This quote was in another thread today:
"My wife's car was hit by builders truck - wife in correct lane, builder in wrong lane, but in statement to his insurers he says he's in correct lane ,wife in wrong lane. Insurer never checked lane markings and even suggested we accept 50/50 blame."
I have seen several other posts in a similar vein.
It implies that if someone is in the wrong lane they are at fault if someone drives into them. I cannot see that is correct.
I see plenty of drivers who approach a roundabout in the LH lane and then proceed to drive a full 270 degrees around the roundabout to take the third exit. Clearly they approach the roundabout in the wrong lane and for at least half the circumference they remain in the wrong lane. However regardless of fact that they are, nervous, unfamiliar with which exit they want or just plain idiots, I would still consider myself at fault if I changed lanes and drove into them.
I remember a Police Inspector in a court case where I was a witness telling the accused that he should have ascertained the other driver's intentions and not made an assumption on his intentions. It seems to me that applies here.
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"I remember a Police Inspector in a court case where I was a witness telling the accused that he should have ascertained the other driver's intentions and not made an assumption on his intentions. It seems to me that applies here. "
Cardew that must have been before several wars. Agree with the sentiment though.
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>>I see plenty of drivers who approach a roundabout in the LH lane and then proceed to drive a full 270 degrees around the roundabout to take the third exit. Clearly they approach the roundabout in the wrong lane
Happens all the time where I live,Nothing you can do so suspect this practice will become worse.
also lane marking is problem ie 2 lanes may go into one,or one lane splits half way round and if you happen to be in wrong lane its a strugle getting into correct lane..no wonder accidents occur on roundabouts
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Steve
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I was in a similar situation with a taxi driver in the right-hand lane, turning left at the roundabout. I was in the left lane going straight so he was in the wrong lane when he came into my side.
He refused to accept he was in the wrong and I didn't have any witnesses so I insisted on calling the police. (A decision made all the easier when the guy threatened to have his boss come down and beat me up.)
The police eventually turned up and it was all sorted out but had they not done it would have been his word against mine. The Police said it was an easy one seeing as the taxi was in the wrong lane. The guy did argue that "everyone turned left from the right hand lane" but it didn't wash. Him poking the copper in the chest didn't help his case though.
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The terms "right" and "wrong" shouldn't be applied to traffic lanes. The terms should be "recommended" and "not recommended". Regardless of which lane you or they are in both drivers always have a duty to ensure that they don't collide by changing lanes carelessly.
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L\'escargot.
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Well the multimillion costing roundabout at Thickthorn (South of Norwich)is now up and running. A huge part of the cost of this has no doubt been spent on consultants. I hope they didn't pay to much to the genius who laid out the lane markings.
As you approach the roundabout heading to Norwich (on the A11) there are 4 lanes. The middle two lanes are marked for Norwich (straight ahead) the right hand land is marked for Great Yarmouth.
However, if you take the right hand lane of the two middle lanes (if you see what I mean) you go a quarter of the way round the roundabout, and the lane is now marked as Great Yarmouth.
If you don't want to have to change lanes, there is in fact only one lane that you can take to go straight on to Norwich.
Since this roundabout has opened, I have witnessed a near collision most times I have used it, due entirely to these lane markings.
Traffic flow is not improved, and the shole thing seems a complete waste of cash. Still, it kept plenty of people employed, and gave the local council something to do..
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Well the multimillion costing roundabout at Thickthorn (South of Norwich)is now up and running. A huge part of the cost of this has no doubt been spent on consultants. I hope they didn't pay to much to the genius who laid out the lane markings.
The lane markings at the Thickthorn roundabout follow the same pattern as the roundabout where the A414 from Hatfield crosses the A1081 St Albans road. It's the same story heading west, where one of the two lanes for the A414 turns into a lane for the St Albans road.
Confusion always reigns; either boldness wins but the softer technique of looking lost can also achieve success. Careful research has shown that much roundabout lane design is done by the Sole family, all of whom have the intial "R".
eProf
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The terms "right" and "wrong" shouldn't be applied to traffic lanes. The terms should be "recommended" and "not recommended". Regardless of which lane you or they are in both drivers always have a duty to ensure that they don't collide by changing lanes carelessly. -- L\'escargot.
Agree absolutely! 'Changing lanes' is the crucial point.
So IMO anyone in the wrong(or 'not recommended') lane is not at fault if he remains in that lane and someone changes lane and hits him.
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It implies that if someone is in the wrong lane they are at fault if someone drives into them. I cannot see that is correct. I posted the above................
the full story
3 lanes on motorway exit slip road approaching roundabout:
inside (left) lane is signed for turning left OR straight ahead
middle lane lane is signed for straight ahead (only)
right lane is signed for turning right
Wife in left lane and proceeds (when traffic lights turn green) straight ahead.
Builders truck (in middle lane) turns left and removes the front of wife's car!
Builder ascertains (wrongly) that left lane is for turning left only , and middle lane is also for turning left and refuses to accept otherwise despite the lane and overhead gantry signs to the contrary.
My OP was referring to the fact that in his(builders) statement he agreed he was in middle lane & turned left but maintained that the signs were indicating this was ok.
A phone call to the highways Agency by my Insurer would have sorted this out but their refusal to do any checking up led me to take Builder to Small Claims Court. A lot of time & money wasted - and zero service provided by a well known Telephone direct insurance company
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Its not just roundabouts.
Locally there are several set of traffic lights where the left lane is left turn only, but many people ignore this and go straight on, hooting and gesturing at those going ahead from the 'recommended' middle lane.
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I find roundabouts with traffic lights, particularly those of an inadequately small circumference, particularly troublesome when it comes to ensuring you are in the correct lane.
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In my city (Christchurch, New Zealand) there are many intersections where only one lane of the two is actually marked. The right lane will be marked straight ahead and right. The left lane isn't marked at all. The roads away from the intersections are only single lane roads, so the intersection lanes are just there to assist people to turn left with less time delay. Just last week I correctly went straight ahead from the right lane and was given some grief from an SUV that thought it could just muscle past in what is only a single lane road. I was in the Jag, so that didn't happen. Perhaps I should agitate to have the roads correctly marked, but I feel it would be a waste of time.
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I was always taught Left hand lane for turning left or straight on Right hand lane for turning right unless roadmarking state otherwise.
If the builder was turning left he should have been in the left lane.
Next people who are driving down the motorway will drive from the inside lane onto the slip road cutting up two lanes of fast flowing traffic. It's not rocket science although some make it that way.
I have had near misses on roundabouts before but those are down to motorists straightlining infront of me.
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>>However, if you take the right hand lane of the two middle lanes (if you see what I mean) you go a quarter of the way round the roundabout, and the lane is now marked as Great Yarmouth.>>
That is the whole point re roundabouts, lanes have to change as they move around the roundabout, to use the example above cars coming from Gt Yarmouth will be in the outside lane if they want to head for Norwich but by the time they come off the roundabout after tavelling 3/4 of the way around it they will have moved to the inside lane.
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Endorsing Lawman's comments on the Thickthorn roundabout, last Thursday, I saw a 4x4 - driving perfectly correctly - being cut up twice by different vehicles on two sections of the new roundabout.
Not often I feel sorry for a 4x4 driver ........
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IanS
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My object in raising this subject was not really for a discussion on which is the correct or 'recommended' lane to approach a roundabout or any junction.
We have all found ourselves in the wrong(or 'not recommended') lane at some time. The classic situation is arriving at an unfamiliar roundabout in the left hand lane and find we need to drive past a couple of exits when the majority of traffic take the first exit.
It is the assumption that I am legally responsible for an accident if someone changes lanes and hits me that I am challenging.
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The best way on an unfamilliar roundabout is approach slower, giving more time for lane changes if needed, If you miss your exit continue all the way round indicating right and hope you don't get an idiot who thinks you have failed to cancel your signal, then indicate left and move across (check mirrors before hand) at the junction before the one you want.
I saw a similar incident on Police Camera Action a couple of nights ago the driver in the right hand lane wanted to leave the roundabout the car in the left was going straight on, both went left and came off.
I do agree some roundabouts have really bad lane markings where lanes change name half way round with no warning the worst roundabouts for this problem are those on motorway slip roads, the reason is that you have travelled some miles in auto pilot - motorways are safer because there are no complicated manouvers to make and very few sharp bends.
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The law regards a roundabout as havinf anualar continuoes markings around an island wether they are autaully there or not. If the other vechicle changed lanes i.e. crossed a line weather real or not then he is responsible. Regards Peter
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The "give way to traffic on the right" rule appears to give priority to people who select a "fast" lane close to the centre and then cut across to take their exit. I know it doesn't mean that, but you have to be brave or stupid to challenge people who think it does, and also risk being hit from behind if you slow to let them cross lanes.
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The law regards a roundabout as havinf anualar continuoes markings around an island wether they are autaully there or not. If the other vechicle changed lanes i.e. crossed a line weather real or not then he is responsible. Regards Peter
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Do what?
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