Hi All, Been looking at this site for a while now and taking in information but only just signed up to post to the forums.
I'm looking for a Good diesel to do a 80 miles (40 each way) commute to work each day, Never had a diesel before so no idea what's good to go for, Not fussy on brand, want resonable motorway performance,Reliability and to sit comfortably at 70-80mph must have Aircon. Anyone got any good experinces and can recommend any cars in particular. ??
Is there a massive difference in economy for a small, medium, large diesel, so say fiesta, focus, mondeo? looking at official figures does not seem to be a lot in it?
Any help / advise appriciated
Cheers
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You need to do your sums quite carefully. This motoring profile will give good economy on a petrol as well as a diesel. The higher cost of diesel fuel, and the higher cost of the equivalent diesel car could well mean that a petrol car will cost the same over a longer term.
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Thanks, but i've done some sums and coming as near as possible like for like diesel is the best option, I've always brought cars before on condition, miles and SH not age, so
done some sums on a astra to get an idea of what would be best, MPG figures are from parkers and fuel prices are the average in my area.
LPG looks ot be a good option but not enought in it to justify getting one over a diesel. I can buy diesel in any garage but not quite as easy in my area with LPG.
So deffo want a Diesel.
Petrol Astra 1.6 Envoy 5dr AC 39mpg
£1.11 x 4.546 = £5.05 Gallon
20000 / 39mpg = 512.82 gallons
£5.05 x 512.82 = £2589.74
Diesel Astra 1.7 Envoy 5dr AC 60mpg
£1.20 x 4.546 = £5.46
20000 / 60mpg = 333.33
£5.46 x 333.33 = £1819.98
Bi-Fuel Astra 1.6 Envoy 5Dr AC
£0.58 x 4.546 = £2.64
20000 / 30mpg = 666.67
£2.64 x 666.67 = £1760.00
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Beware!
I run a diesel.. and threads here point out you will be lucky _ especially with Vauxhalls- to get within 10% of the quoted mpg figures.
And buying one with aircon and using it guarantees that.
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Are you sure about 60 mpg in real world driving in the diesel Astra?
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For that budget I would highly recommend Mazda 323 2.0TD. I bought mine 99 plate for £2k with 100k miles on it. I've driven it 17k miles so far without a hitch. For your budget you should be able to get 02/03 plate with reasonable mileage. They've got decent spec and all come with air con as standard. MPG is pretty good for motorway.
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Your maths will be blown apart if you do drive at 70-80 with the aircon on. The difference on my 1.6 HDI between 55 mph and 75 mph on the motorway is about 15 mpg. That's with the aircon off. As you have clearly done some homework on this to meet your own needs, it might be worth re-evaluating how to extract maximum mpg.
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Just a thought. If you do a lot of short local journeys it may be better to get the petrol Astra and a bicycle!
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I drive short journeys now and have a volvo C70 T5gt... As yo can imagine I get no where near the quoted mpg. As i said in the update, the mpg figure came form parkers all of them so i was comparing like for like. I'm aware that the mpg figures quoted by manufactorers are all over inflated and unacheivable, but thats going to be the same for petrol,diesel or lpg, the comparison was purely formt he point of view that if i could get these mpg's then what would be the cheaper to run, and the answer was diesel.
I'm not looking to get the maximum possible mpg form the car but if a choose a economical car in the first place then I will get maximin miles per £.. what ever that may be.
From some comments are people saying that 70-80 motor criusing is not a resonable speed to be doing to get any decent mpg figures. ?? surely this will depend on the car and the loading you are puting on the engine gearing,etc, I know my volvo is better on fuel at 90 than it is at 70... ( not that i ever drive that fast :¬)
Does Aircon really have that much effect on mpg on a diesel, I've never noticed the difference on a petrol car, I would have thought that the extra torque of a diesel would not have such a great effect.
Mazman, I've had a look at the 323 and they seem a good buy, along with the nissan almera, I figure looking at an unfashonable car you get a lot more car for your money.
mlj ? what car do you have and whats the best /worst mpg you get?
Mabe i should rephrase my original question, What is the most reliable diesel I can get with £4k ???
So far One's i have thought of are
Clio 1.5 dci 80 £35 a year tax also !
mazda 323
Nissan Almera / almera tino
Ford Focus / Mondeo.
this is all new ground for me, I've never had a diesel car, I've never had a little car, I've always worked local to my house so used a 180 scooter for work and had the car for the rest of the time so always had big cars as i could afford not to worry about fuel.
But things change and I don't fancy 40 miles round the M25 on a scooter... ( I have a full bike Licence so could) so a diesel is the best way to go. But would like some advise of what's good and not so good.
Thanks keep the comments coming
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I have a Citroen Berlingo. I recently had to drive from home (cornwall) to mid scotland and back. Driving at a steady 55-60 (not in some sort of micawberish attempt to save pennies) I got nearly 200 extra miles from a tankful, compared to more routine driving.
I believe aircon can make a difference between 3 and 10% extra fuel consumption, mostly towards the latter.
I can also add from experience that the official mpg figures for VAG group TDI engines are easily attainable, and, in reasonable hands, frequently bettered.
A late mark3/early mark 4 Golf TDI could do you; if you can avoid the dealers! but that's another story.
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>>I know my volvo is better on fuel at 90 than it is at 70...
Prove that and everyone will want one - it's just not possible
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>>I know my volvo is better on fuel at 90 than it is at 70...
>>prove that and everyone will want one - it's just not possible
I have done a fair few long distance trips in the volvo and if I drive with the criuse on at 70 mph my tank range is about 350 miles from full, if I then up the criuse to 90mph when the road clears a bit and i can comforably sit there then the tank range goes creaps up quickly to over 500 miles.(I never look at the mpg it scares me) I thought it was wrong the first time it done it but it's what the trip shows and I've seen it a fair few times so I know it's correct.
The car's an Auto Don't know if that makes a differnece and there is only about 5-600 rpm diference between 70 and 90.
I've read somewhere that driving most modern cars at 30 in 3rd gear is more ecomomical than 4th gear even thought the revs are higher there is less load on the engive. I'd guess it was the same princible that means it's more econimical at 90 than 70.
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I would go for a pre common rail Merc. 190D 2.5 last forever if looked after but slow, 300D saloon or estate should be possible (whisper quiet engine in the pre 24v cars) again not fast but lovely. A C250 Turbodiesel with a few miles should be in your bracket if you look around. Don't worry about miles, check history. A pal has one with 350,000 with orignal turbo and auto box and a full Merc history. Mind you he does a lot of work on the continent and has servicing done in France at half the price of here.I love it: 150 bhp, far quieter than the latest Diesels and should do 40 mpg. Lovely five pot noise too!
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I was getting 45-50 from my Saab 9.3 2.2 TiD a few years back. They're comfortable, powerful and fairly quiet on the move. Flexible space too.
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There's also the huge numbers of pre-PD VW / Seat / Skoda TDis, ideally with the 110bhp motor (Golf / Bora / Passat, Leon / Ibiza, Octavia I)
These give 50+mpg under the conditions you describe, are robust and getting fairly cheap now. They're quite simple compared with modern diesels too.
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Welcome to the Backroom djt100.
A straw poll round the office here reckons you could do well to consider anything with the VAG 1.9tdi - perhaps the Fabia for modest cost? Yes, there will be stories and reports of failures but given the volume of sales you can't go too wrong. Otherwise the hdi in the 206 or berlingo/partner or DCi in the Clio- you should get a good example of any of these for your money. Then there is the 1.3 multijet in the new Panda etc. Generally gets good reviews and praise for frugality but I'm not sure about comfort. Likewise the 206 didn't suit my tall frame - although I've always rated the pug oil burners.
I would also consider the time you spend in the car - sounds like it'll be about 2 hrs per day - that's probably more than 10% of your woken day. so comfort might be a factor you want to be mindful of. You should find a good example focus but likely to be higher miles and 5yr old for under £4k. Mmmm the possibilities are pretty wide.
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Mazman
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Have you replaced a rear light bulb yet and if so how did you access the light cluster unit on the hatchback version? There are 3 deeply recessed nuts which I can't seem to be able remove with a socket spanner.
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I think diesels only start to make sense when you are looking at bigger beefier cars than an Astra. Diesel in smaller cars is a bit marginal in terms of the savings I think, as these same cars are reasonably economical anyway.
For example we have a 1.6 petrol Focus which under the circumstances you describe, will do about 44 mpg.
If you went for a 1.6 TDCi you would probably get 52-54 mpg but I suspect the car would cost a lot more (for the same age in the first place).
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"Diesel in smaller cars is a bit marginal in terms of the savings I think, as these same cars are reasonably economical anyway"
Well I get regularly 57mpg in a diesel Yaris with aircon on. Mainly short journeys less than 10 miles. tried a petrol 1.0 Yaris: about 43mpg. And the diesel is faster and quieter at 70mph.
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Too many options.... I think i'm just going to see whats about and go for it if i like it.. I have been reading up on almost everything I can afford and I've read good and bad stories about them all, so i'm just going to see whats about and go for it.. I'm also considering going for something cheaper with miles as for the money i've got most things aseem to have 80-100k on. So my thinking is why spend 4k on a late model with 100k when I can get a older model with same miles on for half the money... then put the rest aside should I have problems
thinking old merc at the mo found one local to me c250d with 103k and FSH Auto with criuse control,and all the trimmings for £2k. might be nice if not quite as high mpg as a smaller car.
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You probably wont get one for £4k but if you can stretch a little further I would go for the Fabia VRS. I owned one of these until recently and was getting 48-50MPG week to week. The car was awesome fun to drive, super quick, sporty and looked smart. They hold there price well and the have VAG engines in so are reliable.
Worst mistake I ever made sellling my VRS.
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The Fabia vRS is an almost ridiculous blend of performance and economy. If I'd had the cash to spend, one would have replaced the Mondeo without any hesitation at all. Problem, is £5.5k is really rock bottom, and £6k more realistic if you want a choice.
I agree the PD130 engine is well worth seeking out though. £4k should get you into a higher mileage 2002 mkIV Golf or Passat. Also don't overlook the earlier 115 bhp version (still with the 6 speed 'box) used in the mkIV Golf GT TDI in 2000/2001. £4k will easily find you a nice 2000/2001 car with 70-80k on the clock, and although it doesn't quite have the muscle of the 130, it still goes well, and has much of the same gutsy, responsive feel to it. Still a 50 mpg-er as well.
The PD is a very gruff and noisy engine by today's standards, but reasonably well insulated from inside the car, and the performance/economy mix still puts many current diesel engines to shame. They also have an excellent reputation for reliability and longevity as long as they've been serviced to schedule and with the correct oil.
Cheers
DP
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I had a very brief look at the skoda fabia, but i've been immediately put of by the fact that it's a really a cheap polo and the misses has a polo and it's a awful car to drive. I just can't get on with it....
I've been through the whole spending lots of money on cars and therefore loosing money on cars, Now I never ever spend more than 4k on a car and after going from spending £20k on car's so far i've never short changed getting a 4k car.. but i've never had a diesel either !... so may change... :)
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I don't know how old your other half's Polo is, but I had a 1998 Polo (needed a car and it was a deal I couldn't refuse), and I am very much with you - I hated it. Without a doubt the most soulless, dreary car I have ever owned and this is from someone who rates small, basic cars as among his favourite types.
It stayed in our family not a moment longer than it took to raise the funds to ditch it for something else.
I felt nothing like the same way towards the Fabia. Characterful and engaging - just how a small car should be. If you can stretch, it's worth an extended test drive. The thing just has so much guts it puts a big grin on your face. Handles half decently too.
Cheers
DP
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Girlfriend polo is a 1.4 se 2002 /02 plate... almost the worst car i have ever driven, I say almost as i had a hire car new corsa 1.2 and that beat it by miles, ...suspension made of bricks !
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HI! - No need to pay the exhorbitent sum of £4,ooo for a diesel which complies with the criteria you have stated. I have owned a 1997 Peugeot 306 D-turbo S from new, and it is still happy to cruise at 70-90mph, whilst still ruturning amazing MPG figures. The car still looks wonderful in black, and were I to decide to part company, would only fetch about £1,000. For £4,000 you are hardly going to be able to purchase 'wheels' sufficient to impress the ladies, so why chuck away £3,000.
The site Pistonheads, regularly advertises approx., in excess of four hundred 306's for sale, notwithstanding that not all are diesels.
Having said all that, if I were in your position, I would beg, borrow or steal the extra £2,295 [Fiatsupersaver - £2,300 saving!!!!] and buy yourself a brand new Fiat Panda 1.3 diesel which is happy on the motorway, and returns mind-blowing MPG figures, whilst providing a most enjoyable driving experience! - Cheers
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Just thougth I would update this, I finally choose a car.
2001 / Y Bora tdi , 57K FSH, I ownder from new £3000.
Seemed like a good enought deal... happy with it..
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