXI 1.3CDTI (granted, not new) from a certain well known supermarket in Slough. It was a 6 month old ex Enterprise car with 5k miles on the clock, for £6999.
I've driven the car 74,000 miles in 4yrs to the month (now on 79,500). To give you an idea, 2 car supermarkets and my local BMW dealer have offered me £2,300 (battered rear end) for it today, so I've lost just £4699 in all that mileage (I'm that pleased I'm almost wetting myself over this trivial loss). It has the same 1.3 16v diesel engine as that in the Punto but being a 2004 model had 2yr or 30,000 mile servicing intervals compared to 12,000(?) mile intervals in a Punto. Suzuki Swifts with the same engines have pathetic 9,000 mile intervals (is it 1990 again?). Realistically, I'm laughing my socks off as I'd have easily lost £8k in the first year of owning a new focus. If it blew up tonight I'd just laugh and go and get another - she doesn't owe me anything!
Obviously I'm glad I didn't stump up the £10,500 for my Corsa new. no brainer. But what would an equivalent age and mileage Punto with the same engine have cost it's owner, and how much more would the servicing have cost me over the mileage. And would it have developed faults that my Corsa hasn't?
On the NEW car/value for money side of things I'm inclined to agree with the other postings - FIAT can't (in my humble opinion) match Kia or Hyundai in terms of quality and dealer support/warranty. Good on them for trying, but they won't be getting me back :(
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<< so I've lost just £4699 in all that mileage (I'm that pleased I'm almost wetting myself over this trivial loss). >>
You've lost nearly 70 per cent of your money.
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<< so I've lost just £4699 in all that mileage (I'm that pleased I'm almost wetting myself over this trivial loss). >> You've lost nearly 70 per cent of your money.
Yes, but who cares?? 70% of £6999 (not a lot in newish car terms) is arguably not very much in the scheme of things at £4699. It would have been £6699 lost if I bought the same car at a vauxhall dealer at the same age (the price differential was exactly £2k at the time of purchase), or worse still, £8195 if I'd bought the car at the list price new (80% loss).
Yes, percentage is important, I appreciate that. But to me it's irrelevent in monetry terms unless you consider the purchase price. I'd much rather lose 70% on a £7k car over 4yrs and 74,000 miles than suffer the amount lost on a say, a Focus that had cost £16,000 and where I'd been offered the trade value after a year or so. The money lost on this thing is small fry!
... Just think if I had lost 70% on a £19,000 Vectra bought new and currently in the same condition/mileage. I'd be £13,300 down and sick as a parrot!!
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schneip wrote: ... Just think if I had lost 70% on a £19,000 Vectra bought new and currently in the same condition/mileage. I'd be £13,300 down and sick as a parrot!!....
schneip,
List price on Ford/Vauxhall is irrelevant - in the real world you'd have paid £11-£12k for that Vectra and if you'd lost the same 70 per cent the car would be worth £3,600 today - probably about right.
I'm not for one moment saying you've done anything wrong/stupid, just that in percentage terms your experience with the Corsa is fairly typical.
I think we are both fairly realistic about the car buying process, buying a car is spending money - anything you get back years later is almost a bonus.
I bought a £250 suit from John Lewis about five years ago - its current retail value at Oxfam is about £5.
Should have bought a banger instead - might still be worth fifty quid.
Edited by ifithelps on 13/07/2008 at 22:25
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I'm with you on this, ifithelps.
I also list price IS irrelevant, the one I watch for is the target price in the likes of whatcar/autoexpress :) yet I still have a reluctance to buy new because of the VAT that is charged.
You'll see from my other posting that I'm starting to question a return to BMW as like you, I appreciate that anything you get back is indeed a bonus! Sad - why do I have to want something so much that costs so much? I suppose there's worse things to spend your money on, though!
haha I do sometimes think a banger could be the way to go. Maybe something Japanese or Korean? But I'd have been terrified if I'd have missed an exams. Maybe I should just let the Corsa become a banger and carry on wanting to hug it due to the money it seems to save me and the fun I have behind the wheel. Quite liberating, since acquiring knocks from other drivers when it's been parked, it's less worry leaving this one now, too!! :))
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