Car horns.
All vehicles are fitted with a horn. Its intended purpose is as a warning signal to other road users. It has to be operational for a vehicle to be road legal I believe.
Now, I worked out recently that I have so far driven 1.25 million miles over 32 years and can not in all honesty ever remember having felt the need to use this instrument for any purpose other than to test to see if it works !
I worked in Brazil for a number of years where horn blowing is as regular as gear changing but I never felt compelled to join in. I drive in Italy quite a lot where they like a toot ( steady !) as well but I seem to manage fine in silence. Leaning on the horn if someone has upset me by their discourtesy or lack of foresight on the road has never struck me as useful, and quite frankly if someone elses' actions on the road have caused me to take evasive action then I would rather concentrate my efforts on doing that safely than waste time blowing the horn.
So.........
Who uses it and why ?
Is it as redundant as a man with a flag ?
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The horn is a very useful tool for warning others of your prescence, as intended. But as use of it is likely to be taken the wrong way and get you a smack in the mouth nobody bothers anymore. The only time I use mine is on the approach to a blind bend under a bridge near me, other than that never.
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I feel the need now, very strongly.
PAAAAAAAAAAAARP!
erERer! erERer!
Shriek shriek!
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Yes if someone annoys me or I see someone I know.
Normally accompanied by an assortment of hand gestures and creative swearing.
Last used as intended in Cornwall round the tight country lanes.
Edited by mss1tw on 06/01/2008 at 20:29
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Sometimes use it as intended, but also as a rebuke, but you have to get your timing right. A quick blast at someone just as you're leaving the scene is favourite. By the time they work who it is, you've gone, leaving them in a stew of impotent rage.
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Yes! - one of my regular routes is through an expensive part of Sutton Coldfield, the residents there seem to think it's fine to just edge out the bonnets of their E-class's, Cayennes and Range-Rover Sports and expect passing motorists to stop and give way!
The horn gets used for it's intended purpose, to give warning of my presence.
Most of the same residents have fancy electric gates about half a car's length from the kerb so that when they're going in they block the main road waiting for the gates to open.
If I had their money I wouldn't buy an expensive house on a busy road!
Rarely, I also use the horn when someone else has been a complete pink fluffy dice, I know that's wrong but it gets rid of the frustration.
Edited by Dynamic Dave on 06/01/2008 at 21:09
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pink fluffy dice? we all have one, a few drivers act like one. If it's good enough for Shakespeare, it's acceptable to me.
Edited by Ruperts Trooper on 06/01/2008 at 23:34
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It's very important if you're a minicab driver on a dark residential street late at night and can't be bothered to get out of your car.
Mine only got used if someone did a maneuver that genuinely frightened me, but since I changed cars I usually end up driving along red in the face with the indicators and windscreen wipers going instead, 'cos Citroen and Honda didn't do any joint thinking when it came to horn location.
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I'm with shoespy on this; don't think I've ever used my horn 'in anger'.
Problem is that I don't develop the reflex of automatically tooting the horn so by the time I think to do it then it's too late.
Horns are of course useful if picking someone up from a house in a quiet residential street late at night. Announce your presence by a good triple blast then, if no response, simply repeat every 30 seconds.
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Recent examples (all over Christmas)
Entering into inside lane from a slip road with traffic on outside wanting to get across. Old guy starts to come across into me, I 'beep' and he stops his manouver until I had passed him.
Two drivers decide to straighen up a roundabout wihh me alongside - quick beep.
Someone reversing out of a drive.
I also gave a loud blast today at some stupid fool who was so busy staring at her large mobile screen mobile and texting that she nearly ran someone over at a pedestrian crossing - I had passed her, saw her texting then stopped at the lights, she went straight through on red.
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There is of course a recent thread on horns on which I posted an unpublished article on the subject (if you can call it a subject).
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a recent thread on horns
Yes, found it: author Hawkeye, end of March/early April 07.
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I was just reading this thread and thinking to myself "I never use it either" then realised I was hooting at someone this evening. I was trying to change lanes and the guy driving behind didn't want to let me go despite the fact he was in traffic and going slow. I suppose it's road rage to beep in such a situation.
Edited by franco on 06/01/2008 at 21:44
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I end up using it a few times a year, far more now then I used to, thats after an advanced driving course where we were told to use it, better to give a little beep then end up having to swap insurance details!!
I would ask you though Shoespy, how many times a year do you hear a horn if you have never used it? ;O)
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Same with me TU in particular on a motorcycle. Crap horn on the R1200 GS by the way.
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I think as a nation we're pretty undemonstrative horn-wise.
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Horn thoughts:
If you hate the sound of horns, do not ever, ever go to Cairo.
Most Japanese-made cars have vaguely musical but utterly useless efforts. If I had one such car I would *have* to do a DIY upgrade to something decent as a matter of honour.
Once fitted a magnificent set of Fiamm Sprints to an old Talbot Horizon I ran as a summer car , which would cause an avalance in the Alps from the other side of Europe. Had cause to use them on one meomrable occasion to avoid collision with a number of jaywalking fifth formers from a local public school, and blew off their straw boaters. Priceless.
On most "horn"occasions I would much prefer to have a microphone and PA system to convey the message precisely. I wonder if it would be legal...
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do not ever ever go to Cairo.
Been there. Mere clamour.
On the other hand the 2 or 3 am traffic outside Hotel Bobby in Ikorodu Road, Lagos about 35 years ago was something else. There was a night club in the hotel, so people and peanut and suya traders all over the dual carriageway outside. The taxis did this syncopated beeping as they approached to make sure that the traders or drunken night club people wouldn't get run over (they slowed down a lot too).
I f you were 'tired and emotional' enough the overlapping syncopated horn beeping would somehow blend in with the music from the night club thumping through the building and give you quite serious, although entirely agreeable, hallucinations when you were dozing on your bed upstairs having intended to go down for dinner.
Only gentleman's hotel in Lagos, or so I madly claimed at the time. Although uncomfortable like all the others in their different ways, and a bit expensive, it had a nice building and a somehow suave sort of atmosphere. I liked it anyway despite the more or less constant clamour.
Edited by Lud on 06/01/2008 at 23:19
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Blimey I use mine all the time, and at least three times a week accidentally when I'm using the steering wheel as a writing rest (while parked!)
Gunther has a particularly satisfying "THwarrrrrrp", much better than Polo's "meep".
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I will sound my horn if somebody pulls out or does something utterly daft for reasons of their own selfishness. However, if somebody simply makes a mistake, then I won't bother.
Case in point - guy simply stops car in the middle of the road to get out and buy something from a shop, blocking road, using hazards. Or guy lunges into my lane in his X5, causing me to change speed or course.
Selfish - sound horn.
Woman accidently misjudges a gap and pulls out. Whoops, we've all been there, have a nice day. No horn.
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Interestingly:
Early Noddy books said : poop-poop.
I used to have one before SWMBO gave it away.
Was it a collectors item?
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after an advanced driving course where we were told to use it
better to give a little beep then end up having to swap insurance details!!
That is interesting TU. I would not presume to argue with those who have clearly made a proper study of this but my own view has always been to try to drive in such a way as to be visible but not particularly noticeable if you see what I mean ?
Not so slowly or overcautiously as to impede anyones' progress but neither so fast or aggressively as to take anyone by surprise. This is of course is a relatively more recent philosophy as like many, as a younger man I think I probably showed less regard for my own and others safety ! ( in other words.......drove like a witch on fire ! ) But, even in those days I really can not recall finding it necessary to beep at anyone. I have always sort of taken the view that every other road user is potentially liable to do something daft until I have driven in close enough proximity to them for long enough to take a more informed view. If you take this stance I believe you can drive round most situations without the other party even particularly realising you were there. If someone has just put themselves into a dangerous scenario I feel the last thing you should do is distract what remains of their concentration by startling them with a blast on the horn. I simply try to get far away from their little "field of incompetence" as soon as practicable. Sounding my horn is hardly likely to suddenly improve their driving. Public displays of outrage and anger are of little service when tons of metal are being propelled about. Emotions are best held in check as the next "situation" may be only moments away and it is my view that what happened ten seconds ago is now irrelevant but what may happen in the next ten seconds is quite important.
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Hi again TU - Been thinking about your second point. " how many times a year do I hear a horn ?"
Now, I'm sure a psychologist would have an informed view on why this should be the case......... but here goes with my amateur theory.
How often do I hear a horn -
In my Mondeo estate - can't say I have ever been "tooted". My theory being that it is seen as a non-threatening vehicle to those who have"status" issues from either direction.
When I had a 5-series BMW - regularly, usually by drivers of older cars and vans. Theory being this time that urban mythical stereotyping was at play.
When I drive my wife's Ka - Rarely, but much more than in the Mondeo. Usually in a more bullying context. Amateur view being that some sort of pack code of small being equal to weak comes oozing out of the collective primeval conciousness.
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That is actually quite interesting SS, although as I am sure you guessed my question was rather TIC!
I can't actually remember the last time I was tooted at - no doubt it was by some beautiful young lady wishing to attract my attention - if only!!!!
But when driving numerous different cars, bikes and commercials I have never really noticed any difference - but then I have never driven a BMW for any length of time - I did however have an A6 as a company car, can't remember any attitude changes when driving this? But then it did have excellent sound proofing and a good stereo :o)
Would be interesting to hear if other BMW drivers get tooted more often then if driving another brand?
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Yeah, I know you were kidding don't worry ! But it did set me thinking about how different vehicles seem to trigger different subliminal responses. I can't be sure of course, but I don't think my basic driving style changes much depending on the type of car I happen to be driving but I'm pretty sure the way others treat you does.
I suppose it's the same part of the brain which assesses an individual based on their choice of clothes or even shoes !
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Would be interesting to hear if other BMW drivers get tooted more often then if driving another brand?
I honestly cannot remember the last time someone tooted at me but flashing of lights is entirely a different matter.
The journey to Southampton involves a lot of single carriageway A roads, and over a journey of 150 miles its inevitable you will often feel the need to overtaking slower traffic. When I'm doing this, I do it by the book. Wait for suffiently large gap, ensure everything is clear, accelerated around slower moving vehicle in textbook overtaking operation. When I had my Mondeo, I would do this and continue my journey without issue.
In the 5 Series, however, it's often a different story. Same manevour, just as safe (If not safer due to the considerably better acceleration), but 1/3 cars I overtake will flash their lights at me after I've done it for absolutely no reason whatsoever. I never, ever encountered this before.
It's quite bizarre.
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Apparently genuine extract from insurance claim when a car hit a cow:
What warning of approach did you give?
I sounded my horn.
What warning of approach did the other party give?
Moo.
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Times last year:
Coming up to traffic lights at 50, outside lane slowing with traffic but mine free, woman decides to pull into inside lane as our front/rear wings were side-by-side.
Indicate to pull off at roundabout, check mirror then look forward to see car which had stopped for me now pulling out. That was roughly 10 seconds but didn't stop them and thankfully there was plenty of run-off.
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Only a handful of times in 40 years whilst driving. Once on my current car ~ just to test it about 6 months after I bought it.
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Not unless someone does something really, really dangerous and out of order otherwise I can't be bothered.
Peugeot horns are so feeble anyway, it's not so much a "watch it mate!" as a "hello sailor".
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Horn?
Yachts Klaxon single tone all 175+db's. Classic, but very, VERY loud - Mawaaaahha.
Even makes truck drivers wake up :)
Best used on suicidal pedestrians and arrogant drivers that just swagger out in front of you, testing if you will give way when you (technically) don't have to - really makes 'em jump.
Yep, MOT day, it has to come off.
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I use the horn when I think it's necessary. Not often, but when I think I haven't been seen. I'd rather be cursed and noticed than be an accident.
On the motor-bike, I seem to be less of a magnet for dizzy pedestrians now I have 2 dipped Osram night breakers to look at rather than one headlight and haven't needed to use the horn on the bike yet.
This thread reminds me of the time I illegally blew the horn when stationary as a dog peed on the car. The startled dog leaped sideways into a passing van and the dog owner and I exchanged words. The dog was unharmed.
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You guys are all missing the point.
The horn has nothing to do with warning other road users of your presence. It is a piece of equipment cunningly designed to reinforce the departure of visitors who, having shaken hands all round and kissed all and sundry (often including the resident family's pet cat -and dog!), then feel it appropriate to give a minimum of three blasts as they set off on their homeward journey.
Recent departures from my locality this week suggest to me that the least intrusive of these abominations is the horn of the Skoda Octavia.
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You guys are all missing the point.
My parents hate it when I do that leaving their house - hence I now do it all the more :o)
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I have made the point on here before that it is the tone of the horn that is all important, in fact it would be good to have a choice depending on the circumstance.
Wife's Clio's horn emits a gentle "would you ever so kindly excuse me" 'pip' where as the Mondeo is not so polite, it's "get out of the beeping way" two tone parp can be misconstrued.
Both have their uses!
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So does every other person sit calmly behind some busy texter or someone having a power nap or someone window shopping or skirt watching or hulk watching, when the traffic lights have turned green, the road is clear and dinner is waiting?
Shoespy and others, I just do not believe it! :-))
IMO very quick toot toot, to move things along seems to be acceptable by all.
I too am wary of loud blasts as I think, these days, a large percentage of the population is slightly unstable ( backroomers excepted)
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www.nippynormans.com/products.asp?dept=259
These are the business as replacement horns. Cheap as well. One will be finding its way onto the Skoda before long to replace the wimpish pip squeak that is fitted as standard.
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Sorry :-))) I've just got this mental picture of a Roomster on two wheels piloted by "Mr Toad" ! No offense intended it's just my warped mind !
PARP !! PARP !!
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I've only had a very limited parp in it. It failed to impress !
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when the traffic lights have turned green the road is clear and dinner is waiting?
I dont use mine often but will try and give a polite short pip in the above circumstances, if they are really hanging around.
If someone does something really inept, eg. cuts me up but seems oblivious to other traffic I might give them a proper blast; depends what mood I'm in. But more likely to give them a second of main beam than sound the horn.
I had a Mk3 Golf that had a fairly feeble horn so I got a better Audi 100 one from a scrap yard. Much more meaty sounding..
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Our old neighbour at my parents house used to do it every day when he got home from work. He would sound the horn to get someone to come out of the house and open the gate for him, as he was too idle to wrestle his bulk out of the drivers seat and do it himself.
If nobody did it for him you could hear him chuntering up and down the drive.
Edited by Rich 9-3 on 07/01/2008 at 11:10
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Yes, though rarely.
Just today morning I had to use it as someone decided to pull out in front of me at the round about.
But I hear honking quite often in London roads. Especially pedestrians often don't pay attention to traffic lights.
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Yes. I used it this morning. A car started emerging backwards from his drive just as I approached. He either hadn't seen me, or had not bothered looking. I gave him a long blast. He took no notice, still creeping out so I gave him another.
On country roads with passing places I use it a lot, either to say "come on" or "thanks".
But there is no need to give an angry blast. It is worth aquiring the art of giving a a tiny muted "peep" rather than the full works, by just touching the button momentarily.
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The Accord horn has not yet been used in anger in the 6 months or so I've had it, although I did try to the other night when an Alfa on the inside lane of a dual carriageway didn't see me in his blind spot and pulled out on me whilst overtaking and almost alongside .....
I braked hard and hit what I tought was the appropriate spot each side of the steering wheel only to find that I had changed from Radio 2 to classic FM , engaged cruise control and the Alfa had disappeared into the distance....
Mental note - must check the horn position point on the wheel of new cars in future.
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A mate in the army bought a PA system, fitted it to his Citroen Dyane and caused consternation all over northern Germany. Childish but very entertaining.
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Pugs horn is still broken so couldnt use it if I wanted to.
C15's however is fine, apart from being a tad pathetic, I use it regularly , in fact did such not an hour ago, on the roundabout underneath Junction 5 of the M27, as yet another Honda Civic with an older driver goes all the way around in the outside lane without an hint of indication.
CBG
Edited by corblimeyguvnar{P} on 07/01/2008 at 16:38
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I am very interested in the Twin Magnums from Nippy Norman's. Thanks for that link btw!
139 dB sounds absolutely terrifying - just the thing.
Remember that episode of the Simpsons where Homer meets his long lost twin brother, a car magnate, and is given free rein to design a car, which massively runs over budget and bankrupts the company?
"I wanna horn button just THERE - you can never find the horn when you need it - and it has to play La Cucaracha..."
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The OP sounds like a saint.
Last night I used the horn twice over 4 miles. First time I was going round a roundabout, and someone entered to my left as I was about to pass an exit (it's a big roundabout) blocking my ability to take the next exit. So I sounded by horn to encourage them to get out of my way so that I could exit. I'm not sure what else i could have done apart from going around again. Later on I was stopped waiting for lights to turn green for a right turn. They turned green, but the junction was full of a line of cars stationary, totally blocking the junction. So I hooted to encourage them to move forwards/backwards, to clear a path. Here it is typical for cars to simply go through red lights, or to sit in the middle of junctions. It's not helped by (new) badly thought out light (mis) synchronisation.
And it is common place for cars going round a roundabout to change lanes, so as to straighten out the roundabout, and potentially side swipe others.
It's not as bad as the video I once saw of a city in India, but it is not good.
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The area I used to live in had half a dozen single track hump bridges, only two of which were traffic light controlled. When I was using one particular route home for a while, I used my horn twice a day.
I've also used it a few times to remind napping drivers that lights have gone to green. Probably the most common use actually, if technically incorrect.
Cheers
DP
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i live near a royal mail sorting office and the van drivers use the horn at all times of night and day to alert the gate house, i did a victor meldrew and complained ( by letter) and i received an apology from the transport manager and a book of first class stamps for the inconvenience !!!
Edited by milkyjoe on 09/01/2008 at 18:02
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But of course they carried on hooting through the night mj?
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oh yes, lud and even more on the run up to christmas
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I seem to use it about once a month where people are doing silly things, like starting off from lights when they are RED (sic). Maybe I'll be beaten up one day, but by then I'll have saved a life.
My T-reg 1.8 silver vectra hatch is forever being pipped at. My mother found driving with my late father in this (his last car) humiliating as he was forever being hooted.
But I am too. And others as well. Quite bizarre.
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Regularly and often.
But, then again, I drive a BMW.... ;-)
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>Patently
Blimey, speaking of horns, there's a blast from the past!
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From what I've seen, sounding the horn in most cases is only done to express annoyance at something another driver has already done. Sounding the horn after the event is completely pointless.
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L'escargot, thank you, you have just hit the nail squarely on the head. I would only add that on those occasions when some feel the need to sound it as an advance warning that they would be better employed concentrating their efforts on driving "around" the miscreant. There are plenty of drivers out there with "challenenged" abililty and and sounding your horn at them does not miraculously cure that, in most cases it angers or panics them and that is not helpful.
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So does every other person sit calmly behind some busy texter or someone having >> a power nap or someone window shopping or skirt watching or hulk watching, when >> the traffic lights have turned green, the road is clear and dinner is waiting?
I do ~ after I saw an incident in which a battered Toyota Hi-Lux pickup (complete with massive towbar) at the head of the queue was deliberately reversed (with apparent glee!) into the brand new Jaguar behind in retaliation. I'd sooner wait a few seconds than risk having the front of my car smashed up.
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From what I've seen sounding the horn in most cases is only done to express annoyance at something another driver has already done.
Granted - this will usually be true.
Sounding the horn after the event is completely pointless.
I can't quite agree with that. If someone honestly did not realise that what they did was stupid and dangerous, and no warning is given (whether given in concern or in anger), then they will happily do it again and may die or kill someone.
If a warning is given after the event, the idiot may learn from it.
And yes, while most horns are indeed sounded in anger, I'd rather someone dissipated their anger via the horn than by getting out and decking me. Not that I ever make any mistakes, of course ;-)
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Yes - a few times each year.
Usually a warning to pedestrians or other motorists to stop what they are doing otherwise they will be hit by/ hit my car . Pedestrians stepping off pavements with their backs to me or other drivers backing out of supermarket car parking spaces is a typical scenario.
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