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it's surprising just how far back the effects of a small crash are felt. Cars are designed to crumple to save the safety cell (ie the bit with the seats in it) it would be best to let a body shop have a look or maybe you know a friendly MOT guy who could give it the once over?
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crumple bars behind the bumper..? Around 2 inch across, running straight across the front infront of the radiator? Yeah that's bent... u shaped and pushed back aroun 3 or 4 Inches. When you say it needs inspecting do you mean I have to get a proper inspection done by law or anything? Me and my dad were hoping to straighten itover the weekend that's all.
Also, dunno if anyone can help with this... as I've gone in the back of someone I understand it will be classed as my fault. Just one thing, the cars infront of me stopped because a Police car did a U turn infront of them. My eye was taken off the car in front of me while I kept an eye on the police car because I thought the manouver it was making was going to cause an accident. Which it did but only because I was watching their irratic driving and not the car in front of me for... and honesty... it was half a second at the most.
So long story short the cars stopped and I was distracted... both caused by a police car doing a U turn just so they could speed check us (I asked why she'd done it). Do I have a leg to stand on?
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proper inspection? not if you don't want to.
leg to stand on? no, if you can't react safely to changing conditions around you, you shouldn't be driving.
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Erm... OK then. A bit harsh I feel for my first accident in 6 Years. that's my point though. I was reacting to the police car's daft driving when the car infront of me stopped. What am I supposed to do? Ignore the potential hazard which is someone (Police car or no police car) doing a u turn at speed in the dark and the rain? I thought I was doing the safest thing I could until I hit the car infront.
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not harsh, simple reality. It doesn't matter if you've been driving for 6 minutes, 6 days, 6 months, 6 years or 60 years - there isn't a driving fairy that says 'oh, he doesn't deserve an accident I'll wave my magic wand so it doesn't happen' it's all down to you, the one in 'control', the driver.
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"it's all down to you, the one in 'control', the driver. "
Totally agree... 100%
But sometimes as a driver you are put in a position where all you can do is damage limitation.
I personally feel that I let myself be distracted. However, I let myself be distracted by something that I thought needed my attenention as it was dangerous and given that the cars in front came to a screeching halt they thought so too.
So if a car/Driver in front does something dangerous and 3 cars take avoiding action but collide with each other in the process is the crash my fault as I went in the back of the last car or is it the fault of the dangerous driver who made us take evasive action?
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Once again someone posts on this site only to be-littled. This is what is going to stop people posting any questions.
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"do you mean I have to get a proper inspection done by law"
Regardless, for your own safety its wise to have the car inspected so you know you've not missed anything in repairing it.
"the cars stopped and I was distracted...Do I have a leg to stand on?"
Probably not - the counter-argument is that you should have left enough distance between you and the car in front to be able to react to the unexpected. But make a careful note of exactly what happened while its fresh in your mind so that you can fill out the insurance forms accurately if and when you're asked to do so.
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"But make a careful note of exactly what happened while its fresh in your mind so that you can fill out the insurance forms accurately if and when you're asked to do so."
Good idea and one I hadn't thought of. Thanks.
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Jim, what insurance do you have - I take it the Honda driver will be claiming from you. If you are third party then your car obviously isn't covered however if comp, then yuou may as well claim for your own car even if it means buying it back from ins co if they write it off.
--
2007 Seat Altea XL 2.0 TDI (140) Stylance
2005 Skoda Fabia vrS
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It's 3rd party fir and theft... didn't seem worth paying over £500 a year to insure a car that cost me £200
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"Yeah that's bent... u shaped and pushed back aroun 3 or 4 Inches. When you say it needs inspecting do you mean I have to get a proper inspection done by law or anything? Me and my dad were hoping to straighten itover the weekend that's all."
Only Law, I know of, is that the car should be able to pass an MOT and is roadworthy.
You can inspect it yourself if you know what you are looking for - but if you see any sign of bending or damage or scuffing on anything relating to the engine, gearbox or suspension, take it to a professional. If you cannot get a good clear view of the underside of the car, then take it to a garage.
A proper bodyshop would replace these bars behind the bumper because it will be weaker if it got hit another time, even if you bent it back into shape.
However I know many people who get minor bumps in old cars and just "bend it back", and maybe get a laser suspension alignment (£60) test done if they suspect suspension misalignment. If you are on a budget, the sensible thing is to go to a good body shop who are willing to use good quality reconditioned or undamaged scrap parts. But often the reality is that many people will bend it, hammer it and respray it if it is less than 5 years away from being scrapped, because the cost of a repair with new parts is more than the car is worth.
My advice is that you must replace anything that was designed to absorb damage, not bend it back.
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What should you be looking for?
A new car.
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Possibly the best suggestion so far...
bit gutting when you've just spent £220 on getting it taxed and tested tho...
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True; but as the sticker says:-
Life ain't fair - get over it.
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ok I'll stop being Mr Perfect now and offer some advice. If you can replace the headlights and align them properly and ensure there's no jagged metal sticking out then go for it. If it's just cosmetic run it to the next MOT or major breakdown and then scrap/sell for spares. I've had smashes in the past where a weekends work with a hammer and a trip to the scrappies has seen the car back on the road. If it's safe to drive and not dangerous to others then I don't see why not.
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That's exactly what I've been doing this aft. Headlamps for £25. Don't think that's bad.
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The main thing I would be concerned about are the two longitudinal members under the engine - the wishbones for the front suspension bolt onto these, and they are mounted very close to the front of the car. As these members would tend to buckle, you might not find the damage close to the front of the car, but perhaps further back, where there are changes to the shape of the section. These members are, IMO, safety critical, and NOT the sort of component to try to straighten. It's worth making sure the crossmember that they bolt to, which runs under the radiator, is also in good nick.
Most of the other members at the front of the car are fairly cosmetic, and I wouldn't be at all concerned about beating them back into shape.
As said above, make sure your headlights are secure and aligned properly, and make sure there are no sharp edges.
One of the good things about steel bodied cars is that there's usually lots of post-yield strength available. Put in another way, you don't necessarily lose a lot of strength after a bump; you might do if spot welds fail, or if the material rips, but the material doesn't turn to cheese!
Number_Cruncher
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I'm glad that there has been an element of self-moderating in this thread. The OP posted in good faith with a genuine question, no need to castigate him about the circumstances of an accident that we have the minimal amount of information about.
The question was a Technical one about his car and not his driving. Please consider the style of postings so that they don't sound smug.
There has been a complaint from a third party.
Complaint upheld !
PU -Moderator.
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Well it would seem that she lives!
Need to replace the bumper bar but everything else seems ok... Spen a long time inspecting the two "Longditudinal members" and the cross member at the front, also got my inspection double checked by my dad who more than knows what he's doing. All ok.
Does need the steel bumper bar replacing though as it seems to have taken most of the impact but everything else is now (Nearly) straight!
Couple of Things, A Yellow Hazard symbol popped out of the passanger side seat belt Buckle/Fastener (The thing you plug it into)... I guess that means the seatbelt has now served it's purpose and needs replacing? Understand they stretch to take the impact?
Secondly thanks to everyone... knowing where to look gives me a lot more confidence than I would have had without asking. Good website this is.
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Couple of Things A Yellow Hazard symbol popped out of the passanger side seat belt Buckle/Fastener (The thing you plug it into)... I guess that means the seatbelt has now served it's purpose and needs replacing? Understand they stretch to take the impact?
Yep, the seatbelt pre-tensioner has triggered. It doesn't stretch - what is does is retract slightly so as to tighten the seatbelt. From memory these pre-tensioners are mechanically activated by a heavy duty spring, rather than the more modern car which are electrically activated by piro-technics.
When replacing, if you get 2nd hand, first of all you need to lock the spring by means of a small red clip that slides into a hole somewhere in the mechanism. Failure to do this means that the energy stored in the spring will attack you when trying to remove the seat. Once fitted, you can then remove the locking clip.
All documented in the Haynes Manual, IIRC.
Edited by Dynamic Dave on 10/12/2007 at 10:23
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Ah... vauxhall just told me it's a piro device but they also told me it's safe to use without... it's not an MOT fail, is just an added safety measure. Though after what happened I think the more safety measures in place the better!
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Ah... vauxhall just told me it's a piro device but they also told me it's safe to use without... it's not an MOT fail is just an added safety measure. Though after what happened I think the more safety measures in place the better!
Its probably safe, but I am not sure about the MOT failure.
------
< Ulla>
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< Ulla>
Edited by Altea Ego on 10/12/2007 at 11:07
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Well to be honest the MOT doesn't matter. It's got 12 months on it and I won't be running this car in a year anyway. More bothered about the missus being safe if I should find myself/ourselves in the same position again.
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jim
If the seatbelts have done their job; then both they - and the pre-tensioner - must be replaced. Belts only stretch once.
If that is a pyro tensioner and it's fired; then you'll have an airbag warning light on.
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This is what I thought... they stretch to take impact and will not stretch a second time.
Vauxhall say not though? And that it's safe to drive as it is now apart from the bumper bar which I'm changing.
Have no airbag light, just this little 2 inch square yellow flag thing with a hazard symbol on which has popped out the side of the fastener. And it's only on one seatbelt, no others.
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1993 Mk3 Cavalier have sprung loaded pre-tensioners, as mentioned earlier. They're activated by a sudden jolt forwards of the front seats. Best to replace. I thought they were an MOT failure, but a colleague mentioned this morning that their car went through the MOT with the yellow tag showing.
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How bizzarre...
I would expect it to be an MOT fail and was pretty surprised when they said not. I'll have a look at the spring jobby tonight then.
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www.motuk.co.uk/manual_510.htm
Some seat belts are fitted with pre-tensioners:-
Once activated, a 'flag' or similar shows on the seat belt stalk.
In itself a seat belt that has had the pre-tensioner activated is NOT a reason for rejection.
The vehicle presenter should be advised.
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Well I drove to work this morning... Luxury!
Thanks to everyone.
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