"Flatulent cows, burping chickens and belching sheep have been blamed for increasing global warming emissions by 20 per cent in a United Nations report."
Next time I drive past a horse and rider, I'll wind the window down and shout "How dare you destroy our fragile plant by driving (sic) that emitter of global warming causing bottom burps (1) you irresponsible maniac. Go and buy yourself a 4x4.".
Anyway, I am confused. If we all stop eating meat, and start eating lentils, the net methane output will be the same, but we'll all be gagging for fresh air when indoors with other non-meat eating people.
I think this is all academic. According to a recent New Scientist article supplies of many metals such as copper and iron will run out in the next 10 to 20 years, so we won't have cars, or combine harvesters, or even computers to support forums where we can rant till the bottom burping (1) cows come home. It makes me wonder what will happen to our society, when and if cars become a luxury. The whole driving force for our current way of life is consumerism, and commuting to and from a place of work to create a product to support consumerism.
(1) Sorry to use such a twee phrase but the swear filter will not allow the preferred word. Sigh.
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I suppose that in the light of this statement that global warming didn?t exist back in the Jurassic/createous periods! what with huge swamps virtually everywhere festering, slurping, and belching vast amounts of methane in to the already quite noxious, sulpher laden atmosphere, caused by all the active volcanoes at the time.
Also there were millions of creatures then that were predominantly herbivores (very good at producing gas as opposed to carnivores) that were as much as fifty times bigger that the biggest modern day cow. Not to mention all the decaying plant matter that was rotting down and releasing its stuff during the laying down of the coal seams.
Earth was a far nastier place back in those days than it is now, but evolution and life still continues.
On a motoring theme, now that our bins are going to be micro-chipped for excessive waste, and along the lines saving the Earth, being green, and of cows and methane, I?m thinking of chucking all my kitchen waste into my boot, and piping the resulting methane into my engine!
Global Warming ? Humbug!
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I am probably not getting this right! If there are too many flatulent ruminants destroying the planet we should surely reduce the numbers by eating more of them?
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According to a recent New Scientist article supplies of many metals such as copper and iron will run out in the next 10 to 20 years so we won't have cars
Then it's far sillier than I could possibly have imagined!
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Leif: "According to a recent New Scientist article supplies of many metals such as copper and iron will run out in the next 10 to 20 years"
Sorry, but that is utter ineffable twaddle on behalf of whoever wrote it. Basic economics says no (There is copper unexploited today because it's uneconomic to do so. If supplies start to run short, prices increase and it becomes profitable to develop those reserves).
And I'll bet £10,000 of real money, today with anyone, that we don't run out of copper or iron (God help us) in the next 15 years. In fact, I'd bet £100,000 on it.
India alone has 13 billion tons of known iron ore reserves. Worldwide consumption is 1.25 billion tons per annum. No, no, no.
V
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Wasnt oil supposed to run out in 20 years anyway? Why dont we buy two cars each, and the oil will run out in 10 years. That way Green house gasses will cease in 10 years and we will all be saved.
or is there a flaw in that argument?
And another thing, if there is - what was it 145 milllion chickens?, then shouldnt a daily visit to KFC be made legaly mandatory for each UK citizen untill we have gobbled up this surplus?
See another cure. The global warming doo dah is easy to fix. Just put me in power.
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TourVanMan TM < Ex RF >
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Uncaring local newspaper editor.
Journalist either vegetarian or so inexperienced they will believe or take anything at face value.
Politico with easy soundbite - maybe also vegetarian.
Mix freely to produce more global warming twaddle.
I have absolutely nothing against vegetarians by the way - or even gay vegetarians, honestly. ;-)
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I think you may have come close to hitting on it there, HJ, but for other reasons.
SWMBO and I have just extrapolated on your figures (with the help of a very enjoyable dinner and 1.5 litres of passable Merlot) and we have hit on the missing factor - it is indeed people that are the problem, but a particular type of people.
Earlier in this thread I mentioned the vegetarian factor but I now realise it was more important than I first thought.
Cows and other innocent animals eat vegetarian diets and emit methane. But vegetarian humans are also guilty, if not more so.
They eat beans, pulses and the like by choice and everybody knows the result - almost uncontrollable flatulence. Therefore, vegetarians are contributing more to global warming by spontaneous emission of methane - and by choice - than the rest of us.
Think about it. 100 years ago there were almost no vegetarians - and nobody was worried about global warming!
The answer is obvious, but probably easier to impose in an area like Islington than the world in general - stop vegetarians eating beans and buying 4x4s and make them ride bikes. And stop being afraid of GM crops - the development of anti-flatulence beans could help save the planet!
I think I'll go to bed now.
Please don't ban me from the site for this. You haven't yet heard my theory on using prisoners to generate cheap and environmentally-friendly electricity...
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"Wasn't oil supposed to run out in 20 years anyway"
Yes, that's what I was taught in the '60s. All oil ran out 20 years ago - your car is running on fresh air.
Interesting item on BBC news tonight that swallows had arrived early in Britain because of a warm Spring in Britain.
Pray tell me how a swallow in Africa knows Spring is early in Britain? "Ay up lads and lasses, its a warm April in Leics, less of the hanging about in Africa, see you in Sileby next week"
Also, because of early spring, plants have bloomed early, but the bees are not there to pollinate them so there will be crop failure. So if the plants knew it was warm, how come the bees didn't?
Immediately followed, of course, by the weather forecast which predicted a very cold, wet and thoroughly miserable weekend. In other words, the usual variable Briish weather, whereby every warm day is "Global warming" and the in between cold and wet is the "variable weather caused by global warming"
Remember last Whit holiday? Bloomin' cold northerly winds. Remember last spring ? Bloomin' cold. Remember last June/July? - pretty hot. Remember August??? Rather chilly. That's British weather.
The population problem will not occur, because as Malthus said population will outrun food supply, leading to a decrease in food per person and mass famine to balance the equation. This will occur by the middle of the 19th century.
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Phil
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"This will occur by the middle of the 19th century."
Oh good - I missed it! Lucky I just had a full English breakfast before going to work!
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Have 'they' done the usual trick of quantifying the emmissions from the cattle without looking at how much is absorbed during the production of the fodder and grass?
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Bill Oddie was asked about the effect of global warming/earlier springs on wildlife on R4 this morning. Most of his reply consisted of abusing the journalist for asking a sloppy question.
Not sure if he got round to answering or informing the listeners. A bad hair day for Bill as SWMBO would say.>>
AFAIK, Bill Oddie studied English literature at university and watches birds for a living. Much as he would like you to think he is - he is not a scientist - so don't expect a sensible answer on climate issues.
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AFAIK Bill Oddie studied English literature at university and watches birds for a living. Much as he would like you to think he is - he is not a scientist
Bill Oddie studied english literature, is an entertainer for a living, and watches birds and wildlife as a hobby. Makes him less of a scientist
However, his hobby means he probably has a good handle on changing wildlife habits and can make a reasoned assumption that its caused by climate change.
Dont put your heads in the sand guys, climate change IS happening. Is it natural or man made is the question.
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TourVanMan TM < Ex RF >
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"Don't put your heads in the sand guys, climate change IS happening."
Yep, according to IPCC, temps have increased by 0.6 deg since 1880 - most of which occurred before 1940. That's if you accept that temps were 14deg in 1880 ( or- 0.6 deg) and are now 14.6deg ( or - 0.6)
Now, can you prove that the predictions they make (temps will increase between 1 deg and 6.5 deg in next hundred years ) will actually happen? 1 deg will make no perceptable difference (and most of us will be dead anyway), 6 deg could be a disaster (for Africans). Seems to me, that prediction is pretty close to a guess. (especially since in the 2001 report they said it would be between 1.5 and 4.5 - ie they are less sure now than in 2001)
April was lovely and warm - absolute proof of global warming, today was damned chilly and tomorrow will be worse - I reckon an ice age is on the way.
Now let's be honest about this global warming lark. Even if it is going on, if every person in Britain (60 mill) cut his CO2 emissions to zero, it would make no perceptible difference to world CO2 emissions (pop 6000mill). For a start, 90% of CO2 comes from volcanoes or is natural from elsewhere. For a second, 90% of the world population have never heard of global warming and even if they had, they live in such conditions that they would be incapable of reducing their emissions because survival is their only concern.
Even when they know, they are hardly set a good example. Mugabe is spending billions on a memorial palace to his "enlightened reign" which has consigned most of the pop of his country to poverty and starvation. 80% of the aid given to Nigeria (potentially one of the richest countries of Africa) ends up in Swiss bank accounts - accounts of the politicians/criminals.
Paying extra taxes on your fuel and road tax of your "gas guzzler" may salve your conscience but it does more to fill Brown's coffers.
How about a wind farm - brilliant - but when is the coldest winter weather? It's when we have high pressure systems over us - with no wind.
Oh dear the polar bears are dying - no they aren't - of the 312 colonies in Canada, 300 are increasing in numbers and some are increasing so fast they need culling.
Now, if global warming has increased temps by 0.6 deg in 127 years (IPCC figures) can you please tell me how Bill Oddie has noticed the difference during his lifetime? If he wants to reduce global warming I suggest he stops breathing rather than suggesting that 4x4s are taxed more (I don't have, and don't want a 4x4 - but if you want/need/can afford one go ahead).
I've just boiled the kettle for a cup of char - it took a couple of minutes, now, for the planet's temp to increase significantly, something has to heat the oceans a bit - and there is a fair bit more water in the oceans than my kettle - some scientist suggested that it would take 10,000 years to change ocean temps significantly and as far as I know, our climate is determined mainly by that big lump of Atlantic just to our west.
The climate warming lark is just an excuse to tax our driving more, why haven't taxes increased on all the other things that produce CO2?
You lot who want and can afford a gas-guzzler - carry on, buy one, enjoy it. Turn your central heating to the temp you want, eat meat if you like it, get a patio heater (hang on - you don't need that - summers are getting hotter!)
We have a short life, why sacrifice your pleasures for someone who might live 200 years in the future?- lots sacrificed their lives 1914-1918 for "the war to end all wars"
I'm off to France next week, been keeping an eye on weather forecasts. A couple of days ago, it predicted non-stop rain and temps of 6 deg, but I was cheered just now by a forecast of sunshine on Tues and Wed and temps of 13deg. Mind you, it depended on which website I looked at - they all seem a bit unsure of what weather will be like 3 or 4 days ahead.
Could you all go out in your cars, drive around, bung a bit more CO2 out to warm it up for Tuesday?
Very odd that they can't predict within 7 deg what it will be like on Tuesday but can tell me what the temp will be in 100 years, and tax me on that basis.
It's all political spin - when did you last her a politician tell the truth? Don't know because they have just exempted themselves from being subject to Freedom of Information Act. Oh, and while destroying your pension, gave themselves the best protected pension rights known to man, and a good pay rise to boot.
So do you believe them about climate change????
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Phil
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PhilW
With you all the way, as you may have already gleaned from my previous posts on the subject, including the fact that the warmest winter we've ever had was in the 19th Century - not many 4x4s, Jumbos etc around at that time....:-)
I've also mentioned the River Thames ice bound fairs in the 17th Century.
Reminds me that if you keep saying something often enough and for long enough, it becomes "fact".
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What\'s for you won\'t pass you by
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Dont put your heads in the sand guys climate change IS happening. Is it natural or man made is the question.
That *is* a question. When scientific concensus is such that the idea that there may be some risk appears to have some base, it seems foolhardy to ignore it. There're positive factors to changing our ways to some degree as well - in that even if there is no risk at all, controlling pollutants of various sorts is useful to the environment, could conserve resources, and leads to scientific advance. So - go along with the theory. If it's baseless, we'll still benefit.
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