A quick scan on Autotrader show 16 diesels under 5k (within 40 miles of here), only 15 of which were TDCi, the rest were the older TD.
Of the TDCis only 4 were under 100k, 3 in the 70s and one (private sale) at 46.
Maybe it's just a slow time of year, but I was hoping to spend less and get more...
L
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Actually, what about spending a grand or two less and getting a much lower mileage petrol model. Do you really need a diesel? Even if you do a lot of miles, the petrols are capable of decent economy and it would take an awful long time to make up the difference (especially if the 100k mile car starts needing parts).
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I have had my 2002 TDCi Ghia X from new, it now has done just under 120,000 miles and literally drives like new.
Only think to watch out for is the rear subframe bushes that needed doing on mine at just under 4 years old and about 100k miles, only £100 DIY, perhaps £250 at a dealer.
The truth is that a car can have taken 100,000 miles of abuse or 100,000 miles of TLC, difficult to know, however a three year old car with that sort of mileage will almost certainly have done a lot of its miles on the m/way so should hopefully be no more than nicely run in.
Valid points above about the relative merits of a diesel iks you dont do the mileage.
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Meant to say that £5k is about right, the other day I saw an 03 pre facelift Ghia TDCi with 100k ish miles and a dent in the drivers door for IIRC £5499. A high mileage 01/02 1.8 petrol LX or Zetec might be nearer £3k.
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I do around 100 mile round trip per day.
I take your point on parts but then what's to say a petrol won't have probs too?
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then what's to say a petrol won't have probs too?
I wasn't just referring to the engine though, more that everything (suspension, brakes, air-con etc) will be more heavily worn on a 100k car than a 50k car. I can see why a diesel appeals at 100 miles a day, but the downside is that your 100k car becomes a 150k car in 2 years. I'm certainly not saying don't get a diesel, just make sure you weigh up your options and work out your costs first.
As an example - just found a couple of typical 2003 1.8 LXs on Autotrader at £3995. One is 46k miles trade sale, the other is 36k miles private sale. I reckon either of them would do 3 years of your motoring at very little cost.
As for fuel, my old old shape 00X 1.8 LX easily averaged 40-45mpg on a decent run, and didn't miss a beat in the 5 years/50k miles I had it (20k miles in the last 12 months of ownership). Only significant problem was a £300 air-con repair last spring.
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I've enjoyed my Mondeo TDCi Ghia so far (since October 2003). Very comfortable, good to drive etc. Only negatives so far at about 53000 miles are:
- Front sub-frame bushes replaced around 30,000 miles
- EGR failed around 30,000 miles - clouds of smoke, poor acceleration
- EGR failed around 40,000 miles - car stopped and would not restart
- Clutch replaced 48,000 miles
- Bushes replaced at rear at last service
- Diesel fuel leak somewhere in injection system at time of clutch problems
- Currently can take 2 attempts to start, lots of smoke and maybe some hesitation in acceleration around 2000rpm... here we go again for EGR or fuel leak
- Rear doors rusting from inside out at bottom - and now find the lease company possibly didn't agree to bodywork inspections so my company might pay for new doors. No stamps in service book but not my fault as I am not party to maintenance work only book it in when needed.
But I still like the car a lot. And as a company vehicle I'd get another. Except new Mondeo a lot more expensive on the scheme and I'm now looking at alternatives as of Tuesday of this week :-) I see a thread coming on.
Rob
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Forgot to add... if MPG not an issue get a petrol. These are good cars but and old diesel may prove costly.
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>Except new Mondeo a lot more expensive on
check again, rates have suddenly dropped in last three weeks because Ford is now discounting this to Fleets.
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TourVanMan TM < Ex RF >
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Our online quoting system (via Leaseplan) has the following oddities in my opinion:
- Mondeo 2.0 TDCi Ghia 5dr £398pm
- Avensis 2.2D T4 5dr (so lots of kit like DVD sat nav) £305pm
And a really odd one that I've got Leaseplan onto:
- Avensis 2.2D TR 5dr (basically same spec as a T4 but £950 cheaper) £372pm!!
I know this is "paper money" as the opt out allowance totally different to my allowance for a company car.
Okay Ford is new and the Toyota is being replaced next year but I drove the T4 2.2D today briefly and might like it. Compared to the TDCi very very quiet engine. But it is the one out of the Lexus IS220d.
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well my leaseplan online quoting system has 2.0 tdci 5 dr Ghia three year fully maintained at £361
and the Avensis 2.2 d4dtr at £440!
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TourVanMan TM < Ex RF >
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Rob, you are a man of infinite patience. If a car had given me that mucb grief in 53,000 miles I certainly wouldn't like it at all, let alone a lot. I can honestly say that you've had more problems than I had in 21 years and 500,000 miles between seven Renaults (1980-2001). And they all started first time every time.
On the other hand, Cheddar has had a good one, so, Lou O, you'll need to look carefully at the service history.
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Avant I think I have at times been unlucky and why maybe I should get the Toyota Avensis next to ruin their reputation :-) But on the whole the Mondeo has been reliable and only broken down once and I've got other problems fixed before they became a problem. You got hints of problems so pop around the corner and get it sorted - less than a mile from the local dealer who have been good. But have not done bodywork inspections.... so that part of the warranty void. Something for all to be aware of. This check is apparently an extra £10.
For othe cars.. Golf GTI 1.8T:
- Needing a new gearbox on collection
- Door locks needed replacing because they would not lock
- Same Golf needing squeaking seats fixing
- Nicked after 6 months :-)
Replacement Passat 1.8T Passat:
- New turbo needed on collection... only replaced after the gearbox done first
- Door locks needed replacing because they would not lock (a VW problem then....)
- Wind noise took months to trace to a small pin hole in driver door mirror
- Air con failed after 3 years
- Air bag problems
So don't by my second hand cars! Patience not part of this though - company vehicles. And I've been unlucky enough not to now want to take the cash instead. Last year had my first major accident - HGV crashed into the rear of the hired Fiesta!
Once had a Vectra B which had a failed alternator and it took two months to get the part.... so I had to put up with a Vectra 2.5v6 instead of the 1.8LS! But then also got an Audi A4 1.8T Sport whilst the Golf written off ... three months ;-) Company loan/temp instead of the more expensive 1.4 hire car.
Rob
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I think I may have to raise my budget or buy very carefully. Although the advice about the petrol engine does make a lot of sense and I'll have a hunt around and see how it adds up.
I haven't got the time or patience for cars to be in the garage - owning an Alfa a few years back ground that out of me.
I've had 2 Mondeos over the years, a 1.6 on M plate which I sold to a mate and is still going strong after 115k and my current 2.5 on an N plate which, although it's the tattiest car I've ever had (bought for 800), it just keeps on going. The fuel costs are depressing though. I wonder if I could track down the woman I sold my S2000 to a few years ago and see if I can have it back....
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Sorry to put you off. But these are based on my experience. Sure the petrol as an older car is very good. I like the diesel torque but could live with a 2.0 petrol as a personal vehicle. Almost all of my problems have been TDCi related.
Note my car is one of the first Mondeo TDCi Euro IV cars. Built September 2003 just as they became available. Might have suffered because of that.
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Doing some very rough sums:-
1.8 petrol mpg=37
2.0TDCi mpg=47
100 miles a day 365 days per year
fuel = £1.00 per litre
Then diesel saving is roughly 200 quid per year....buy the petrol model!
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With diesel so expensive, I think you only go for diesel if:
- company driver and want low emissions on a big car
- you like the torque on a diesel
With VW and others looking at turbo and even supercharged-turbo engines then petrol is coming back.
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"Then diesel saving is roughly 200 quid per year....buy the petrol model!"
I'm sorry but the above answer is just plain wrong asthe poster has used litres and gallons:
calculated usage in gallons.. and then the savings by multiplying by the price per litre.:-(((((
If that is the arithmetical ability of a petrol car driver:-)
The correct answer is around £900 per year... which is SIGNIFICANT....
madf
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LOL.....I knew that sounded too good to be true ...serves me right for posting after a beer or two...I'll write out " I must buy a TDCi" 100 times longhand in penance ;-)
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>>100 miles a day 365 days per year
Assuming Lou's 100 mile round trip is to work, let's give Lou the weekends off and some holidays making it 230 days so I calculate roughly that is an extra £600 a year on petrol over diesel assuming price parity. With extra road tax on the petrol car, £2,000 over 3 years would make me think quite hard if I wanted to spend the extra money and put 70K on a 100K CR diesel with all the scare stories or spend less on an equivalent spec petrol and feel a bit more comfortable about the cost of parts and repairs should anything go wrong. Car Giant have a 2002 TDCi 130bhp with 66k miles at £5,999 and a 2002 2.0 petrol Zetec 79k miles at £3,599.
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Assuming Lou's 100 mile round trip is to work let's give Lou the weekends off and some holidays making it 230 days
Thanks!
Would you be free to do my annual review in a couple of weeks? I could use someone who lets their staff have weekends and holidays - might even squeeze a pay-rise out of you too :)
Mind you, I would probably be in the car at weekends too, visiting family and friends and then add on all the little trips here and there to the shops, golf and whatever. I reckon I'm looking at the thick end of 30k a year.
Looking at the figures I reckon:
37:47 = 0.787
So the diesel is about 20% more efficient.
0.787 * 30000 = 23617
So at 23000 miles the fuel cost breaks even (I'm assuming diesel costs the same as petrol, which it does around here at the moment)
7000/47 = 148.9
So 150 gallons extra (@ 0.95p)
£643
Over 3 years this adds up to around 2k, which in many cases is what you'll pay extra to drive a diesel.
This seems counter-intuitive, did I miss something or make a mistake in my reasoning or maths?
If I haven't made an error think I've proved to myself (thanks to the previous posters who wrote the same thing, but it's always good to work these things through for yourself) that unless you're driving a company car, you need to be doing more than 30k a year for a diesel car to deliver serious savings.
Thanks,
Lou
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How I'd work out a simplistic cost for fuel over 30,000 miles (hope I get it right):
Diesel cost = 30,000miles / 47mpg * 4.54litre/gallon * £0.95 = £2753 (rounded)
Petrol cost = 30,000miles / 37mpg * 4.54litre/gallon * £0.95 = £3497 (rounded)
So the difference is £744 per annum.
But this is not really the difference is it. You're not going to always get 47mpg out of the diesel and the petrol won't be doing 37mpg either. Around town they will both be a lot lower and the diesel will only produce it's highest mpg figures when warmed up properly. Because diesels are thermally efficient then they take longer to warm up and so get lower mpg until then. For stop/start around town driving a diesel can have low mpg - still better than petrol.
One comment though, if you're doing 30k miles a year, then starting in one already on 100k might not be that wise. Could be looking at costly bills down the line.
Rob
P.S. Check for rust on the bottom of all doors and on bonnet/boot. My rear doors are rusting from inside out and only just realising Leaseplan do not pay for bodywork inspections (it's £10 I think) so the corrosion warranty is void. You should also check the bodywork inspection stamps are there in the log book or the warranty is void too. Leaseplan gamble because most cars kept for 3 years or less and so unlikely to have rust... mine was on a 4 year lease.
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My tdci has now got 124k miles under its belt.
Front discs at 50k miles
Rear discs and a caliper at 60k miles
Rear suspension at 63k miles
aircon regassed at 73k miles
new discs all round and new exhaust at 87k
handbrake lever and brake fliud change at 97k
new radiator hose at 87k
new injector pipe, handbrake cables and aircon work at 89k
aircon regassed at 94k miles
I bought her at 99k miles and changed an aircon pipe to get that working, its been fine since
since then I've put a new power steering pump and water pump on her
and a new rear brake caliper yesterday.
This is in addition to standard servicing.
Its still averaging 47mpg, better at constant speeds, worst on country lanes and trips into London
--
I read often, only post occasionally
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