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Renault very kindly let us have a new Laguna all last weekend. It was a 1.5Dci and yes I was very impressed with it. Smooth quiet and incredibly economical. Our 4 year old Mazda MPV is beginning to cost money and my wife (who drives the Mazda) would like a change. Reports on the last Laguna were dreadful (some garages wouldn't touch them). Should be be tempted by a new Laguna Sport Tourer 1.5Dci or should we look at a Mondeo or Octavia?
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Co-incidently, Renault also let me have a new Laguna all last weekend. It was also a 1.5 DCi.
There were areas of the car I was very impressed with. It was very well specified, the build quality, whilst generally average at best, was better than any previous Renault I have been in and the electronic parking brake was, despite my initial sceptism, absolutely excellent. Dual sunroofs as well. So, on paper, it ticks all the boxes.
On the road, the package was ruined by the 1.5 DCi engine. I know I'm probably going to get flamed by people who drive 1.2 litre cars and find the performance acceptable but this engine spoiled the car. I used the Laguna for a proper crosscountry drive - I took it to Southampton some 160 miles away and the car was seriously lacking in power. I wasn't expecting a race car and neither did I want one, but on several occasions when I was making use of crawler lanes to overtake trucks I was seriously concerned at the performance and had to pull back in before making it past all the trucks. Any sort of overtaking manevour in it was frought with danger so I preferred to err on the side of caution and simply sit behind the slower moving traffic.
As a result of the very unwilling engine, I returned only 43mpg despite not being in a great rush to get there and not exceeding the 60mph speed limit which covers most of the route, becuase you really need to work the engine hard to get to keep pace with traffic.
A friend of mine, however, had a 2.0 DCi 150 and reckoned the car was pretty much excelent for what it was, which shows that better power options do exist. Infact, to be honest I think even the 130 would be sufficient but please, whatever you do, avoid the 110bhp version.
I personally found the ride quality around town particularly poor as well - it was very, very crashy over bumps but this didn't translate into a planted feel in corners. It combined pretty much the worst aspects of sports suspension with the worst aspects of comfort orientated suspension without any of the benefits of either.
So, fix the suspension, bin the 1.5 DCi and Renault are in with half a shout.
Curiously, though, on arrival in Southampton, the car warned me of low oil level. I took it to the local office but they insisted I drive it no further and swapped the car for a Mk4 Mondeo.
This was unfortunate, as I wanted to get to know the Laguna, but fortunate in that I'd yet not driven the Mk4 Mondeo.
Dissapointingly it was a 2.0 petrol in LX specification. I'll get this out of the way first - the engine, performance was, was certainly acceptable but the fuel ecnoomy was terrible - 31mpg from London to Devon with no traffic and no silly speeds - and it sounded like a wasp trapped in a biscuit tin. Rubbish sounding engine.
But the rest of the car was nothing but good news. The quality of the interior was very, very good indeed - the dashboard felt solid and built to last. I'd say it's almost as good as that in the BMW 3 Series, its only let down by the cheap plastic feeling centre console.
The car handles well and is sharp - noticeably more so than the Laguna - and the ride quality around town was fine. Infact I thoroughly enjoyed it.
One thing though - it's absolutely huge. Bigger even than my 5 Series.
So, to some up, I'd probably chose the Mondeo in your situation but make sure you chose the TDCi over the 2.0 16v petrol. If you have a Laguna, do NOT buy the 1.5.
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I agree, Michael. There are some exceptions (the new Fiat 500 may be one) but in general the bigger engine in the same body is the better bet. Performance is obviously better, and because you don't have to work the engine so hard to maintain reasonable progress, exonomy is little or no worse.
On the sort of journey you were doing I'd have got 50+ mpg out of my 2.0 TDI Golf, and probably the same if I'd been in a 2.0 diesel Laguna - or Mondeo.
I suspect you'd be pretty bored, and no better off, if your 5-series was a 520i rather than 530i !
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Your comments about the 1.5 engine don't surprise me. That's a titchy engine for such a big, heavy car. You wouldn't buy a 1.5 petrol Laguna / Mondeo / Vectra after all.
I drove this engine in the Grand Scenic and it was OK if you worked it hard, but would have been dreadful laden or if you wanted time off from gear swapping. Just too small for the car basically. The difference between the 1.5 and 1.9 was far, far greater than the 20 or so bhp would imply. I suspect the bigger dCi engines work far better, as they did in the Scenic. As Avant implies above, it does the same work a gear higher and at half the revs, and far more if you extend it a little. It's more relaxed and far more pleasant to drive.
In defence of the 1.5 dCi engine though, I did have it in 106PS guise in a normal Megane, and it was delightful. Punchy, refined and felt well suited to the car.
Cheers
DP
Edited by DP on 25/01/2008 at 00:39
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On the sort of journey you were doing I'd have got 50+ mpg out of my 2.0 TDI Golf and probably the same if I'd been in a 2.0 diesel Laguna - or Mondeo.
My Dad drove the same route the next day in his 530d and got 41mpg, presumably becuase there was simply no need to work the engine hard.
I suspect you'd be pretty bored and no better off if your 5-series was a 520i rather than 530i !
I quite agree. The extra performance does not cost much more in running costs if you chose an engine wisely and can often save you money, another prime example is 525d v 530d.
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Sorry, Dodo, we've come a lttle way from your question although the discussion has been interesting.
I think I'd put both Mondeo and Octavia ahead of the Laguna, but whichever one I had it would be the 2.0 diesel (assuming that you want a diesel) rather than any smaller engine. They all do a 2.0 petrol, but Michael (above) did a long run in a petrol Mondeo and wasn't impressed.
My Golf estate is very nearly as roomy as the Octavia, more or less the same price and holds its value better, but I very nearly had the Octavia and you'd be happy with either. The Mondeo costs more but is quite a bit bigger, so it depends on your budget and need for space (if you like Fords there's the Focus estate and C-Max, but these are better value secondhand).
Edited by Avant on 25/01/2008 at 01:14
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I have used this 1.5 Dci in all its power guises. Yes its smooth, yes its economical, yes it can be kicked in the butt & electrocuted to produce large power outputs, but at the end of the day a small engine in a big car just dont cut it at any level.
I wouldnt touch a laguna 3 despite being a laguna 2 fan and previous owner,
1/ Its too new - give it time to get the bugs ironed out
2/ Its ugly - anyone wo can produce a basic fabulous glorious shape and then ruin it by cutting lights into and over its style and sight lines needs be drummed out the car designing business.
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Agree with AE, I would n't buy it on looks alone! They're getting uglier. My faithful Laguna I was a far better looking machine, Laguna II was spolit by that funny metallic inset above the grill and now this .....
Noticable that the ad for the 3 shows it in various stages of undress rather than the finished article. Always a clincher when the adpeople do this.
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I am a known petrolhead but I wouldn't buy a petrol Mondeo unless it was a 2.5T - otherwise the performance difference between it and the diesel simply isnt enough to warrant the additional fuel consumption. The 2.0 wasnt bad, but the consumption was rubbish and frankly I wouldnt be suprised if the TDCi was quicker.
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2/ Its ugly - anyone wo can produce a basic fabulous glorious shape and then ruin it by cutting lights into and over its style and sight lines needs be drummed out the car designing business.
LOL!! This coming from someone who's previous car was the worlds only MPV that looks more van-like, than a Ford Transit !
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For once, and only this once you speak the truth whip whop
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Ugly? All I can say is beauty is in the eye of of the beholder
And yes I own one
Personally I think it is one of the best looking coupes around
As do most people that haven't saw one and come over to enquire
The RAC review gave it a great review and said it is
Unfortunate that the sales slumped because of the previous
Laguna model reliability issues making it in their view an
EXCELLENT 2nd hand buy
Renault threw crazy money at the development and build quality
Of this car and the result is in my opinion
It is as good or even better than the bmw e46 330d msport
I previously owned
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Oddly enough I have just returned a 2.0dci (150bhp) Laguna Sport Tourer Dynamique S which I've had for the last couple of days. Did about 400 miles in a mix of motorway & town.
I was very impressed. The car was very comfortable (accessories like heated leather seats helped here!) and felt very composed on the motorway. A better drive than the previous shape Mondeo (not driven a new one yet). Engine & gearbox excellent, I would have the gearing a bit higher as that's what I'm used to in my Focus but not important. The power band started a bit late but went on for a long time once it got going so that's fine.
As said elsewhere the suspension wasn't great. I usually drive Ford & BMW with sporty suspensions so was expecting the Renault traditionally softer ride to feel very soft, but it really didn't. It wasn't much softer than my Focus, and wasn't brilliant around corners.
But would definitely look seriously at one if I was in the market for such a large car. Was very impressed overall.
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You could add
Can the Renault dealers be trusted?
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The 2.0 dCi is the one to have. The 1.5 is stretching it a bit although if you do mainly motorway miles one-up it should be fine.
Can it be trusted? Who knows - time will tell. There is the reassurance of the 100000 mile warranty though and the latest Renaults seem to be doing better. The Modus is proving a reliable car and I've heard of satisfied Clio 3 owners. I know a bloke who runs an independent Renault service centre - typically his trade is he sees very few Renaults less than three years old as most people seem to keep them serviced at the main dealers while the warranty is running. He then gets them for service and repair after the warranty expires. He's beginning to get the earliest Moduses and Clio 3's in now and rates them highly. In fact he reckons that Renaults built from about 2004/05 onwards are in a different league. So hopefully the tide is turning and the new Laguna will continue the good work.
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Saw a Laguna III yesterday.... thoughts:
1. In profile I liked it
2. The rear is terrible - the lights do it no favours.
3. Front view worst
I have seen interior pictures and it's okay but how can a designer ruin what could have been a very good looking car. Well they tried extra hard and succeeded it seems.
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Strange thing is I've not met anyone yet who really likes it. Some hate it, quite a lot think it's OK. I wonder what the results of Renault's customer clinics were? Assuming they did some ;-)
The Tourer looks better and the Coupe will be out late this year. Lovely.
I've just looked at the website. Renault spent six years on this car and did 3.7 million miles testing it.
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The problem is those lights. Front and rear.
The basic body shapes, both tourer and normal are sublime, the tourer specially so. Wonderfully proportioned, great in profile.
The lights however are not in proportion with he car, and they break up the shape and style lines badly.
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Advance pictures of the Laguna Coupe look promising. Can't remember if they have the same lights though ......
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AE
so if they have any sense there'a "facelift" due pdq, which will do the world of no good for the trade in prices of the pre facelift model. On the other hand if you're buying the theoretical pre facelift model, you could pick up a bargain. After all when you're sitting in it...
JH
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I bought a Laguna2 brand new in Oct 2004 the car has been perfectly reliable over 30,000 miles just a faulty ouside temperature sensor and an ocasional clutch judder.I know several other people who have or are running Laguna 2's without any serious problems.The bad reputation was caused by problems in the earlier built cars, later ones seem O.K. My real complaint is the terrible resale value , the dealers are often rubbish as well.Under neath the skin Laguna 3 is just a make over of Laguna 2 with a smarter interior.I think a Laguna 3 will be reliable but do not expect it to hold its value any better than the old one. P.S. pity the new one is not as good looking as the old one.
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Got my New laguna on 1st August 2.0 DCI 175 Hatchback, with sat nav. Fantastic car done over 5000 miles now and love it. used to have a saab 9-3 1.9 tid which kept breaking down, the laguna is a far better car for less money.
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I had a 24 hr test drive in a DCi 150, was good to drive, refined and pulled cleanly from 1000 revs in 3rd or 4th.
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Its thumbs down from the punters at large - factory running at 50-60% and in danger of closing according to reports in some papers
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Its thumbs down from the punters at large - factory running at 50-60% and in danger of closing according to reports in some papers
That doesn't mean it's a bad car. It could be that it's just not quite as appealing to buyers as the alternatives, and in any case all car sales are way down.
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