My 1992 Escort diesel van recently incurred a problem with the nearside driveshaft coming out of its coupling, the three pronged part where it joins the shaft that fits into the gearbox.
My friend fitted another one, but the same thing happened after I drove in circa half a mile. He says that there is relatively little play in the lower ball joint on the wishbone and the van doesn't appear to be toeing in or out.
Can anyone suggest anything else that may be causing the problem, ie, could it be the gearbox, etc? thanks.
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It is possible for the splined drive shaft to come out of the diff / gearbox if the snap ring is weak or doesn't engage properly. Never heard of a joint actually coming apart though. With a new snap ring and a good groove you should hear and feel a loud click as the ring locates. The built in movement within the joint allows for suspension travel and varying drive shaft length.
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Another possibility is worn diff bearings. does the speedo work ?
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Not by any chance had new/recon CV joints fitted?,apart from a possible suspension bush failure.cannot see how the shaft would come away,snap clips wont prevent a shaft coming adrift if a suspension problem ie normally when bottom ball joint fails..sure it has correct drive shaft fitted?
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Steve
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Firstly the speedo works. The problem first arose last May, the splined shaft part with the circlip remained in the gearbox and the three pronged bit that goes into the wheel parted company with the aforementioned.
My friend replaced it with a reconditioned one and it was okay for a couple of thousand miles, then two wks. ago the same thing happened. He got another driveshaft, fitted it and again it came disconncted within half a mile. He has now got it jacked up on ramps and feels there is little point in continuing until he dtermines what is causing the problem. As previously stated, the wheels don't appear to be out of alignment and the bottom ball joint has litlle wear, certainly not enough to cause the problem.
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The van is a 1992 non turbo 1800 cc. I feel he would have to have been extremely unlucky to have twice been given the wrong driveshafts, not to mention the one that was already on the van when it was purchased just over a yr. ago. My friend is fairly certain this was the original.
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only thing i can think of if the suspension is right is that a wrong gearbox is fitted (dont know as i have fitted petrol gearboxes to diesels before now) or the engine/gearbox is too far to the offside somehow?
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that crossed my mind as well oldman.
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Steve
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Maybe one of the gearbox or engine mounts is shot, allowing the unit to move too much ?
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Basically Ford only make 2 FWD manual g/boxes;the B5/iB5 and the MTX75 which is the heavier duty box tho' there are different internal ratios and final drives available in each.The quickest way to tell them apart is that the B5 has no reverse lock on the g/lever whilst the MTX has.There are now,of course,six-speed boxes but these are totally different.
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Apparently, my friend is of the opinion that the gearbox is also original. He says he will check the engine and gearbox mountings tomorrow morn.
In the meantime, thanks for all the advice and I'll hopefully report back tomorrow on the outcome of the aforementioned inspection:)
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Might be an idea to compare the Track control arm length with the other side. I vaguely remember Ford fitting different length arms on one model, and it was possible to fit the wrong one. Be a good idea to check the inner bushes as well.
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are you sure you are not getting confused with the fiesta combo van none?these used xr2 lower arms i beleive with the bigger balljoints,i wasn"t aware of escort vans being different? but am happy to learn that i am wrong for "future reference"
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Oldman, my recollection is a bit hazy, I can just remember trying to fit an incorrectly supplied TCA.
Another thing that has occured to me is that - as far as I know - Escorts have ball and cage CV joints at each end of the shaft, not the (forget the name) type described.
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>>the three pronged part where it joins the shaft that fits into the gearbox.
what type of cvj is it,as none mentioned its not AFAIK three pronged they are ball and cage type..very old type was a rubber joint
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Steve
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Can I post pics. on this site?, if so, I'll take one of the driveshaft. Where it joins onto the bit with a splined shaft that fits into the gearbox, it has three prongs that have bushes on them that slot into the aforementioned part which has a rubber expanding covering secured by a jubilee clip.
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Are you sure it's Ford escort ?
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Sounds like the old rubber doughnut type?,the jubilee clip should have been removed as while its still in place the joint cannot flex
(its only on there to keep rubber compressed while fitting)
otherwise its near on impossible to line the bolt holes up..
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Steve
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Can I post pics. on this site?,
Unfortunately not. However, either register for an account on the unofficial HJ MSN website ( groups.msn.com/honestjohn ) and then uload your pic there, and then post the url link for it here.
Failing that, another free site you could use is www.imageshack.us/ . Click on browse, pick a picture from your PC, click upload, once uploaded, post the url link for it here.
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Just out of curiosity has the offside suspension/track control arm/driveshaft been checked?.I had an escort van years ago and one of the o/s inner driveshaft bearing cups collapsed which made the engine and gearbox pull to the offside,a longshot but maybe worthwhile inspecting the other driveshaft.
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steve o, I can't remember rotoflex joints ever being fitted to the Ford FWD range. Certainly not in 1992.
Methinks that the original post is a spoof ...............
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>>steve o, I can't remember rotoflex joints ever being fitted to the Ford FWD range.
Agree,never seen this fitted to ford FWD,
>>Methinks that the original post is a spoof ...............
also agree,though bit that surprised me- that years ago it was common knowledge,which I had to think about.the jubilee clip,it was not left on the joint for reasons explained in last post,may be a good idea for mods to delete this thread as it will be no actual use to anyone.Hope you agree none
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Steve
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i agree,just annoying that you try and rack your brain and you are being used as a fool.
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Nobody is trying to fool you, the description is a little confusing unless you have seen an inner driveshaft joint in the flesh! Getting back onto track, it appears that the designed amount of movement in-and-out of the shaft is being exceeded. The inner end of the shaft is retained by a snap ring, the outer end by a circlip. From memory there is about 6-8 mm of movement to allow for suspension movement. I'd recommend taking a good look at the lower suspension arm bushes and the lower swivel and the engine mounts. You may have sufficient accumulation of wear to allow for excess outward movement to cause the problem.
Just one more thing, whose make of reconditioned shaft are you using?
Andrew
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Simplicate and add lightness!!
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the description is a little confusing unless you have seen an inner driveshaft joint in the flesh!
description is confusing,in that three pronged drive shaft is an old drive shaft not as I recall being fitted to escorts(straight splined shaft into CVJ) I recall though memory not what it was,triumphs/and others had described joint ie three bolts holding shaft to a rubber ring as my earlier post mentioned...But it would be good to see a photo as offered by thread maker.As yet no further reply as to how he/she got on
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Steve
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Seconded steve.o a morris 1100 comes to mind for me
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Andrew Moorey, It isn't confusing. The sort of CV joint described by Indigo has never been fitted to a Ford. It's more of a Renault or Peugeot joint.
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I beg to differ none.
The inner joint is a three roller type.On the end of the shaft it has three arms, each has a roller bearing with a radiused outer race which runs in a correspondingly shaped slot on the part of the joint that goes into the gearbox.The whole shebang is retained by the rubber boot which is secured with steel bands (which I have seen replaced by jubilee clips if a band has failed). Ford shafts do not have ball-and-cage joints on the inner end as the limited amount of movement doesnt warrant it.
Respectfully
Andrew
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Simplicate and add lightness!!
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I can assure tou all, this isn't a wind up and I appreciate my descriptions of mechanical parts may occasionally be difficult to understand. I am merely passing on information my boyfriend has given me, as previously state, he's competent, but he isn't a mechanic and consequently doesn't always use the correct terminology when describing parts.
I haven't got back to this thread , because my friend hasn't been out to further inspect my van, its too cold at the moment, however I have been thinking about the problem and remembered on each occasion how it happened which may shed some light on the matter. It has occured on three occasions and each time I have been pulling away and only in either first or second gear. Also when he test drove the van after the latest replacement, the driveshaft became uncoupled after turning left at a road junction, so again the van would only have been in low gear and pulling away.
In retrospect, although I have never noticed any pulling on the steering, shaking on the steering wheel, there have been times when I've noticed a jolt or judder when engaging in a low gear, and there is a slight pause between the engagement and movement which isn't normally present. All advice is gratefully appreciated, thanks.
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Also, the clip retaining the rubber housing on the driveshaft isn't a normal jubilee clip , its similiar, but doesn't lock with a screwing device.
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Ford have never used worm-drive clips on d/shafts.It's a metal strap that is tensionewd with a special pair of pincers.
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Ford have never used worm-drive clips on d/shafts.It's a metal strap that is tensionewd with a special pair of pincers.
{DIY attempt at quoting previous posters reply corrected. For furture reference using the less than symbol ( < ) at the start, and the greater than symbol ( > ) at the end of the text makes the wording invisible, so it's unwise to use that method. DD}
I can't ever remember using the term 'worm-drive clips', but thanks for imparting the info. that the correct terminology is 'a tensionewd metal strap', perhaps my friend will find this important observation helpful in determining the cause of the problem.
In the meanwhile, as previously stated, any non pedantic advice would be appreciated:)
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if the suspension bushes are ok, then engine mounts would be the things to check next...
lift bonnet put in gear with engine on tickover HANDBRAKE firmly on-release clutch to biting point and any excessive play on mountings should show up as extreme rocking of engine
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Steve
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Thanks, Steve, he's promised to have a look this evening. He hasn't as yet refitted the driveshaft, can he test the engine mounts without doing so? ie, would there be any visible deterioration noticable with a lead light?
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for that test to work driveshaft will need replacing,otherwise the CV joint will spin on its own.
to test as it is, will need a bar in between the mounts to see any severe cracks/broken rubber ie rubber may have split at bonded connection with metal/aluminium plates..
Be carefull on aluminium joints as they can break
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Steve
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Andrew, Agreed. But the original post mentioned a three pronged joint coming apart at the wheel end of the shaft. I'd visualised a Renault type of (Hookes ?) joint.
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By the way, If this problem turns out to be suspension or engine mounting related I'd be amazed - No other symptons ?
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Over the Christmas period I asked for some advice on a driveshaft problem I was incurring on my Escort diesel van. My friend has now resolved the problem, apparently at some time an deleted - {see rule about swearing, DD} had removed the engine/gearbox and hadn't even bothered to line up the mountings, preferring to leave the rear mounting totally disconnected.
Little wonder the driveshaft was coming uncoupled, I suppose it was a miracle nothing else vibrated out of place, the engine for instance. Anyway, thanks for all the advice that was offered, particularly the guy who suggest reving the car in gear with the handbrake on.
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wasnt me but sounds fun.Glad its sorted
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No wonder driveshaft was removing itself,not often this happens.though nice to hear its sorted,Happy motoring:)
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Steve
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