yesterday my classic car failed its Mot, reason due to quite a bit of welding needed.
Does anyone have any idea on the cost of welding by garages.
I dont want to lose my car, and if the price is ok want to keep.
How much in extreme cases could it cost, and have any of you had your cars welded by garages, how much did it cost you.
thanks for any info.
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Where does it need welding?
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Mike Farrow
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brake servo area is excessively corroded, seat belts anchorage too are corroded (both sides), filler had been used previously, and has been there for a few years it seems, not sure how its passed MOT with previous owners before. garage says needs to be dug out and welded.
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Ask the man who failed it;if you take it elsewhere the tester may not accept someone else's work as acceptable.
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cheers I intend to call them when they reopen next week, but until then just want an idea of some of the costs people have paid out for welding, is it going to cost more than buying another car.
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It may help if we knew what car and the extent of the corrosion!
--
pmh (was peter)
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moris minor {Added to subject header - DD}
seat belt anchorage prescibed area
brake servo mounting area
both are excessively corroded
any ideas?
cheers.
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Kazz
Seat belt mounting? Is that on the inner sill?
"Brake servo?" On a morris Minor? Has it been converted to discs? The master cylinder is inside the R/H chassis rail under the driver's feet: bit tight for a direct servo? Where is this servo mounted?
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sorry says brake master cylinder/servo mounting prescribed area.
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Kazz
I really don't want to be the breaker of bad news, but my heart sank when I saw "Morris Minor."
It was exactly the same feeling as twenty-five years ago when cash-strapped pensioners used to sheepishly present their over-polished "pride and joys" for an - often final - MOT. Despite using "tester's discretion" to the point of permit-endangerment and often adopting the "Nelson" approach to corrosion, the - inevitably tearful - fail-sheet discussion was the part of the job I most dreaded.
The sad fact is that Minors are one of the worst cars ever built for structural corrosion. [Cue howls of "blasphemy" from non-technical owners and sanguine nods for those who know.] Owners have quickly forgotten the rampant rust problems of that "golden" motoring era and are now often far too complacent in inspecting prospective purchases. The presence of filler is never acceptable in prescribed areas. No "blind-eye" tolerance allowed by VOSA these days!
The only good part is that all the replacement panels [and there are five each side in that sill] are available for pennies from specialist suppliers. Seek out an old and grizzled Minor specialist [the owners club is your best bet - then ring around] and listen carefully to his advice. Rust is always a can of worms - Pandora got off easily...
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dunno he said sills seem to be ok, but filler has been used where welding should have been put.
I am going to ask them about extent of welding needed and cost, and ask them to fix,just concerned that it will cost more then i can afford.
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Kazz Seat belt mounting? Is that on the inner sill?
IIRC
"Brake servo?" On a morris Minor? Has it been converted to discs? The master cylinder is inside the R/H chassis rail under the driver's feet: bit tight for a direct servo? Where is this servo mounted?
Ditto. Doesn't sound *too* bad if the sills and suspension mounting points are all OK. corrosion *around* the brake master cylinder is either floor or the box section under the floor. There are mounting bolts through the cylinder there, so any repair would need those removing and holes re-drilled (or o/s holes pre-drilled through the plates over) if the cylinder needed removing later. The last Moggie I owned needed angles all along the inner floor both sides. The driver's seat was resting on a hammock of steel sheet floor (apart from the box section housing the master cylinder).
It may be worth removing any floor carpets yourself, Some welders are cavalier about that, and prefer to just dowse any smouldering fabrics.
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It may be worth removing any floor carpets yourself, Some welders are cavalier about that, and prefer to just dowse any smouldering fabrics.
When I do welding I charge for time taken to remove carpet,trim etc..It may mean removing and replacing seats but you will also get a better assesment as your welder can have a good poke with a big screwdriver.
I would say stupid rether than cavalier as the old fashioned sound deadening can smoulder away under the carpet for hours,dowsing would only find any underground water nearby,I suspect icarusi meant 'dousing' ;)
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on an old car its nigh on impossible to quote for welding as you just dont know where the good metal is,you could chip away and find anything from a 3x2 lump of wood to plaster of paris, i would suggest a figure between £400/£1000.
Most garages dont do welding anymore too many HS regulations you usually therefore have to take it to bob down a side street and hope hes good.
The other alternatives are professional classic restorers (not cheap but the best never is or was) or do it yourself and turn it into a project (allow 10 years for completion mind)
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I tend to agree with Screwloose and oldman - there is *always* more rust than you think, and, repairing rust on an old Minor can very quickly become a restoration project as you keep trying to find good metal to weld to.
I've seen some very sorry Minors, with Isopon where there should have been thick guage metal. I echo the suggestion to find a good repairer via the MMOC.
Number_Cruncher
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thanks to all of you all for your help, Ive decided I cant let my little car pass on to the other side just yet, so I will be looking into a specialist garage and see what they can do for him,
thanks.
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Get a copy of Practical Classics magazine & go to the small ads near the back to a) get details of Morris Minor specialists b) get details of restoration &/or welding people in your area c) the approx value of your car in their car by car guide so you can gauge if the repairs are worth it.
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It's a question of getting quotes
Don't forget that much of the cost of a professional weld repair is the cost of preparation and refitment of master cylinders, fabricatio of panels etc. Welding may be minor part of job
Also the Minor is relatively easy to get at, and the repair panels ready available from specialists
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Hey Kazz,
I have similar problems with my car, although mines a Hillman minx.
Im planning to put mine in with a classic car repairer/restorer, let them estimate and then take it from there.
I have no intentions of getting rid but i do intend to shop around and find an affordable price. Good luck.
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How long have you owned it?
If someone has bodged and/or tried to hide rot at seatbelt mountings, then who knows what else is lurking undiscovered.
Nightmare comuld be coming up.
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tehMOT center that failed it may well know of the best Bob down a sidestreet for the welding work.
I wouldn't use a specialist classic car restorer, it will be cheaper to get a new car than use one of these for this sort of work.
--
I read often, only post occasionally
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It's years since I had any done, but whenever I did it was cheaper than expected. You need to make sure it is an MOT welder too, as the welds need to be to a certain specification.
There was this one time where a garage recommended a mobile welder, it was an old man in an old van, he was excellent and very cheap, it's all he ever did, he made it look easy, these types of people are still about, popular with farmers who always make do and mend.
If you own an old car and don't mind doing it, may be worth investing in an College OCN in Welding evening course so that you can do future problems yourself.
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i brought it in february from a garage who were selling it for someone,obviously the filler wasnt meentioned and I should of had the vehicle checked out thoroughly before buying, car is in excellent condition otherwise. no markings on seats, lovely exterior bodywork. had paperwork for vehicle only had 3-4 owners, also have previous MOT's they used same company for 3 years MOTS, maybe a backhander was going on, who knows. Its a beautiful car otherwise, so my little moggie really does deserve to live....Just cant afford tons of cash to save him, but intend to try.
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Kazz
It's money back time. "Not of merchantable quality" - and in spades!
There's now a legal presumption that any fault with a second-hand car that becomes apparent within six months of sale was present at the time of sale. Ring the garage, tell them what's happened and tell them that you'll be returning the car [or they can collect it] for a FULL cash refund. Don't get involved in any haggling; that's your right.
Your "Sale of Goods Act" case is iron-clad. A garage selling a car with a clearly bent MOT could also be considered criminally liable for "unroadworthy condition." See the CAB; the police; VOSA; or even Trading Standards.
Doubtless many "learned friends" on here can give you chapter and verse on your rights in law, but that's how I see it.
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Screwloose thanks for the advice,
I have justed emailed my local trading standards explaining my case, and once they comfirm what you say i will move things on. I want to have backup when i approach the garage incase they try and fob me off.
Thankyou for informing me on the sales of good act, with my car only 2 1/2 months old I hope I can render something from this situation.
It would be a shame if i do lose my car, but then again, I cant afford to pay out all the money it will cost me in repairs. With the money i spent on my car, it should have been in near perfect condition.
anyways will keep you informed, cheers for everyones help today.
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Have just done this with a Renault camper,apart from the battery and clutch failing in the first week,when VOSA checked it they said it should never have got the MOT issued a couple of weeks earlier,the steering and other faults made it dangerous and unroadworthy.Private seller(Ebay)came fom Swindon to Leeds,refunded and drove(!)it away.Anyone seen the remains of a Renault Trafic on the M6?
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