The nearest thing we have to minimum speed limits is the category of vehicles and drivers banned from motorways.
When younger I used to dream longingly of traffic police going round fining people for getting in the way, but years of reality have driven that nonsense out of my head.
Some people simply travel too slowly, and they are allowed to. Sad but true.
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When younger I used to dream longingly of traffic police going round fining people for getting in the way
A world with no overtaking... I quite like overtaking people!
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hi folks,
me thinks that for example, in a 30mph zone, the speed limit is anything between 0 and 30mph, so it should be quite legal (although impracticle) to travel at 1mph without being "done". Possibly only if you were to "stop" in an inappropiate place would you be done for for Obstruction ( me knows about that now aswell!) ;-) Some roads have a min speed limit as well as a maximum one, so travelling too slow on these roads could see you "done".
billy
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One of the travel games we had when I were a lad was a set of cards featuring road signs to spot along the way. One of these was a minimum speed sign (white digits on a blue circle) but I don't think I ever saw one. Not sure I've seen one since, although I have a dim recollection of a minimum speed through the Blackwall Tunnel. Anyone else know where it might apply?
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If you pull over where possible/necessary to let any traffic pass that's a good start to avoid being "done".
So does an HGV travelling on a NSL single-carriageway road at its limit of 40mph have to consider pulling over from time to time?
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So does an HGV have to consider pulling over from time to time?
Yes.
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A definition here for careless driving and also driving without reasonable consideration: www.cps.gov.uk/legal/section9/chapter_b.html#22
Does not mention any 'trigger speeds'; does the ACPO have guidelines on it?
ISTR hearing about a bloke a few years ago, got stopped and fined for driving at 30 or 40mph on a motorway?
Just found this one:
Pensioner fined for slow driving: news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/3694201.stm (sounds like the charge was careless driving.)
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Prosecutions for travelling too slowly?
try your favourite search engine, limited search to uk only, for the words: [ fined for "driving too slowly" ].
that should bring up a few real life cases.
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does an HGV travelling on a NSL single-carriageway road at its limit of 40mph have to consider pulling over from time to time?
I should hardly think so, 40MPH isn't excessively slow. It would be courteous to do so, though, if there were very limited overtaking opportunities for any distance.
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I should hardly think so 40MPH isn't excessively slow.
Would that apply for a car as well?
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[40MPH not excessively slow] Would that apply for a car as well?
I have never heard of anyone being prosecuted for driving on an "ordinary" road at 40MPH. WRT the courtesy aspect, yes, and, I'd say, to drivers of motor-caravans, tractors, diggers, etc.etc. etc.
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The problem is that on most roads, it would be totally impractical to define a minimum speed limit due to congestion etc. So the law has to be woolly, and not define a limit for most roads, hence it is impractical to do anything about it.
I have no particular problem with drivers going somewhat slowly (eg 40 in a 60 is the most common), it's the large number of wallies who will insist on doing 40 in a 60, then 40 in a 30 through a village, followed by 40 in a 60 again that really get me rattled. I even had one up my backside the other day for the heinous crime of travelling at 32mph through a village, who was then left for dead (at a steady 55) on the (slightly) twisty country road immediately afterwards.
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I remember a report in the paper some years ago about an old man who was prosecuted for doing 15mph in a 30, probably because he had a massive tailback of traffic behind him.
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In a strong crosswind, my little Suzuki van can only do 50 mph safely when unladen on account of high sides and light weight - I have had to slow down to this speed on the M6 several times over the years and it would be frankly ridiculous for there to be a law that states I have to be travelling above a certain speed if this would greatly increase the risk of my van going over.
I once had to drive it in near galeforce winds on national speed limit roads and could only get up to 35 safely - such is life - better get there in a slow van than in a wooden box.
I dont think anyone could reasonably enforce a minimum speed limit as travelling slowly isnt unsafe - its up to drivers going faster to anticipate the speed of slower vehicles and plan accordingly - if they cannot do that or are unable to control themselves emotionally while dealing with slower vehicles ( how many times have you seen Mr Im In A Hurry Get Outta My Way behind you with an expression along the lines of someones whos mother you just insulted ),
they shouldnt have a license, or at the very least, think about anger management courses.
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I remember once a driver of a combine harvester was prosecuted because he wouldn't pull over to let a huge queue pass. Serves him right, i would have been apoplectic.
Last summer a vehicle with horses on board held up a huge queue going across north yorkshire to Harrogate. I was late for a gig - a wedding. When I did overtake eventually, I let them have a huge blast of my horn. I hope the horses had a fit.
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Hmm... on a 6 mile stretch of road in Devon we see how many cars we can pick up behind us in the horse box. Best record was on a Saturday morning when we reckon we had a queue half a mile long of tourists behind us. Not that I would ever admit to doing anything so childish, but since there's only one place you can pull in to let cars pass on that road and it's usually blocked, there aren't really any other options.
My brother once got followed home by several cars after he cheerfully trundled 12 miles home in the tractor and trailer without pulling in. I'd been stuck behind him and took a shortcut through the lanes.
And on the slow driving issue, my uncle assures me that many moons ago he was stopped and ticketed by the police for driving too slowly on the motorway.
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My friend once got caught by police for going at 40 mph on Motorway.
No prosecution though, the police simply advised him to go at least 50 mph.
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Hmm... on a 6 mile stretch of road in Devon [...] there's only one place you can pull in to let cars pass
I don't believe it. Which road?
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I think this is a pretty good article on the subject: Slow Driving and Safe Driving: www.speedlimit.org.uk/art_slowdrive.html
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As DH indicates, farmers quite enjoy mischievously building a queue of furious sweating grockles in overheating repmobiles behind them. Some years ago in Sussex I quite enjoyed helping a cousin of my wife block a major A road with hundreds of sheep (or sometimes, tens of cattle) while moving them from one bit of his farm to another. One would drive ahead of them on full beam on the wrong side of the road, generally behaving like the police during a national emergency and more or less politely ordering people about.
Minicab drivers in south London do the same sort of thing in morning rush hour, stopping for a chat in bottlenecks like the southern exit from the roundabout at the bottom of Chelsea Bridge Road until the queues of commuters started to hoot in earnest.
The natural human tendency to be a playful pain in the fundament just because one can.
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I won't hear a bad word said about farmers, we are relying on them to supply our food until the U-boat threat has passed. And when that happens I shall ban all agricultural machinery from the public highway.
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A382 out of Bovey Tracey.
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The criterion for obstruction used to be a queue of ten vehicles or more.
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Ah, excellent - well, we beat that easily.
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There is a minimum speed limit on the A45 near Northampton; cant remember the speed off hand but its near the car auctions!
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Ridiculous. There certainly are places where you could pull over or slow further to let traffic pass. If anti-social behaviour is simply enjoyable, then that at least is an an explanation.
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Like I said, there is one place* - but it often has cars parked in it so you can't pull in. In summer the hedges prohibit getting in close to the side anyway, and even a powerful car can only overtake safely at one or two places in the road. Having driven along it many hundreds of times you usually get stuck behind some sort of vehicle, and it's mostly a tourist doing about 15mph in the middle of the road for fear of scratching their shiny car in the hedge rather than a heavy vehicle.
It's just a narrow road that's inadvertently been given an A-road classification. Even during the winter you can expect to stop and reverse at a couple of points on the journey.
Fantastic road in the dead of night though, you can do the six miles in under 15 minutes.
* Actually, there is a second and third spot but they're both at either end of the road which makes using them a touch pointless.
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Fantastic road in the dead of night though you can do the six miles in under 15 minutes.
Er... surely you mean 5 minutes DH? Or are we talking pony and tarp here?
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I recall hearing some years back about a driver who was fined for driving too slowly. I don't think he was old, but drove slowly for some weird safety reason. I think he was routinely stopped by the police. sadly I cannot find anything using Google.
Anyway, this is all academic, as we will all be doing no more than 20 mph:
www.thisislondon.co.uk/news/article-23396354-detai...e
Some of these people should wear a bell round their necks so we can hear them coming.
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Anyway this is all academic as we will all be doing no more than 20 mph: www.thisislondon.co.uk/
Some of us give London a wide berth!
--
L'escargot.
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I also remember some students being stopped by the police for driving at about 4 mph in the fast lane, because the driver was on acid
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I always slow down for horses, after all they might rear up and land on my car, that would never do. Horseboxes are different, I overtake at maximum revs and then attempt to induce epic backfires. I frequently observe that the driver of the vehicle towing the horsebox gives me a friendly Churchillian wave. Which is nice.
As far as I am aware, no Devon yokel has ever mastered the art of overtaking another vehicle.
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As far as I am aware no Devon yokel has ever mastered the art of overtaking another vehicle.
That is because the roads are often little more than narrow winding dirt tracks several hundred metres below the level of the surrounding fields. Or as we Midlanders like to call them, mazes. The straw sucking yokels hurtle round the mazes at warp speed in their battered old vehicles getting pleasure from scaring the bejeezus out of unsuspecting grockels.
The Devon lanes do make for some very enjoyable driving.
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Yes, I visited Devon several years ago, nice scenery but very strange inhabitants.
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Yes I visited Devon several years ago nice scenery but very strange inhabitants.
Are you referring to the masses of second home owners down from London for the school hols, the hordes of retired people from elsewhere, or the mutant inbred locals? A substantial proportion of the latter are dim witted conmen who prey on old people such as my late mother. You would not believe how many people conned her out of money (and we are talking about someone who was in a wheelchair and with poor eyesight). Charging extortionate rates for gardening, then simply stealing plants to sell on was typical.
My half brother and my half sister were both born and bred in Devon. They prove your point.
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">They prove your point.<"
Thank you. One should always be wary of half-siblings, keep your wallet with you at all times. And lock the bedroom door.
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I've found that in Cornwall a speed limit of 40 mph seems to apply on all roads that are not dual carriageways.
More seriously, a car doing only 50 on an uncongested M-way is sometimes almost a hazard because other car drivers just don't expect a car to be going that slowly.
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">a car doing only 50 on an uncongested M-way is sometimes almost a hazard <"
As long as they remain in lane 1 and I can use lane 3 then there is no problem. Bad news for the lorry drivers though.
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">Arrrrrrrrr.
Of course. Have you considered some form of remedial education? Just a thought!
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">Arrrrrrrrr. Of course. Have you considered some form of remedial education? Just a thought!
I think I'm too far gone - my mum's from Liverpool, with her ancestors having invaded us from Norway, and my dad's from Manchester, with his grandmother from Wales; and I live in Devon but go to Uni in Leeds. So it's a lost cause trying to educate me, but I do know one thing for certain: it's "bath", not "barrth". ;-)
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It's the 'culture' in this country isn't it.....if you can hold someone up, then do so. How many times do you drive down a road, see someone want to pull out of a side turning, they make an enormous effort to get out quickly....then drive most casually and hold you up
or..... you come out of a village/town...60mph NSL and the 40 mph person could easily pull into the nearside a bit allowing you to pass quite easily....but no...this is England...stick to the middle of the lane, if not out nearer the crown and hold them up
or.... on an A road, someone bimbling along and several cars/vans/lorries in a queue (nothing wrong with that)..... faster car comes up behind .....how many of the bimblers bunch up on purpose or are so unware that they wouldn't know to leave a healthy gap to help the driver behind...which prevents the faster car from overtaking, because the faster car would need to do 'all or nothing' and that would be unsafe.
or....you overtake on a nice A road, with enormous amounts of vision and the 40mph man gives you loads of main beam and gesticulating....(if you're really lucky his missus will do it as well).. i often give a little friendly wave back
but of course they've been sold the 'speed kills' theory haven't they......so the faster driver is automatically a rabid child killer.........
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Ah Westpig, you're really sound on this one, one of my own pet hates too.
I blame the driving test. Nervous learners are constantly told by their instructors not to worry about getting in the way, which is appropriate enough in most cases. But if and when they pass their tests, no one bothers to remind them that the time has now come to start worrying about getting in the way (and a lot of other stuff thought too difficult or confusing for learners).
Of course apart from that, there's the decline in manners. People walk straight at you on the pavement or stand blocking it like a bunch of smelly cud-chewing cattle. The theory is that you can walk round them. They aren't going to compromise are they? That might risk showing that much condemned characteristic, 'deference'.
Choke! Splutter!
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As far as I remember from the Traffic Law course, the only minimum speed limit is in the Dartford Tunnel. However, slow driving would probably earn words of advice (or a blow in the box!).
Mrs O once got pulled over not long after passing her test for driving too slowly through rural Worcs. Nervous and full of squealing 18 year olds rather than anything worse. However, if you're driving too slowly/cautiously, it's worth us having a look to see if there's a reason for it.
O
--
Career: (n) Job, profession.
(v) Downhill, rapidly, out of control.
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One of the characteristics of an extremely drunk run-of-the-mill car driver is likely to be exaggerated slowness and caution. If I were plod and they looked like that I'd pull them and smell their breath.
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Mrs O once got pulled over not long after passing her test for driving too slowly through rural Worcs
That's an interesting point - I remember my driving instructor advising that proceeding quickly and safely up to the speed limit (or the safe equivalent depending on conditions) was always the way to go. He said that if you appear to be holding traffic up on your test you'll pick up a minor point. If you continue to do so the minors will stack up until you've failed even though you haven't actually reached the limit of 15, because enough of them were related to the same offence to give reasonable cause for concern.
How would this be assessed? Surely the simple fact that driving in this way can prevent you from getting a license should also result in people taking a step towards having theirs taken away? Any instructors onboard who can comment on how they deal with this?
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