Eh??
(Something went wildly wrong with Andy's posting that seemed to be infected with stuff about central heating and a lot of white space. So I got rid of all that. HJ.)
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Well since that link is in German (I assume) then I can't read it, but the Auto Express this week has the Toyota last behind the Civic, Focus and Golf!
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Article last week said both VW and Toyota now have poor reliability ratings.
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Our Aygo has developed it's first fault. Two weeks in our ownership and only 450 miles covered.
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"....no spare at all, only a tube of get-you-home tyre repair mousse...." - no thanks!
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Golf beater eh!!
From the reviews that are closer to home they seem to put the auris at about average.
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If anyone gets to drive the 2.2 D4D 175 bhp version, I hope they'll let us know what they think. In theory it should go like a bomb.
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From Telegraph road test:
We like: Improved style and new-found handling for Toyota's family hatchback, which don't appear to compromise its existing qualities of quality, reliability and refinement.
We don't like: Toyota has moved on, but so has the opposition and, in comparison, even the new Auris feels and looks a bit, well, dull.
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Further quote from Telegraph road test:-
>>And Toyota times are a-changing in more ways than one. Customers are increasingly aware of the ennui of the Corolla and nor is Toyota's rock-solid reliability quite what it once was. As we explained recently (Motoring, Jan 6) Toyota recalls are getting to be the stuff of legend in the United States.<<
When I looked at the re-call web site for the UK there seemed to be alot of Toyota recalls in this country as well.
They clearly have a good reputation for quality and reliability that did not come about by accident, but I have to say that my experience of them suggests they are no more reliable than most european makes. Whilst the dealers also appear to be more helpful they do take a number of visits to fix things - they just do it more plesently than say VW IMO.
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Hi
Here is an Autocar write up on the Auris T180: www.autocar.co.uk/CarReviews/FirstDrives/Toyota-Au.../
Andy
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Thank you so much for that - either I've missed it in Autocar or it's in the next issue. Written by Steve Cropley as well, whom I have the greatest respect for: he loves cars and can write about ordinary cars as well as about supercars.
When this model appears it'll be interesting to compare it with the Golf TDI 170.
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I thought the Telegraph review viewed the car as pretty average, even mediocre in some regards, but predictably well put together. The 2.2 diesel is overpriced at around £18,000 and, despite the output, is claimed to take a disappointing 8.5 seconds to get to 60 mph. Shame - I had been expecting more.
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Had a quick look at the Autocar review - much more positive. I suppose I'll have to go for one of those 2 day test drives they're offering. Shame about the dismal colour range though.
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Hi
The Autocar review of the 'normal' Auris is here: www.autocar.co.uk/CarReviews/RoadTestsHistory/Toyo.../
It and many others are not as positive as the review I posted above, the T180 has an independent rear suspension set up, (like the Golf & Focus), the other models have a beam axle set up.
Andy
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The Auris to the majority is probably nothing special in any area - its probably just a car thats good at pretty much everything; but it isn't exceptional in any area. Its a sensible car and yes it is a shame they didnt make more effort with the deisgn or outstanding performance. But then again i can understand why, replacing the corolla the best selling car is a tough measure, therefore i think the have achieved a decent result. Driving the Auris they have created something that is easily better than the corolla, a very neutral car and the vast majority of people like neutral and those vast majority dont come here.
Us guys here enjoy cars because we are "geeky" (sorry) enough to post about them therefore we like something special; unique design, overwhelming performance.
I think the Auris will get a tough time with the critics because other manufacturers have moved on, trying to be controversial and winning, like the new civic despite its problems.
All cars in the auris range except one are very neutral and bland is probably a ok word to us - bit strong tho. The T180 does stand out for me, a 177bhp diesel and it goes like stink. Its got enough bits like a nice wheels and better lowered suspension, better trim etc etc to stand out. The engine is v.quiet nothing like a normal diesel and goes like a bomb with good economy, so there is your something special, all the others are horses for courses and yes imho a civic, focus or golf are better choices.
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>>like the new civic despite its problems. <<
What problems are they oldskool ? - I would be interested in hearing about them please.
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I think the key thing when buying a japanese brand is to make sure it is japanese built. They seem to screw things together so much better, a cultural trait methinks.
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I think the key thing when buying a japanese brand is to make sure it is japanese built. They seem to screw things together so much better, a cultural trait methinks.
>>
I would disagree, I believe the important thing is to make sure that the car is DESIGNED in Japan. Where it is then assembled is less critical.
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>>like the new civic despite its problems. << What problems are they oldskool ? - I would be interested in hearing about them please.
I posted earlier but this site went down and lost my post...
Basically the problems I've ready about are mainly interior rattles and noises, problems with rear suspension knocking which i think is fixed in latest cars, a bit of road noise especially at speed and drivers seat and positioning isn't the best in its class for long distance touring and comfort - nothing serious.
Because its a quirky car there are also things that dont appeal to some like, limited rear visibility, digital speedometer that also reflects onto the windscreen at night, can be quite cramped for larger or taller people.
But all in all a very good car, nice design if it ages well, honda did a good job with the cabin and a good lineup of engines with good performance, refinement and economy. Dont think you could go wrong with the new civic, a good all round car with a more thrilling edge than most if it appeals to you.
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I think Toyota missed a trick with the Auris. When the new Civic first appeared it made everything else look old hat. Toyota could have gone for a more adventureous design but played safe instead. Big mistake. It looks old already!
I'll take the Golf!
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Also given that it is estimated that the majority of cars sold in UK this year will have automatic gearboxes and a large percentage of those will have diesel engines, the lack of a diesel automatic in the Toyota (and Honda) ranges is excluding them from up to 25% of the market.
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Big mistake. It looks old already!I'll take the Golf!
They got to consider their target audience who are mature and called Vera and Arthur.It still looks more interesting than a Golf!
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I have to agree with you there - the Golf is a bit dull - but there again I like Bangle's styling.
On the subject of the Civic though - alot of people thought it would look out of date within 12 months - I still think it looks good and makes the Golf and Auris look like they were designed 10 years ago.
There again I suppose you can say the Golf's form was designed 20+ years ago - but it works for some.
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I did read somewhere the Auris was a little late coming to market because Toyota saw the new Civic interior and decided to make some "radical" changes.
I did try sitting in one and couldn't fit, yet my Corola (last of the new shapes) I could fit fine. The seat wouldn't go back far enough.
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I have to agree with you there - the Golf is a bit dull - but there again I like Bangle's styling. On the subject of the Civic though - alot of people thought it would look out of date within 12 months - I still think it looks good and makes the Golf and Auris look like they were designed 10 years ago. There again I suppose you can say the Golf's form was designed 20+ years ago - but it works for some.
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I don't think the Civic looks out-of-date but it certainly looks overly fussy. Initially I was impressed, but within weeks the Dan Dare instrument panel and large transparent plastic panel at the front in particular began to remind me of a Japanese tendency in the '70's towards tastelessness. I'd rather have a design that ages gracefully over five years or so. Cutting edge design blunts too rapidly.
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I also think Toyota have made a wise decision to keep the design muted, but clear and intelligible to the driver! An approach that has served VW well with the Golf. The 180, going on Steve Cropleys screed, sounds quite attractive, with the added bonus of being more reliable than VW, currently.
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I'm going to try a 180 soon - for me an important test will be to see if it avoids the sudden onset of power that the Golf TDI 170 has (and presumably other VAG cars with this engine). Maybe one can get used to it, but I think I'd rather have a seamless progression.
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I'm going to try a 180 soon - for me an important test will be to see if it avoids the sudden onset of power that the Golf TDI 170 has (and presumably other VAG cars with this engine). Maybe one can get used to it, but I think I'd rather have a seamless progression.
Let me know what you think, imo it does drive differently than the VW / Seat high end diesels. I remember reading somewhere else that someone who drove both said the Seat's TDI engine was savage in comparison.
The T180 is a much more linear power delivery and i very much enjoyed it - something to do with being a common rail diesel injection system. However the thing does feel like it wants to just shoot off an go - its like a muscle car until you realise it dies off at 4krm ;-)
Loads different from the 2.0d toyota model, that has lag - the t180 is so eager to pull away and its quiet so it doesn't feel like a diesel.
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Auris seems to resemble a cane toad when viewed from the front. What happened to those good looks that used to grace the corolla of a few years ago?
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Toyota don't give you a 2-day test drive in a 180 but they do in the 2.0 D4D - I also had a test run in a 180 for comparison.
The 2.0 was much more impressive than I was expecting from reading the road tests - very lively and a lot of fun to drive, while quite relaxed on motorways. Not as roomy as the Kia Ceed which I drove a couple of weeks ago, but the handling was sharper - almost in the Focus class I thought, which isn't what the road tests imply.
The 180 (2.2 litre) isn't that much faster unless you're driving at illegal speeds, as the extra oomph come in high in the rev range. But as Oldskool says above, there is less lag, and for some reason the 180 was quieter than the 2.0 (which itself I didn't think was that noisy - but then I drive a B-class).
I think on balance I would go for the 180, but actually we need something a bit bigger as SWMBO has a MINI. The Verso is a good contender: there is a 2.2 140 bhp and a 2.2 180 bhp, the latter costing over £2,000 more as it comes with the video screens in the back of the front headrests which we don't need. But no diesel automnatic which is what we really want.
While I had the Auris I also had a 2-hour unaccompanied run in a Scenic 2.0 DCI 150 bhp. I might have enjoyed this more coming straight from the B-class rather than the Auris. The Scenic is a lot livelier than the Mercedes but I think a Verso is more fun to drive if you need an MPV. Good straight-line performance but like many French cars the suspension is soft and the ride wallowy. And there were a lot of rattles in this 7000-mile car and the interior trim was coming off the offiside A-pillar. Good old Renault.....
So if you need something Golf-sized, try an Auris - the petrol models are probably as pedestrian as the road tests say, but the 2.0 and 2.2 diesels are well worth a look. I got quite fond of that 2.0 Auris even after only 2 days, and I was sad to hand it back.
- Cheaper and more fun than a Golf
- Should hold its value better than a Focus (Fords are fine, but just too many around)
- Ditto Astra - and personally I didn't enjoy the last Astra I drove
- Better built than a Megane or Fiat Bravo or 307
- Bigger than a Fabia, smaller than an Octavia
- No 2.0 Kia Ceed diesel yet.
Next stop on my journey - I want to try a Seat Altea 2.0 TDI and, when they arrive, a Cashcow 2.0 diesel and a VW Golf estate. The Octavia is still the one they have to beat.
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The more reviews i read the more they all see to say the same thing
1) The design is very average
2) The ineterior is nothing special
3) The car lacks sparkle
.... With an average of 3 out of 5 starts
I went car shopping today with an open mind. Honestly, i can't see where they get their 3 out of 5 stars from. Ok, its not radical like the civic but i want to drive a car not a cross breed spaceship/car. I was shocked by the golf, nothing special there at all. Yes its a very good car but nothing special and i wasn't keen on the large amount of black plastic and imitation silver buttons and that was on the GT model. The interior in most VW's just seems the same like they haven't made much effort. I climbed back into my new RAV4 XTR and it felt much nicer. The auris in the flesh looks much nicer than the pictures too. As i say it isn't radical like the civic but the new civic is too much for me. I find the design very sensible and appealing with no bad points like the horrendous black plastic on peugeots or other quirky bits you see. The diesel engines in the auris are good. The T180 easily stands out for me - i could get one very cheap (at cost) and thats great value. The eqivelant golf would have to be a year or 2 old and i easily prefer the t180. I'm going to have to drive it again before i buy it, i hope it is as quick as i remember.
The only thing that will throw a spanner in the works is the A3 that i will be seeing tomorrow.
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