In 2 weeks time I will be in Munich by car, and am toying with the idea of making the return trip to UK within a day, so I can be present on SWMBO's birthday. Conventional wisdom says 730 miles in a day is taboo, but so also is arriving a day late for aforesaid thrash. In my mad youth in Oz I once did 900-plus in a day and still feel pretty gung-ho about the idea. Others' experiences?
Oz (as was)
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Depends what you mean by a day... within 24 hours, provided you were well rested and fed before hand and took brakes on the way shouldn;t be too bad.
But 730 miles in one go would be pushing it and ill-advised.
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Most I've done was 650. Plenty of breaks, but knackered and found myself in danger of drifting off a couple of times. I wouldn't do it again, especially with most of it on M ways. That's where tiredness is likely to catch you unawares.
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Hate to travel without brakes. Perhaps you meant breaks!
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if you can blat down an autobahn at 100+ for much of the journey it may be ok. If you're talking about the UK, forget it, it's crazy.
John
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730 miles @ 50mph is 15 hours. 6 hours sleep in the middle of two 7.5 hour driving sessions and a 20 minute break every two hours.
Not pleasant, but hardly a killer. And on a journey of largely motorways, a 50mph average excluding stops is absolutely do-able. (unless my maths is totally messed up).
However, I have no idea what impact the ferry or whatever might have.
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No. No. No.
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Did 550 to Geneva in a newish 2.0 Mondeo ten years ago - which was OK. All autoroutes from Calais, just boring. Take plenty of nibbles to save you having to queue at the shops, but do the stops for to stretch and loo etc.
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i once drove from marseilles to cherbourg in 8hrs,,,it was easy, then had a nights sleep on the ferry,was awful :)
the drive was the easy bit
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www.storme.co.uk
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"once drove from marseilles to cherbourg in 8hrs,,,it was easy,"
700 miles, 8 hours, thats an *average* speed of 87 miles an hour?
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Oz
It depends on how you define your "day"
If its a 24 hour window, as mark says with good pacing (ie the 6 hours sleep, 20 mins breaks and 15 hours driving is dooable.
If however you are planning to do 750 miles in an 18 hours or less window then you might not make this birthday, or the next, or the next..........
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On the continent not too much of a problem, I have done 650 +ferry+ 100 UK a couple of times on my own in the last 2 years and 6 times with various codrivers. However the A75 is easy with light traffic.
The worst bit is the return trip with the M25 reminding you why you really do not want to come back to England.
However I NEVER make it an absolute target! If it is dark, or wet just divide it into 2 days.
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pmh (was peter)
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I often do 630 across Spain then next day 660 across France. Two half hour leg stretch breaks per day. On the Continent it is a pleasure. They have decent roads.
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I can think of days when 7.3 miles has been more than I would have wanted to attempt without falling asleep.
And days when I've spent quite a lot of hours behind a wheel and felt I've had a good day.
Silly questions but: Can't you fly? Or put the car on the train? Or find somebody to share the driving?
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Can you take someone along to share the driving? 700 ish miles in a day is fairly mad. Personally I'd take a plane over there, hire a car, then fly back to the UK and do things the easy way. I am sure your SWMBO would rather you missed this birthday than all the rest of them because you rushed home....
teabelly
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I once drove from Devon to Liverpool and back again the same day. However, I set off at 6am to attend an open day and didn't set off again until 7pm that afternoon.
Took me 4 hours each way, approximately 560 miles in total. Didn't find it bad at all, but I made sure I had a credit card if necessary to spend the night in the Travelodge or something.
Only time I get tired is if I spend a long time in traffic jams or driving in bad weather. In fact, after driving up to Leeds on the 14th April I was exhausted. It had been pouring all the way up, there was significant standing water on the motorway, traffic was busy and doing 40mph for most of the journey. I ended up taking 3 breaks.
Apart from that though, I'm fine, and have regularly done Leeds -> Devon in one go provided the weather's and traffic is good. I think long distance driving is very driver dependent. Some people can do it; some can't.
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Yeovil ( Somerset) to German/ Austrian border by LDV minibus in a 20 hour stint stopping only for fuel in Jan 1994,never again absolute ball breaker of a journey.
This year took 1 way hire to Stanstaed and flew to Nuremberg with Airberlin (£18 return+ taxes) then hired 2 Opel minibuses for the week.
Apart from departing Yeovil @ 0230 for a 0800 flight from Stanstead and 21/2 hours on the autoban, easy way to arrive.
It might have been slightly more expensive but 20 hours in a minibus is no idea of fun.
Fly it's a lot cheaper, faster, and easier.
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I have actually driven to Munich and back a few times - including a non-stop return journey (when I was a few years younger) - I used the Hovercraft to cross the channel. Its possible, but no fun at all. Nowadays cheap flights make this sort of trip unnecessary. I always fly to Germany and pick up a car. Much more civilised.
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Ive driven from Dumfries back home to High Wycombe in a day i thought that was bad 322 miles but it does seem further then that when you're in a Pug 205 1.1!!!!!!
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Its not what you drive, its how you drive it! :-)
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the most I've done in a single session was form North Germany to Le Mans in a motorhome. Ten hours with a dinner break. Three circuits of the peripherique, all in convoy with a Porsche 911 and a Corvette Stingray. Not much fun but no real problem so ong as te seat is comfy enough.
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I read often, only post occasionally
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Most I've done is 796 miles in a day. Caught the hovercraft from Dover to Calais first thing in the morning, and drove to Mittersill in Austria (between Kitzbuhel and Zell am See)in a Ford Fiesta (Mark III, 1.1 engine.) I made it, but told myself I would never try that again.
(Memorable day, because I decided to see how fast I could get the Fiesta to go while on the Autobahn. Just got the speedo up to 100 mph)
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Many years ago, when I was still in my teens, towed a trailer with three dinghys using a 100E van.
Southend to Scarborough, eight hours up, eight hours back, no break. No brains.
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On 3 occasions I have driven over 700 miles in a day.
1st.time was in the Australian outback.Very boring drive just looking at desert most of the time(at least you can go as fast as you dare-no speed limit.Not very tiring as you are not having to concentrate all the time.
2nd.time was going on holiday driving down to Biarritz in southern France.Twelve hours of driving (flat out on the empty peage toll roads)Quite tiring,No breaks-just stops for fuel.Took the most of the next day to unwind from that drive,But worth it for a fantastic holiday.
3rd and most recent was in Jan. this year travelling from Oxfordshire to Cornwall to Hull and back to Oxfordshire in a day!!,and a friday to boot!.720 miles,16 hours of actual driving.Left home at 5am and arrived back at 11.15pm absolutely knackered.horrendous driving-raining all day,bunged up motorways.Unfortunately this was work related so no nice holiday at the end of it.Just felt rubbish for the rest of the weekend.
You will just have to weigh up how important it is for you to get back.If you go for it remember to try and rest when possible and drink plenty of fluids as its easy to get de-hydrated and lose concentration.
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All these people doing these huge mileages!! I thought doing 1800 in two weeks was good going!
What vehicles did you make these trips in?
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Well i did a 1k trip to Ireland & back to Wycombe in my Pug 205 in 6 days, i managed to get an average of 50mpg during that time!!!
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Its not what you drive, its how you drive it! :-)
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My experience of long distance driving has been that to avoid danger, you need to keep to lightly trafficked roads with some scenery and decent radio stations.
Manchester to Glasgow and back in a day (approx 430 miles) is far far easier than the equivalent (and slightly shorter trip) Manchester to London. M6 north of M55 and M74 has only about 10% of the traffic of the M6 south of M56 & M1.
Frankly, if I could avoid a 730 mile trip I would unless it could be broken up into 180 mile chunks maximum and the roads were easy. Always stop for at least 1/2 hour every 2 - 2.5 hours for loo, stretch and tea/coffee.
The main reason why it is easier is that you can keep up a much higher average with less traffic. I reckon that Manchester to Glasgow is an easy 75mph average trip without trying. Manchester to London is a very hard 60mph average. Thats a big difference to how tired you feel.
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Espada III - well if you have a family and need a Lamborghini, what else do you drive?
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I think how tiring a journey is depends a lot upon what car you are travelling in. A 500 mile journey in a 1 litre hatchback will be far more tiring than the same journey in a large saloon. But long car journeys should be avoidable by flying and hiring a car at your destination if required. What car do you drive oz?
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I did 770 plus ferry a few times in my youth, 100 miles to Dover, 3 hours or so on the Ostend ferry and 670 miles to the north of Denmark, oh yes in a Metro Turbo.
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After I returned from UK to New Zealand I rode my 1982 Suzuki 750 Katana from Auckland to Christchurch in one go. Left at about 5am, caught the 4pm ferry from Wellington in the North Island to the South Island. Arrived in the South Island about 7.30pm, rode to Christchurch, arrived before Midnight. That's about 400 miles in the North Island and about 200 in the South. About 50 miles maximum of motorway, the rest single carriageway A road, and some of the greatest scenery in the world.
I was just getting tired towards the end, but was never in danger of dropping off or getting careless. It was helped by the almost complete emptiness of the roads on December 23rd. I thought it wasn't too bad for someone in their late forties!
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Oz, you don't say what car you're proposing to make the trip in. Type of vehicle makes a big difference!
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Simple solution - fly SWMBO to Munich, and have leisurely drive back together. Backroomers recommending flying - what's the place coming to!
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Assuming this is a solo attempt I'd agree with Mark. 730 miles even at motorway moving averages and your're looking at 12-14 hours actually driving. Factor in even basic tea and wee breaks and a margin to recover delay and you're looking at a 16/18 hour day, plus time on the ferry. You'll probably get away with it but you need to be able to enjoy the party as well.
Split into two legs with time for some kip in the middle and it's possible to do it safely.
We do 600+ occasionally, bit and bit with two drivers, and are still jiggered at the end of it.
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600 is my highest - and it was daft.
300 to pick up a car chassis, not that heavy and plonked on the roof rack of my (then) Austin Maxi. However at that point, the crankshaft oil seal went, and although the leak was not bad enough to make oil use that excessive, it got on the clutch. So the return journey was very wearing as it was impossible to move away from rest without very severe judder.
I got safely home - and could not sleep - I'd druck far too much coffee and had all the symptoms of caffine poisoning!
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Depends on your concentration levels. If you can concentrate for long periods of time and can recognise when you're too tired and need a break, you will be fine.
I once drove from Basel to Middlesbrough in one go (734miles) in a Fiat Tipo 1.4, and was ok, tired but ok. (this was the day after driving to basel from near Naples, another 600+ stretch)
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What chance of starting the night before, getting 4 hours in, meal @ sleep at a cheapy Formule 1 type place, 7 hours sleep, and then doing the rest the next day. 4 hours in the evning could get you an easy 240-270 miles down the track, and so then you'd have less than 500 to do on day 2.
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Stoke on Trent to Montrose leaving at 6am back by 8.30pm. 740 miles. Knackered for 2 days afterwards.
Never again.
madf
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Why do this? Take it easy, make the journey part of the break.
Have a night on the way and a nice meal.
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Couldn´t agree more. There are all sorts of lovely places to stop on route. And I´m not biased because I live in Germany...
1) look into the budget airline options and fly/drive
2) try to drive on a Sunday, it makes a massive difference on the continent with the HGV traffic as so many of the motorways are dual carriageway.
3) if you´re going to do it, get your head down on the ferry. I bring my pillow from home and a sleeping bag. Just 45mins shut eye makes a huge difference.
4) don´t drive 100+mph through Germany.
Two weeks ago I did Taunton - Frankfurt in a day, 11 1/2 hours, but my personal ´best´ was Milan - Lincoln, in a Skoda Favorit. About 17hours if I remeber correctly. Lots of sugarfree gum helps, if you really start to flake, STOP.
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I think its safe...to say that you won't get a clear answer on this.
Lots of people suggesting flying without even knowing if flying is an option. I'm afraid you won't know if it is wise to drive until you actually try it yourself. Personally I enjoy driving so 730 or 1030 miles is not a problem for me. If I am sat in a comfy seat, good tunes playing, temp set just right, then I am relaxed and even enjoying myself.
Why would anyone need a break from being relaxed is beyond me really, but there are some that don't find driving enjoyable or relaxing and you will never find any of them thinking it wise to drive 730 or even 30 miles in a day.
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I did Cortina to Arnhem (650) miles in a day and it was OK. Summer, long day, earlyish start and a lot of de-restricted autobahn on the route. Had company but did all the driving myself and made the odd comfort, refuelling and food stops.
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Hit the nail on the head there Trancer, if you enjoy it it will be fine. If you consider it a chore you'll no doubt find it very difficult.
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"Personally I enjoy driving so 730 or 1030 miles is not a problem for me"
I?m not sure that I buy into the philosophy that because you enjoy it, it?s safe to do it all day.
I?d have gone blind.
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Another factor to consider:-
If you get half way and it all starts to go pear shaped you're going to be pressing on under increasing pressure to meet your time deadline. It only then takes bad weather, another accident or whatever and your at the automaton stage and still two hours from home feeling more and more desparate about arriving.
Flyers call it presson-itis and it kills several PPL holsers (and the odd pro) every year.
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If you do decide to do it, let me know and I'll keep off the roads for the day.
I drive to Austria regularly. There is no way I would attempt the door-to-door in one day. Quite frankly it's no fun. I drive a tuned Saab 9-5 with plen=nty of oomph - which means it's totally relaxed on the autobahn. But the concentration levels required for extended driving periods at speed are high. We always have an overnight stop on the way.
Think of it like this. You have set yourself a deadline. You have allowed an average speed of 50mph. If you get caught in an autobahn snarlup for whatever reason (yes, they do have jams and accidents over there, despite what people think), and don't move for an hour, you have to do 100mph for the next hour to get back on schedule....so you are now under pressure, you'll skimp on stops, and hey presto, you've become a statistic.
I KNOW people do it, lots of examples in this thread - but just look how many say "never again". If you do decide to go for it, stop every couple of hours for a leg stretch. Vary your speed. Don't set impossible limits. Take good music. Listn to the good advice from others her who have done it.
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It could be a matter of being late or 'the late'. Which would YVLLW* prefer?
*Your Very Lovely Lady Wife -- Lady Badger won't let me use SWMBO
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*Your Very Lovely Lady Wife -- Lady Badger won't let me use SWMBO
Does she let you use the word 'irony'? ;)
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Oz- you've not said what you're going to Munich for or what kind of car you're using.
If going to be in the city for more than a couple of hours, then attempt the journey home fatigue is going to be a serious issue not only for the journey, but in all likelihood the next couple of days as well.
I don't know you, how fit you are or how good a driver you are. Only you really know what you're capable of. As you are asking others if they think this is possible- are you having misgivings about attempting this? If so- then you probably already know the answer.
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*Your Very Lovely Lady Wife -- Lady Badger won't let me use SWMBO
>>Does she let you use the word 'irony'?
No, but she does let him use the iron to do the ironing!
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If you are travelling by Ferry factor in an hour or so to allow for ferry delays - atrocious at the moment.
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Drove from Cambridge to Stranraer, watched a football match, turned round and drove back. 720 miles, I did all the driving. Non-stop both ways.
With a friend, I might add. I'm sad, but not that sad.
Madness, sheer madness. Stranraer are part-time.
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When people in this thread say "non-stop". Do you mean that quite literally? All I can say is that you have better bladder control than I have. Either that or a large ashtray.
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I'd say it depends on how you are at driving great distances normally.
I recently drove from High Wycombe up to Luton, caught a flight to Aberdeen, hired a Renault Espace one way hire) then went to Buckie then onto Inverness and all the way back to High Wycombe in one day. I arrived back about 10:30pm.
I stopped twice and managed to rack up 3 points on my license (the car had cruise control plus was an auto and it increased speed as I came down a long straight hill in the Highlands. I let it go because it was completly clear of anything and a mobile camera van was well hidden. 71 in a 60mph limit).
The only problem I found was my shoulders/neck ached. It was only when I returned the vehicle to Luton the following morning did I notice an armrest was available on the L/H side of the seat and I could have pulled it down!
This journey was about 730 miles.
I wasn't tired in any way but that is me. Everyone is different.
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My advice would be get some audio books and take it easy.Don,t try to hurry and drive on the edge or you will get too tired.
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Not stupid, but perhaps unwise. The key safety factor here is fatigue and how you measure it. 100m on Sat morning after a few drinks on Fri night after a hard working week with little sleep might well engender as much fatigue as 300m on a fast autobahn when well rested.
In the few accidents I have had in the past 40yrs, with hindsight fatigue was a major factor.
Take especial care approaching railway bridges.
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Many moons ago I covered 950 miles in 22 hours on the Stuart Highway with a co-driver. A lot of it was dirt as well.
Definitely "stoopid".
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Many thanks to all for so many varied angles and opinions. A lot of high mileage experience in lots of styles!
Of course I don't overestimate my stamina at my relatively crusty stage of life - marginally less than it once was - and will heed warning signs as and when they appear. Even now I'm accustomed to doing around 400 work miles per day, it's just that the journey in question is a fairly major step up from that. Munich to Calais is around 600 according to www.maporama.com (excellent site) and if I go ahead with the plan I'll break this at least twice. Then follows the 1½ hours on the ferry, and finally the 'home stretch' of 130-ish - as long as I still feel fit.
Oz (as was)
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I recently took a car from J16 M1 to Troon, Ayreshire and brought another back. Total miles about 750. I made some 'good progress' on the way up from 4-10 AM but took it easy on the way back. If you pace yourself and go faster when conditions allow but don't feel under pressure to do the same if the traffic builds up or conditions deteriorate, all should go OK.
Don't PLAN a break as this will lead you to press towards a target that may not be appropriate to how you feel, instead take a break when you NEED one. If that is once then fine, if that is every hour for ten minutes then that's fine also. If it doesn't feel safe, it isn't safe.
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If you want to get ahead - get a Van!
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www.ukbiker.org/motochallenge/index.htm
After 20 years of adventuring, Nick Sanders can surely claim to be one of the most versatile adventurers in the UK . Nine years after he originally won the record, Nick is getting ready for his sixth round the world motorcycle challenge, and this time, it's 20,000 miles and less than 20 days ! Nick will only carry his credit card and his film camera, no change of clothes, no GPS, no maps and no tools.
Day 6 - Calcutta.
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would it not be easier to find another SWMBO? I drove from north of Glasgow to Chippenham (Wilts) in one bash ( fuel in Brum) the next day my spine decided to become two separate very painful parts. Chiropractor made me promise I never,ever made a journey like this again. Advice taken - thank you Ryanair. your choice of course!!
Steve
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I did 900 miles once from the middle of Poland to Calais in a Passat TDI which was superb for the job except the lack of cruise control and heavy accellerator - my right knee hurt for a while after! Different people have different limits. As long as you know your realistic limits then I think it's ok to do once in a long while!
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I have done 800 miles in a day many times and enjoyed it. It's not difficult on empty French motorways. I think it is the number of hours driving that counts, not the mileage.
On the other hand, I once did (3am start) Swindon-Bristol-Dover-Calais-somewhere the other side of Paris-Calais-Dover-Bristol-Swindon (over 1000 miles) in a (very long) day. Now that was stupid. Even for a £100 bonus (spent on cheap booze while I was there!) Wouldn't do it again.
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>>but so also is arriving a day late for aforesaid thrash
Chances are that you'll arrive late back for aforesaid thrash owing to traffic problems.
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