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the gauge is working but it never gets above the quarter way mark it used to sit bang on the half way mark if i reaaly drive the pink fluffy dice out of it it will rise to the half way mark but as soon as u slow down the engine cools to below quarter i just never seem to have any real heat inside the car
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Maybe the new thermostat is also faulty or you were sold the wrong one.
When the gauge is at a quarter find a place to stop, get out and feel the radiator. The rad should be cold. If not it must be a thermostat problem (assuming the gauge is reading correctly)
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mk 3 temp gauges are controlled by the ECU, so the temp you see is not always the coolant temp. The coolant temp can be observed whilst travelling by using the milometer trip to scroll through the diagnostic data. It's probably the thermostat, but global warming will provide the cure. IIRC, Duratec coolant temp in normal operating conditions can vary between low 70's and high 90's Celcius depending on throttle position
Turn off the aircon to reduce the airflow through the rad whilst warming up.
Did you change the thermostat? Or are you relying someone telling you they changed it? How much did it cost?
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i changed it my self never use the aircon as i spend most of the time trying to heat myself up in the car ive more than 3quarters of the radiator blocked off, How can a car run with out heating up?
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the thermostat matched the original one when i replaced it i was told there may be an electronic cooling device on he car im not the only person suffering from this problem it quite common ford say the engines are hard to heat and do run cold, but when i first bought the car it run at normal running temp then all of a sudden it stopped heating up
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The thermostat for a petrol Duratec includes a waxstat that is heated electrically following instruction from the ECU, not certain about the diseasel. Was there an electrical connector to the thermostat?
Try a search here: www.fordmondeo.org/forum/showforum.php?fid/164/
Has the problem only appeared during the recent colder spell? I could check your original post but that's a lot of effort ;-)
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possibly the colder weather hasnt helped i had that in mind there as no wiring on the thermostat it the same design of thermostat that has been in use this past 20 odd years ill check that link out later to see if there is any info there cheers
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Does it warm up if you run it at a reasonable speed on a run?
I used to have an 02 Mondeo TDCi and unless you opened it up to above 50mph for a couple of miles, it could take as much as 7 miles to even get lukewarm. Running in 3rd gear up to 40mph to keep the revs up helped a lot on very cold days.
My 05 2.2 TDCi is much better and has warm air at the vents within half a mile or so, but I suspect it may have an electric heater in the coolant circuit and it turns on the heated screens to load the engine up a bit when very cold as well.
Modern diesels are very thermally efficient anyway, but I don't think the TDCi's are helped by a 6.5L oil capacity and 8L coolant capacity - thats an awful lot of fluid to warm up!
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">it the same design of thermostat that has been in use this past 20 odd years <"
The thermostat on the petrol Duratec is fitted to the coolant inlet to the engine and has a electrical waxstat because it's too far away from the coolant outlet to detect a sudden increase in hot coolant by the traditional means, so that's why it needs a signal from the ECU..
This is different to Zetec and many other traditional coolant systems, the goal is to ensure that the inlet coolant is at the right temp, something that traditional thermostats in the traditional position can struggle to do. I had assumed that the TDCi thermostat operated on the same principle. Perhaps not.
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">it the same design of thermostat that has been in use this past 20 odd years <" The thermostat on the petrol Duratec is fitted to the coolant inlet to the engine and has a electrical waxstat because it's too far away from the coolant outlet to detect a sudden increase in hot coolant by the traditional means, so that's why it needs a signal from the ECU.. This is different to Zetec and many other traditional coolant systems, the goal is to ensure that the inlet coolant is at the right temp, something that traditional thermostats in the traditional position can struggle to do. I had assumed that the TDCi thermostat operated on the same principle. Perhaps not.
The Diesel thermostat is not ECU controlled, it is just a normal wax stat. There is however another thermostat in the coolant outlet pipe to the oil cooler. I had my 2005 TDCi in to the dealers last month for the overcooling problem, mine took ages to reach normal (halfway on the gauge), but the heater was ok, blowing warm air through within a couple of miles. If I stopped in traffic before the engine got to normal, the temp would drop, but once it got to normal it stays there. The dealer replaced both thermostats under warranty and guess what, no difference. It only occurs when the outside temperature is below about 12 deg C.
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">The Diesel thermostat is not ECU controlled, it is just a normal wax stat. <"
Thanks kith, is it positioned on the coolant inlet to the engine?
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">The Diesel thermostat is not ECU controlled, it is just a normal wax stat. <" Thanks kith, is it positioned on the coolant inlet to the engine?
It's in the black plastic housing on the passenger side of the engine, IIRC I think it's the outlet.
Mine was done under warranty at the dealers with genuine Ford stats and it made no difference.
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when me waterpump died a couple of weeks ago the thermostat was changed. The pattern part gave the same symptoms as you're suffering from. Fitting a real Ford part cured the problem.
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I read often, only post occasionally
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it was a non genuine ford part ill order a thermostat from ford then to see if it helps! im changing for a 2.2 tdci titanium x next month hopefully its the problem is my brother is taking this car so i want to get the heating sorted so i dont have to listen to him
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My 02 TDCi gauge sits at just below half way though a trolling down a long hill on zero throttle and it will drop to 1/4. I get cabin heat is reasonable time, Scandinavian market ones have an electric heater in the coolant circuit, this may be fitted to some later UK spec cars, i.e. perhaps Quinny's as per above.
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did your gauge ever sit at the half way mark all the time no matter how hard or easy you drive the car, mine did up until there was about 60 thousand miles on the clock being honest its like it just happened overnight! i left the car running for two hours today with the fans inside the car off and it still failed to reach 1/4 on the gauge surely any car will heat while idling even with the possibility of a faulty thermostat
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mine has done 112000 miles and temp guage is normally quater to half. recent cold weather in december didn,t
rise above cold,but heater has always been good( for a diesel). I think guages vary from model to model
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I think guages vary from model to model
I don't
On the Tdci they are controlled by the ECU, water temp anywhere between 75 deg C and almost too hot will have the gauge sat sweetly in the middle. If its not in the middle once the engine has warmed up then something is wrong.
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I read often, only post occasionally
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i supect there is something wrong too ive done over 15thousand miles with this problem so it doesnt seem to be doing any harm just would'nt mind getting to the bottom of it im driving around wey cold feet all the time
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water tempanywhere between 75 deg C and almost too hot will have the gauge sat sweetly in the middle. If its not in the middle once the engine has warmed up then something is wrong.
I dont think so, as I say my 02 TDCi gauge sits at just below half way though a trolling down a long hill on zero throttle and it will drop to 1/4 and soon come back up again. It has done this since new, now 115k. Also when warming up it is progressive and does not jump to 'normal' as it would if it worked exactly as you say. After all you are suggesting it waont move over perhaps a 25deg plus range.
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The ECU isn't daft enough to move it too quicly
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I read often, only post occasionally
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if my gauge isnt even reaching 1/4 way what temp should the water be at when the gauge is reading less than 1/4 think ill block the entire radiator off and take it for a run i dont like it when something starts to beat me
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The problem is likely to be due to too high a flow of water through the radiator and/or the heater, made worse by the fact that a diesel (because of it's good fuel efficiency) doesn't put much heat into the coolant in the first place. Stopping the air from going through the radiator might help to alleviate the symptoms but it won't cure the problem. Assuming that the heater valve is OK, then everything points to it being a defective thermostat ~ unless heat is being taken from the coolant elsewhere ~ I'm not familiar with the coolant circuit of a td(eugh!)ci.
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L\'escargot.
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your only temp control normally is the thermostat,and as mentioned blocking the rad off will not help at all if the stat is stuck open which is fairly common even on new stats,ie even new ones can be faulty
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Steve
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what is meant by (asuming the heater valve is ok) and do u not recon the engine should heat even if the thermostat is stuck open and the radiator is blocked? whats going to cool the engine surely if there is nothing getting to cool the water it will eventually heat
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what is meant by (asuming the heater valve is ok)
If its siezed closed you wont get any heat from the heater matrix.
>>and do u not recon the engine should heat even if the thermostat is stuck open and the radiator is blocked?
The engine will not heat up to normal operating temp if the stat is stuck open,though while standing and (depending on cooling capacity)it may slightly heat up.
blocking the rad will make no difference what so ever...
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Steve
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what is meant by "asuming the heater valve is ok" ........
If the heater valve is open more than it should be, on a cold day there just might be enough heat dissipated by the heater to prevent the coolant getting warm. So ......... low coolant temperature, low temperature gauge reading, low heater air output temperature. The heat going into the coolant from a diesel engine is quite low anyway so it might only need a small problem to prevent the coolant temperature ever rising to the thermostat crack-open temperature. I think that somewhere you have too much coolant flow going where it shouldn't. In the main the only things which will dissipate a significant amount of heat are the heater and the radiator, so that's where the problem is most likely to be. The suspect items must therefore be the heater (coolant) valve and the thermostat in the coolant radiator circuit. Unless, as I said previously, there is another coolant circuit of which I'm not aware on the car in question.
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L\'escargot.
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>>blocking the rad will make no difference what so ever...
Until you go up a long steep hill when the engine may quickly overheat.
However by blocking the air flow through the rad you are only stopping forced convection. Heat will still be emitted by radiation and natural convection but at a much reduced rate
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Yes sine,I realised too late what I had written : (
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Steve
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The ECU isn't daft enough to move it too quicly
That perhaps conflicts with your previous point "anywhere between 75 deg C and almost too hot will have the gauge sat sweetly in the middle".
I beleive the the gauge is actually fairly linear in operation.
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