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Now we hear of a bus exploding at Russell Square and the upper deck being ripped off.
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FGW stating that they are terminating Paddington bound trains at Reading accorind to that last link. A pity that they were not telling people on the trains...just got off a 10am arrival at Oxford heading towards paddington, lots of mobile phone conversations about explosions, but no announcements regarding not making it to London.
Stargazer
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They've only reported injured casualties as far as I've heard on the News. I'd imagine it could get worse with buses being ripped apart etc. but hopefully it will only be injuries. Scary stuff. Edgware Road is just up the road from me.
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Horrible over reaction from the tv channels at the moment. Staying live with it and continually recycling what little known information they've got in the abscence of anything new. Just the sort of thing any terrorists involved would want, it would be much better if they reported what they know and came back when any new facts emerged.
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They've confirmed one person died and from reports on the Beeb, looks as though there will be more.
National Power as saying that they saw no 'power surge' as is being touted as the cause of the explosions on the underground. One of my colleagues just saw a fleet of ambulances racing down the M4 into London. Can't imagine this is a mere accident tho.
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"National Power"
Excuse me, but that would be National Grid.
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There are no mobile telephones working in London (NB for anybody trying to contact beloved ones), and a fleet of fire engines has just gone over tower bridge.
sirens wail in the background, constantly.
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Just spoke to my sister-in-law in Canary Wharf - no issues other than the chaos. I don't mean no issues, but you know what I mean.
Spoke to a colleague next to Liverpool Street. Banks and other offices evacuated, but nothing other than the explosions reported.
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There are no mobile telephones working in London ...
Vodafone have confirmed that their network is overloaded and they've had to take action to prioritise access for the emergency services.
I've been watching the saturation TV coverage. Most of the initial reports were from bystanders on their mobile phones.
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You knew what I meant, do be so pedantic.
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Doh. Don't be so pedantic!
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The news says the mobile network has been shut down for fear of remote detonation. Whether that's true or just sensationalism I don't know but it makes sense.
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Adam
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Not pedantic.
Probably more accurate and non sensationalist.
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This was a comment by P3501 yesterday in the thread on the Oympics
-Great news, but i hope a poorly timed terrorist strike (inevitable sooner or later) doesn't spoil things.
Not being a pessimist, just cautious and realistic.-
It is just so sad that he has apparently been proved right after such a happy day yesterday for London.
When will people realise that the bomb and the bullet do not change anything ?
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>>When will people realise that the bomb and the bullet do not change anything ?
I am afraid that they do. They may not achieve anything, but they do change things. My wife and children are in London today. When do you think I will allow that to happen again ?
I don't think they (whoever "they" are) will achieve their aims, but they will change our lives.
What I think people don't realise is that bombs and bullets beget bombs and bullets in the same way that abused children become abusive parents.
The issue is not the misguided fools who plant bombs, disgusting and to be reviled though they are, but the society that teaches them that this is an acceptable way to behave.
Do you know why Osama Bin Laden became a terrorist ? How many more did we create in Iraq in the same way that he was created in Afghanistan ?
We're all clear why parents should not be violent towards children, mostly because of the incidence of those children becoming violent. Why do we see state led violence as likely to have a different result ? Even when that violence seems reasonable and justifiable.
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All very interesting, but what has any of this got to do with the Back Room?
Come on Mark. This is not a 9/11 discussion group forum.
Having said that, I sicerely hope your family are safe and sound.
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The original point was not to drive or be transported into London.
Transport - cars - motoring - BackRoom?
--
Adam
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Absolutley agree. Having just spent a frantic 2 hours trying to get in touch with the Ozzie BIL and family who are trying to get to Stansted today, have recommended a taxi. Fortunately they are coming down from Leamington, so the A14 will be the only thing thea have to contend with....
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What time ? I will have to drive from Leamington towards London to pick up my family. If they don't want to go too early I could perhaps help.
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Mark, that is beyond kind, but I think they already have the taxi sorted.
I will post again if they don´t have any luck getting a taxi.
Thanks again mate.
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Taxi is booked, they will be on their way. I am officially touched by the kindness of strangers....cheers Mark, you´re a good guy.
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hope your family are safe and sound.
They are, thank you very much. Although I am not at all clear as to how I am going to get them out of London just yet.
And, unless you have become a moderator, what I do or do not talk about is not open for your decision. Dave and Alan are quite capable of deleting anything I write that they don't want here.
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Don't you mean 'hear'. :-P
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Very true. I hope they get out of London sooner rather than later. But just as you are allowed to post an irrelevant few paragraphs regarding your views on world terrorism on a motoring discussion forum, I am allowed to gently suggest that the subject be eased back to something that may be of relevance to people checking the board.
And with that, may I wish *everyone* stuck in this nightmare a safe journey home today.
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I think you are being a little harsh blaming Mark Barchettaman.
I suppose it was me to blame for the 'bomb and bullet' comment but it is understandable that Mark is concerned for his family.
The terrorists who carry out these atrocities deserve everyones condemnation.
It was delays caused by IRA bombing on Londons Railways which got me back on a motorbike when I worked in the centre of town but it did not change my view that no gain was made because of bombing.
The IRA gained more by talking.
Anyway Helicopter Jr is also in central London today ( safe I gather from SWMBO) and will have the greatest of difficulty in getting home due to the apparent traffic chaos so I may well have to drive up to town to collect him.( Is that a good enough Motoring Link ?)
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"am afraid that they do. They may not achieve anything, but they do change things. My wife and children are in London today. When do you think I will allow that to happen again ?"
It changes nothing. Shocking tho it may be to you Mark due to your family being there, you cant let it change anything.
Let me explain.
I have been blown up by the IRA. To be precise I was in a pub 250 yards away from the Selfridges taxi rank bomb. I am still sightly deaf in one ear. I was working in London at the time.
Had I allowed it to change things it would have crippled my working life and my social life. There is no way my wife would allow me to dictate where she goes just because I experienced it first hand.
It can not be allowed to change how you live your life.
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I'd far rather this thread was free for all for today only, if necessary. I don't think anyone cares whether it's motoring related at the moment. There are bigger issues. Two people confirmed dead, for example.
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Thank you for keeping things civil. The thread stays due to the transport implications and, dare I say, the sense of community we have on this forum.
No Do$h - Alfa-driving Backroom Moderator
mailto:moderators@honestjohn.co.uk
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What amazes me is how relatively slowly the news broke. At 9am we had news of an Underground "power surge". Only after 10.00am was it clearer what had happened.
I realised the severity when all my FTSE100 share prices went red together at 10.15am approx..
madf
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I hope London recovers as fast as Jerusalem does after a suicide bomb.
Last year I was in Jerusalem when a bomb went off on a bus outside a petrol station and near to my hotel. Within 24 hours there was no indication at all that there had been a blast and I filled up at the station 36 hours after the bomb.
I hope no-one in the backroom has relatives caught up in this.
--
Espada III - well if you have a family and need a Lamborghini, what else do you drive?
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I've finally spoken to my sister, who has only managed to get to work in the last hour, one of her colleagues was caught up in it, but thankfully escaped unhurt. She's pretty shaken up and is not feeling particularly happy about being in London at all. Quite tempted to jump in the car and go and get her.
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I was in Jerusalem when a bomb went off on a bus outside a petrol station
>>
sorry that you and others ther had to go through the experience, just as much as anywhere else.
the purpose of my note really is to ask you, if, from your first hand experience, you can tell us how the transport and emergency authorities dealt with the situation. was the whole of the transport network paralysed for the 24 hours you mention?
my suspicion is that they probably managed the whole thing a lot differently to here in london.
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Dalglish,
you have to remember that Jerusalam may be a capital, but it is tiny compared to London. I can walk from the edge of the city to the centre of the old city in about an hour at most.
Usually bomb attacks are one-offs, with many attacks foiled well before the perpetrators reach the 'Green Line' let alone into Israel proper.
Regretfully, as they are used to it, small areas are cordoned off leaving the rest of the city to get on with it. Also, unlike in London where each blast scene is now a crime scene, leading to lots of time needed for evidence gathering, in Israel, the culprits are well known, frequently dead at the scene and the overall organisers elsewhere.
I have no intention of getting intothe politics of the Middle East but hope that this gives some flavour of the situation over there.
I am away to ISrael next week for three weeks on holiday with my family. Some may say I am mad, but I feel very safe there, and much safer at 2am in the middle of Tel Aviv, than I would in Manchester.
--
Espada III - well if you have a family and need a Lamborghini, what else do you drive?
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I have to say dalglish, that a comparison on how a single suicide bomb event in a pee ant town like Jerusalem, can be compared to 3 bombs going off in an undergound system with 750,000 commuters milling about, and 1 crowded london double deck bus.
As it happens, at this time, thats 6.5 hours later, Edgeware road (the scene of one bomb) is now open.
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I have to say dalglish, that a comparison on how a single suicide bomb
>>
i have travelled to tel-aviv on "business" and am aware of the different security measures taken.
i am also aware that a primary aim of terrorism is to cause maximum disruption for minimum effort. the attacks in london today were mere pinpricks compared to what is feasible.
i have hinted at my experience in a certain arena in another thread. suffice it to say, london has a lot to learn.
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A lot of my colleagues are in London today, all safe and well thankfully, but have asked me to keep them updated on transport options (if any) of getting home tonight and keep them updated from "base camp" here in the North East.
Anyone know of any reliable sources for tube info ? specifically Paddington Expresses, and flights from Heathrow ? i've booed tickets but are wondering if flights will indeed take off.
i can find little more than rumour and hearsay at the minute, as is to be expected in these situations
i know it's too soon to say but does anyone think they've got a chance of getting North of Watford tonight, as otherwise i'll need to start looking at hotels.
By the sounds of it, "west central London" i.e. victoria and waterloo is pretty unaffected apart from there being a lack of taxis.
Thanks,
Chris
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All airports working normally according to BBC 5 Live. No coaches into or out of central London.
Likely to be few trains into or out of central London as well.
--
Espada III - well if you have a family and need a Lamborghini, what else do you drive?
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www.ba.com will give flight details, delays cancellations etc I can't see them holding flights for people who can't get to the airport, whatever the reason. National Rail Enquiries might help with the train scene; the Paddington-LHR express has its own web site. Good luck to all trying to travel!
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I think www.baa.com is your best bet for real-time flight info at the airports. Hope you get where you´re going to.
Apologies to Mark, I wasn´t blaming anyone for anything, and am not going to apply to be a moderator anytime soon.
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Latest news I am aware of; careful about taking it as gospel, everything is full of misinformation and gossip.
Nothing being allowed off the M25 into London.
No tubes today.
Trains in not expected to be restored today.
No buses running
Heathrow Express not running
Trains to Paris still running
Planes mostly as normal (but it will take one lost carrier bag to stop that).
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If you want to find hotels or get people out of london, you need to look south/south west of the thames.
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Thanks to all.
Shanks, i realise that they won't hold planes for people but there has been talk flying about on e-mail of grounding all planes. I'm being careful to avoid more scaremongering and hearsay here, but as Mark says, it only takes one abandoned square box in a carrier bag.
Have a good relationship with a hotel in Farringdon / City and pencilled in a few rooms there as a back-up but don't want to push my people back up that way, and i'm imagining they'd have to walk it, so will investigate hotels in SE.
Cheers once again,
Chris
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of course that should have been SW.
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but> there has been talk flying about on e-mail of grounding all planes. I'm being careful to avoid more scaremongering and hearsay here, but as Mark says, it only takes one abandoned square box in a carrier bag.
www.baa.com currently confirm:
7th July 2005 12:34
Due to the incident in Central London the BAA website is currently experiencing a high level of people visiting the site for information.
Severe disruption to transport in London - 7 July 2005
The airports remain open and all flights are currently operating normally.
Passengers are advised to allow additional time for their journey to and from the airports. All underground services in London are currently suspended.
All bus services in central London are suspended and coach services are severely disrupted.
Paddington, Liverpool Street, Kings Cross, St Pancras, Euston, Stratford and Victoria stations are shut.
Heathrow - Heathrow Express and Connect services are currently operating.
Gatwick - Gatwick Express is currently not operating
Stansted - Stansted Express is currently not operating
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If you want to find hotels or get people out of london, you need to look south/south west of the thames.
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sorry, that is closed too.
news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/4659259.stm
Sir Ian said: "All of London's transport is currently disabled. The safest thing anyone can do is stay where they are."
Commuter Stevan Bennett was on a train into central London on Thursday morning. He told BBC News: "I got as far as Clapham and then we were told to get off and that no more trains were going into central London.
"After half an hour we were told we could get onto a train into Waterloo but now that's stopped and is heading back out of London.
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Presently in my office in Chancery Lane. All quiet round here, few vehicles, busses and tube still suspended.
National Rail website has reasonably comprehensive information on current position with trains. Services terminating at Watford/Reading/Peterborough etc, problem will be to get to those points from Central London. Waterloo was open a couple of hours ago but vehicles being prevented from crossing the bridge. Reported to be a cordon round Central London but probably only an area bounded by the river/Marylebone Road etc not as far as the M25 as reported elsewhere.
Employer is considering options for staff unable to get home.
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I know this might sound silly, but people could walk out of London if they had the inclination.
It's around 20 miles to Watford from central London, so whilst obviously not ideal, 5 hours would do it....
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That's an option i'm seriously considering suggesting, i was caught up in the New York blackout in 2003 and must have put a good 15 miles in that day.
Could someone suggest to a ignorant guy from the provinces how far we're talking from Victoria to Feltham, presumably as the crow flies ?
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Victoria - Feltham shortest route (according to Multimap): 13.9 miles.
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Can anybody tell me if I can get down the A12 and then reasonably close to the City Airport ??
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BTW - Brasilian Television is reporting that al Qaeda have claimed responsibilty and are telling other European countries that they're going to get the same if they don't pull their forces out of Iraq.
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The motorway network into the London area has been closed.
Take a look at
www.trafficmap.co.uk/
You'll need to enable "Electronic Roadside Message Signs" option.
--
306 2.0 SE Cabriolet
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Victoria to Feltham about 14 miles.
Setting off now and walking seems your best option at the moment.
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Victoria to Feltham about 14 miles. Setting off now and walking seems your best option at the moment.
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Walk to Waterloo and get the train. I understand Waterloo still open.
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A1261 by Canary Wharf (comes in off the A13) is currently flowing ok. No information on whether this is local traffic or if it is from further afield.
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Head of network rail just been on Sky News.
With the exception of Kings X and Liverpool St, ALL mainline stations are open. They may close now and gain due to local security alerts, but will be reopened when that local alert is cleared (the lost suitcase scenario)
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Head of network rail just been on Sky News. With the exception of Kings X and Liverpool St, ALL mainline stations are open. They may close now and gain due to local security alerts, but will be reopened when that local alert is cleared (the lost suitcase scenario)
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Also saying Kings X continues to be closed for use by medical services but hope to open services to Finsbury Park later today so passengers can then transfer onwards.
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A1261 by Canary Wharf (comes in off the A13) is currently flowing ok. No information on whether this is local traffic or if it is from further afield.
From the horses mouth, so to speak. Spoke to a colleague at Barclays HQ in Canary Wharf, overlooking LC Airport and surrounding area.
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Complete chaos here (Euston), all the medics in the building have rushed out to UCLH.
Avoid central London at all costs: all underground services are suspended, and buses in zone 1.
Congestion charge has been suspended as well.....
While everyone was concentrating on the Olympics/G8/Live 8 - this happens.....
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Keep well out and don't travel if necessary - there are still attacks taking place.
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The head of Network Rail was just on News 24, saying that all mainline rail stations are open with the exception of Kings +, which will open later. So it seems that rather than walking to Watford, walking to a mainline station could be the best option.
There was no mention of further attacks taking place, or advice to people not to use mainline services.
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I've just woken up this afternoon to this news, I've done the ringing around of the few people I know in London and they are thankfully ok, one of them having being travelling on circle lane at the time of the explosion.
My sympathies to anyone who has been effected buy this.
I can't believe that we only mentioned the possibility of s strike yesterday...
Blue
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A bad,bad day. Aparently an unheard of until now terror group has claimed responsibility and issued a 200 word statement - to be found on BBC news website.
I mentioned the inevitability of a terror stike yesterday thinking 5-7 years from now, but of course these attacks can and do happen when we least expect it.
My sincerest condolences to the families of those injured and those who have lost their lives.
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Manchester airport closed over lunchtime - think it's now back open. This from someone who works there.
O
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Jaguar XJS V12 - comes with free personalised oil tanker.
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One of my cousins works on the front desk at the Hilton in London. They've opened up the hotel to let the walking wounded get some basic medical attention- no one can believe its really happened.
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From Essex County Council @ 15.36:
Dartford River Crossing: Traffic is still very heavy over bridge and through the tunnel. Tolls have been removed to allow traffic movement.
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The matrix signs on the M56 on the approach to Manchester Airport were all displaying "Avoid London Today, Listen To Radio".
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Disgustingly, someone is already 'on an earner' out of it - Casualty Hotline - an 0870 number!
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Not of any help to anyone, so it won't be missed. That's why I've taken it out.
Hugo - BR Moderator
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Chris R
Your comments were valid whilst the one above remained. However now Wrangler Rover's post has been severely edited I feel it's only right to park yours as well.
Hugo
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RF,
What I said to Chris R above also applies to your post.
H
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well said, chris R and RF.
wrangler_rover should not be grinding that (irrelevant) axe on this discussion, for those reasons, at this time.
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BTW Mark, I hope you got to meet your family OK.
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Everyone,
No Do$h has agreed to keep this thread open, an I support him on that.
Information. views, reactions and best wishes are welcome but lets keep this thread productive please.
Hugo - BR Moderator
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BTW Mark, I hope you got to meet your family OK.
Spoke to Mark half an hour ago and yes, he managed to drive into central London and pick up his family. All now safe and sound at home.
Your kind thoughts will, I'm sure, be appreciated.
No Do$h - Alfa-driving Backroom Moderator
mailto:moderators@honestjohn.co.uk
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"Spoke to Mark half an hour ago and yes, he managed to drive into central London"
Is that boy tight or what? Had the congestion charge been in force he wouldnt have bothered! ;)
Nice one Mark.
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I got back just before Alan called me.
Not fun. Total chaos, and thank god I used to live in London so have a pretty good understanding of the back roads and alleyways.
Still, now got a full set of girlies at home so I'm happier now.
The police were impressive, and mostly well coordinated - and there were 000's of them !
Loads of people walking out of London. It is true to say that the mainline stations were open - in the sense that you could walk in and out of them and trains were welcome - there weren't actually many trains though, if any.
I felt sorry for older people who had no choice but to walk, and in some cases a long way.
I saw two things which made me think when taken together
- a pub, just along from the Tower, absolutely stacked out into the street with suits which had been evacuated from their buildings and so had walked to the first pub they found that was open and then set about drinking it dry.
- a huge gathering of non-suits standing around in Aldgate and surroundings watching the police at work - as if it was some sort of exciting episode in a soap opera.
Was the congestion charge in force ? I am assuming so. Mind you, god only knows how many points I picked up today from bus lanes, no vehicle areas and one way streets.
BTW, it took me almost 5 hours to get from the M25 into the centre and back out to the M25.
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The Congestion Charge was waived today.
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As sjb stated.So mark wont be affected.I gather it will be looked at again tomorrow?.
--
Steve
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