engine has just become very noisey, appears to be choking and losing power. noise increases with rpm and sounds like a piece of metal would in the spokes of a moving bicycle. the noise also 'runs on' after the throttle has been released when driving.
i am thinking it is something to do with the turbo but would appreciate any advice on being able to pinpoint the problem.
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how can i tell if it is the turbo? is it difficult to replace?
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The fact that the noise 'runs on' at a speed not directly linked to engine speed suggests that it may be the turbo. One of the bearings is going and the edge of the turbo rotor is touching something, lightly so far, but it won't stay like that. It needs attention promptly. I doubt if it's an enormous job in labour terms, but it won't be easy for a non-professional and the part won't be free.
I say all this from the lofty viewpoint of one who has never owned a car with a turbocharger. But from your description that is what it sounds like to me.
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thanks for your replies lud. i put the 'kiss of death' on it yesterday when i told someone that it had done 170,000 miles and the engine was good for another 170k.
this is the first problem since buying the car - 4 years ago.
can the turbo be re-furbished or does it mean a new one?
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does it mean a new one?
I would think so. Don't take anything I say as gospel though (all a bit remote control, filtered through our words... I haven't heard the noise after all).
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I had a TD VW and heard a nosie like a 'stick in a bike wheel'. But afer I had replaced the Turbo with a recon, there was no noise- so I am sure it was that. It had done 140k , so you have done well.
cost?, some years ago was £400 for the recon, i did it myself , but that had no electronics etc etc. and it was fine afterwards.
But another person at work paid £850 for his Saab Turbo to be fixed.
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is it possible that it could be the fuel pump? would that cause similar symptoms?
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No, not the fuel pump. It sounds like your turbo which as someone says has had a very good innings. Nothing lasts for ever. Get a proper mechanic to listen to it of course.
It won't be cheap but if you can do it or have an honest car man it won't cost the earth. You can get reconditioned units and these will be made in large numbers. Look on the net and chat up your garage man.
Only worth doing if the rest of the car is good. But if you like the car and it's good, it is worth keeping it going after all.
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Before panic buying a new turbo, it's worth checking all the hoses to the turbo for leaks, they can make some strange sounds (rasping) when they are split.
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Quite. It goes without saying that hands-on advice from a competent person should precede any expenditure of any sort. Don't let badly-based theoretical assessments run away with you.
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thanks for the replies - i won't panic and buy a new £400 turbo. what is confusing me is that no engine management light is coming on.
i have now stopped driving the car as the smoke and noise are getting worse and i feel that something is about to blow but i would have thought that the engine management light would come on to highlight a problem?
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I wouldn't know - perhaps Screwloose or someone can answer that. Have you got a trusted mechanic? If the worst comes to the worst an AA man can probably give an informed diagnosis. Let a competent person assess it.
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managed to get to 40 years and still not found a mechanic i can trust
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not found a mechanic i can trust
Time to lobby everyone you do trust who understands and likes cars. With luck one of them will have someone they can recommend. Listen carefully to what they say.
If you live in North Kensington or nearby, I can recommend someone
:o}
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Lud
No need for me to add anything; you're right on the money - don't drive it; get it checked.
Without hearing it, could be a lot of things - it's very rare for a turbo to make any noise for long without catastrophic failure. Buzzing heatshields, or the aforementioned air leak, are more common.
Self-diagnosis isn't very sophisticated on those units.
Not sure about asking AA men; some are good - some wouldn't know their Max from their elbow.
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But a buzzing heat shield wouldn't cause power-loss... I suppose a split hose might be blowing a prolonged raspberry and cause power loss though. Let's hope that's all it is for young drunkard's sake...
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had a local mechanic look at it today. he thinks it may be a 'top end' problem - possibly a dropped valve causing engine to run on 3 cyclinders.
loosened each injector to check for fuel and each injector is receiving fuel. is there anything else i can do to try to pinpoint the problem?
started engine for the mechanic, the engine is smoking more, the engine noise is just like a diesel tapping but louder.
is it possible for the timing to slip? would any fault codes be logged?
any help is appreciated.
Edited by dipsomaniac on 05/04/2008 at 13:36
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I think a dropped valve would have wrecked the engine before now, it may be a sticking tappet. The only thing to do is take the cylinder head off and strip or replace.
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no fault codes are logged in the dash test mode. looks like i am going to have to take it to a garage for diagnosis.
is it possible for a diesel to run on three cylinder?
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garage bill upto around £300 and still no nearer sorting out this problem - car is still smoking/choking/tapping. garage has replaced one injector and serviced other three. checked the timing (ok) and done a compression test - one cylinder was reading 300psi while the other three was around 400. they now want to send the fuel pump away to be tested.
car is 1999 with 170,000 miles on the clock apart from this problem the car is in very good condition.
can anyone offer any additional advice as i can't afford to throw money at it at the moment.
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dip
Did they check that the cam on that low cylinder still had an inlet lobe on it?
Why are they sending the pump away when there's a mechanical problem with the engine?
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thanks screwloose. i will ask them about the cam? do you think that could cause the problem? they didn't think the decrepency on the compression test was enough to cause the symptoms.
i may have overestimated the noise coming from the engine - it is like a normal diesel tapping sound but a bit louder. they are stumped and the pump is the next thing on the list to eliminate. the problem is that a new pump is around £600.
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Even allowing for the different conditions in a non-running cylinder; a 25% variation is significant. What colour is the smoke?
Have they compared the leak-off rate of each injector. Did they even try injector swapping?
A diesel specialist is your next move - but that compression loss is still the prime suspect; although Ford don't quote a figure for these, 4-500psi [30 bar] would be expected on a new unit.
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i agree that compression difference is significant. i don't think it would be a cam as the problem seems to have got increasingly worse over the last couple of weeks.
smoke is blue/white. they have fitted one new injector and serviced others.
it is with LSUK who i thought were diesel specialists
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dip
The smoke is consistent with unburned diesel. That would fit with low compression and, as it's LSUK, that should indicate that the injectors were sound when replaced.
A cam lobe destroying itself would get worse quite quickly. With low compression present; at the very least, a tappet clearance check is necessary.
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thanks screwloose, i appreciate your advice and will speak to them tomorrow about a tappet clearance check.
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having to pull the car out of the garage as i can't sign a blank cheque to fix a 1999 focus with 170,000 on the clock - bill sofar £300.
car is smoking badly and is down on power. garage has replaced/checked the following:
injectors replaced
timing ok
have run engine with some ancillary parts detached (inc turbo) and still smokes
compression on no.2 cylinder (from cam belt) down to 300 psi compared with 400
turbo ok
no fault codes logged
tappet clearance ok
the next stage was to send fuel pump away for testing - the solenoid being suspect. if i can source a secondhand fuel pump does anyone know whether it has to be programmed in by ford?
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A sharp clicking noise from a cylinder can mean a ring has seized in its grove, this would account for low compression on one cylinder. Surely though the garage would know this sound when they heard it. Trouble is you dont hear knocks from modern engines very often nowadays. Has it got hot recently?
Edited by dogdays on 11/04/2008 at 22:18
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No, it hasn't got hot recently. the mechanic looking at it had 30 years experience and he is stumped - still took £360 though.
the next stage for the garage was to send the fuel pump away for testing - the thinking being that some part inside had broken sending debris though (or in the case of one, not all the way through) the injectors. would that have damaged a ring also? sending the fuel pump away would have cost another £200.
am reluctant to give up on the car as it has been a good reliable and economical car until now but have to weigh up cost/value.
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If this were my car I would investigate the loss of compression first before spending more money on the ancillaries. You can never rule out anything on a fault like this, but when you get down to the weird stuff and its going to cost you money, its time to stand back and take a hard look. By the sound of what you have said its either a mechanical fault or its in the fuelling. You will eventually have to remedy the low compression anyway, so why not make it your first point of call?
P.S The pump broken metal theory will not effect piston rings.
Edited by dogdays on 13/04/2008 at 12:12
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Did you ever find out the problem? It's just that mine did the same thing today, i took it to the garage and he thinks it's the fuel pump. I didn't leave it there as i wanted to seak advise from someone who has had a similar problem. Any help would be brilliant
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my car had the same problem it turned out to be the turbo on the maifold a garnet part i lost power a had lots of white smoke and the car seemed to be only working on 3 cyclnders
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