Hi,
I am after insiders knowledge on the new Nissan Note. Is it worth the money? Whats build quality like? Any problems expected with this new range?
Thanks In advance
Baz
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One of my patients is an engineer at the Nissan plant and he speaks highly of the Note. I meet quite a few workers from the plant and from their local suppliers and find them to be intelligent and sensible people all of whom I would trust to build me a car.
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I've been round the Nissan plant and was hugely impressed (just as with the Toytal and Honda plants) at the high level of skills and ability of the employees.
You may recall, in fact, that the Primeras built at Sunderland were stated by the big bosses in Japan to at least be the equivalent, and often superior, to those made in Japan itself.
Sunderland was building Primeras for Europe and not just the UK.
One of the interesting points that I learned whilst at Sunderland was that employees didn't necessarily have to have an engineering background or even previous experience of working in factories.
Their attitude and willingness to learn was rated as more important overall when they were first interviewed for a position.
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What\'s for you won\'t pass you by
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The quality of these cars is mainly dependent upon the quality of the original design work - Japan mainly, and the quality of the local design work, and parts localisation - Cranfield.
That the plant doesn't need many engineers is fairly obvious, you wouldn't waste a good engineer on menial production line work - setting up a production line, yes - troubleshooting when something goes wrong on the line, yes, but not screwing together cars.
IMO, the people who are best placed to judge these cars are the mechanics and warranty administrators in the dealers. The factory only ever see new cars, they don't deal with faults and problems.
NETC in Cranfield do see the warranty statistics, and are aware of the "concerns", but you will struggle getting any inside information from there!
Number_Cruncher
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The quality of these cars is mainly dependent upon the quality of the original design work - Japan mainly, and the quality of the local design work, and parts localisation - Cranfield. That the plant doesn't need many engineers is fairly obvious, you wouldn't waste a good engineer on menial production line work - setting up a production line, yes - troubleshooting when something goes wrong on the line, yes, but not screwing together cars. IMO, the people who are best placed to judge these cars are the mechanics and warranty administrators in the dealers. The factory only ever see new cars, they don't deal with faults and problems. NETC in Cranfield do see the warranty statistics, and are aware of the "concerns", but you will struggle getting any inside information from there! Number_Cruncher
How can you say that a man that is putting a car together has no idea whether its going to be right or not?hes the front line man he will be the first to spot errors and i am led to believe the systems in place at sunderland will reward any such help.
I was up sunderland last week and you couldnt wish to meet more helpful caring workers.
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\"a little man in a big world/\"
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How can you say that a man that is putting a car together has no idea whether its going to be right or not?
I didn't say that. I was making the point that by the time the cars are being screwed together, the quality, or lack of it is already inherent in the design. The best that the production process can do is not to introduce any further errors or weaknesses, and I think that Sunderland does this well.
I agree that the workforce in Sunderland are both well motivated and efficient, and do feedback their problems, and opportunities to reduce either cost or weight to Cranfield, but, they aren't in control of the engineering design of the car.
Number_Cruncher
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But they do have input into the next car.
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TourVanMan TM < Ex RF >
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>>But they do have input into the next car.
Not much - the designs originate in Japan, and are localised by Cranfield. Sunderland, like all Nissan plants has to bid for the work of building the next design - which it has done sucessfully because it has a very good quality and efficiency record.
There's a bus that ferries engineers up and down between Sunderland and Cranfield, so there's plenty of interaction between the two, but, the design engineering is not driven by Sunderland.
Number_Cruncher
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I thought the Note was based on the Modus?
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working on a production line,bears no relationship to "working" on cars as a mechanic/automotive engineer.One is just screwing them together,sometimes with very little thought,while the other often involves a lot of thought and a great deal of effort.I know-been there done that got the t-shirt.
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Just a small addendum to turbo11's post, which I am broadly in agreement with.
>>mechanic/automotive engineer
I would like to make the difference between these two job titles clear.
A mechanic is skilled in diagnosis, removal/replacement, and the refurbishment of components - you might ask him to overhaul an engine, you wouldn't ask him to design a crankshaft.
An automotive engineer, depending upon his specialism probably could design you a crankshaft along with the stress and vibration analysis to support the design - whether you would trust him to actually fit it into an engine is another matter!
There are some who can do both roles, but not that many IME.
Although the engineer's job title isn't licensed in the UK, I think it is right to defend the difference. We already have the slip in usage where the technician/mechanic who repairs washing machines or photo-copiers is erroneously called an engineer. (It makes my blood boil!)
Of course, the companies providing this type service like the sloppy use of titles. Calling mechanics "technicians" probably allows the dealers to charge a bit more for their services - this also makes the mechanics feel good, being called a technician is much grander!
Please don't interpret this post as an attack on mechanics - I was one myself! - just making the point that they aren't engineers or vica versa.
Number_Cruncher
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I agree with you.I have met many automotive engineers who wouldn't know what to do with a spanner,and I certainly wouldn't let them lose with one.I must therefore be a rare breed-qualified engineer but get my hands dirty daily.
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Just a small addendum to turbo11's post, which I am broadly in agreement with. >>mechanic/automotive engineer I would like to make the difference between these two job titles clear.
At my final employers, everyone (except for the "Process Owners") were "Associates".
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L\'escargot.
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That is correct, Note is based on Modus.
I have a friend who works on production line at Sunderland. He says the Note is 'a canny little car but just a Modus in new clothes'.
He also builds Primera and Almera, of which the lion's share go to Russia.
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He's definitely from Sunderland then hinny. Don't mention the first division.
JH
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One of the interesting points that I learned whilst at Sunderland was that employees didn't necessarily have to have an engineering background or even previous experience of working in factories.
Engineering manufacture and assembly is now so mechanised that in a lot of cases it's no longer necessary for the operative to have had previous experience. At my final employer the previous job of one of the assembly girls was assembling sandwiches in the canteen.
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L\'escargot.
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Nearly as important as the tea infusion engineer/ess.
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All this talk of Sunderland, Cranfield and Japan, reckon Paris might be of primary importance re the design of the Note.
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All this talk of Sunderland, Cranfield and Japan
According to information easily found on internet, Nissan design has not been exclusively Japanese for some years- the 2002 Primera apparently was designed in Munich, and the 2004 update in Cranfield. Surely with the Renault interest Nissan design will become even more Europe-centric.
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