Hi
I am new here and really need some advice.
I was going over the severn bridge last weekend and drove through a speed camera (police camera van on the bridge) I was doing about 80-85 in a new 50 zone and I have not had anything from dvla yet.
I am really worried that I will be banned from this but cant find any details on penalties that are current on the web (not that great at searching to be honest!)
Does anyone know what the penalties are as I recall something about graduated penalties being introduced but cant remember if it happened or not.
I am really scared as mu car is my life and I couldnt live without it in all honesty.
thank you in advance. :)
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Sorry pal. I *think* and I stress *THINK* it could be court which is more than likey 6 points and a big fine. I'm pretty certain it's a 6 pointer at least but you have mitigating circumstances.
I think 25 over the limit is the limit for 3 points and over that is 6 points. Don't know what the instant ban threshold is though.
You never know - give it 14 days and you may have got off with it.
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Adam
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I just feel so stupid, there was a toyota sports car gunning it past me one min then the next he has braked in front of me and instead of using my brain and thinking why did he do that oh yeah theres a poilce camera van up there i swerve around him and shout at him! by which time its way too late to brake enough :(
in my defence though my 16 month old son was in a dirty nappy and i was trying to get to a sevices to change him, quite how that will hold up in court i dont know!
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in my defence though my 16 month old son was in a dirty nappy and i was trying to get to a sevices to change him, quite how that will hold up in court i dont know!
That wont wash with them i'm afraid..
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in my defence though my 16 month old son was in a dirty nappy and i was trying to get to a sevices to change him, quite how that will hold up in court i dont know!
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So instead of slowing down to investigate why this other car had slowed down so suddenly (perhaps there was an acciednt, or the lane was being closed or there was some hazard on the road) you and I quote:
"...swerve around him and shout at him..."
Thereby causing danger to other road users (by swerving) and shouting at him (road rage) whilst yourself exceeding the speedlimit by a margin of 30MPH when the road has a 50 limit - and to boot you have your KID IN THE CAR?
I hope you get banned - because it's the life of your son that I'm more worried about than yours. I'd bet money you'll get summonsed to Court where the outcome will be as Adski says. Absolutely disgraceful using your son as an excuse for speeding - gamble with your own life, but drive more sedately with your kid in the car.
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Im not plain stupid, just a special kind of stoopid.
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ihpj, if you had some idiot overtake you then brake quickly in front of you I have no doubt the adreniline would be going as much as the next persons!
The court may have leniancy if your driving was essential to your job, it's been highlighted on a thread here recently. They may also take into account the welfare of your child if you're going to be stuck without job, transport to daycare, etc.
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Mike Farrow
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ihpj, if you had some idiot overtake you then brake quickly in front of you I have no doubt the adreniline would be going as much as the next persons!
It would, but it wouldn't cause me to swerve around them and speed on past! Thereby doing the same to someone else.
But then you're going to say, 'Oh but as a Police Driver you're trained and we're not' - rubbish. It's all about courteous and SAFE driving. You must be aware of whats around you and be able to react to the best of your abilities. This fellow did the opposite and also had a child with them.
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Im not plain stupid, just a special kind of stoopid.
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ihpj, thank you for your 'helpful' advice.
my son had a dirty nappy and im afraid my son was and always is my first priority.
i would never endanger my children and actually resent that implication.
the car in question was nearly in my boot for ages before i could safely pull over (which was another of my reasons for speeding to let him past me.) when he pulled in front of me then braked suddenly i was shocked andf confused as the traffic was CLEAR ahead so no reason as far as i could see for him to do this.
If i get banned will you then explain to my children that you are glad they can no-longer attend pre-school and do their after school activites?
aftre this post i will probably get kicked off here but after your reply i dont think i much care.
oh and how appripriate you signiture.....'Im not plain stupid, just a special kind of stoopid.'
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my son had a dirty nappy and im afraid my son was and always is my first priority.
As do I, but I wont jeopardise his safety by speeding - evne if he has a dirty nappy since a dirty nappy wont kill him. It'll make him cranky sure...but thats about it.
i would never endanger my children and actually resent that implication.
Well you're the one who said that you "...swerve around him..." and I'd wager that by doing so, you caused the same irritation to other road users becaus swerving by its very nature implies you changed lanes without looking. Thereby creating danger to yourself and other road users.
the car in question was nearly in my boot for ages
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If you were being hot dogged by another vehicle, then you put the safety of your family first, slow down and let him past.
before i could safely pull over (which was another of my reasons for speeding to let him past me.)
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But I don't get how speeding up even more to let him past is helpful? If you speed up then how is he going to get past you?
when he pulled in front of me then braked suddenly
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Well if you had to brake suddenly then you were obviously travelling too close to him in the first place - the reason was not only that this guy cut in front of you but you were travelling too fast.
i was shocked andf confused as the traffic was CLEAR ahead
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Then if you were shocked and confused then you slow down or stop since you are 'confused' and can't take in whats going on around you. If you speed up, when you are shocked and confused then you are placing yourself, your occupants and other road users at even greater risk than before because you aren't able to process the information that you're required to at faster speeds.
so no reason as far as i could see for him to do this.
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Obviously you weren't looking far enough ahead - otherwise you would have seen the Police Speedvan wouldn't you?
If i get banned will you then explain to my children that you are glad they can no-longer attend pre-school and do their after school activites?
I wasn't the one driving at speed - that was you and by travelling 30MPH over the speed limit IS dangerous.
aftre this post i will probably get kicked off here but after your reply i dont think i much care.
I think we're all a tolerant bunch ;) I certainly don't take offence to your post since I'd be annoyed too -0 but you have to look at it realistically. YOU were speeding and by some great amrgin. And not only that you had your son in the car with you - gamble freely with your own life, but be doubly, triply more careful when it comes to your kids.
oh and how appripriate you signiture.....'Im not plain stupid, just a special kind of stoopid.'
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Well I am special ;)
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Im not plain stupid, just a special kind of stoopid.
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...travelling 30MPH over the speed limit IS dangerous.
Is it? Definitely?
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>> ...travelling 30MPH over the speed limit IS dangerous. Is it? Definitely?
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Well let me put it another way. Up to (usually) 26MPH over the speed limit the Officer CAN issue you with a Fixed Penaly Notice (FPN) or serve a summons (aggravating factors) but @ 30MPH the discretion is taken away from the Officer and a summons it is - if it isn't dangerous, then why else would that discretion be taken away from an Officer? There has to be a limit - somewhere and a 'leeway' - and at 30MPH + it's deemed to be so serious that it can ONLY be dealt with at Court and NOT suitable for an FPN. No-one can say 'for definite' - but it is that serious that only a Court appearance will do.
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Im not plain stupid, just a special kind of stoopid.
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Hi Jelley
Boy have you got them ranting. A site that may help you review the facts around speeding tickets etc is www.ukspeedtraps.co.uk Check it out you may be Ok if you get past 17 days before the NIP (Notice of Intended Prosecution) lands on the mat. The law states that you must recieve it within 14 days plus 3 for mr posty to get it to you. If it arrives after that you can contest it and your off the hook. Not going to judge you on the your reasons for speeding as that makes me as bad as the cash grabbing system that has penalised 12 million drives
See quote from Evening Standard below
Figures calculated by Safe Speed and presented for the first time today in the London Evening Standard reveal that more than 12 million motorists have now been convicted by speed camera.
According to a simple projection of speed camera tickets based on HomeOffice figures well over 12 million speed camera tickets have been issued since the first ticket in 1992. £700 million pounds have been raised in speeding fines but the roads have not got safer - In fact road deaths have not fallen significantly for a decade.
Paul Smith, founder of the Safe Speed road safety campaign
(www.safespeed.org.uk) said: "It's a grudge thing for most motorists who have received a speeding ticket. They know full well that they were driving at a safe and appropriate speed at the time of the so-called offence and they resent being abused."
"So far only the Conservatives have pledged to look at the speed camera programme - including a pledge to disband the greedy camera partnerships. But in the run up to the election what party would dare to ignore the pain of 12 million voters and the disgruntled chattering in every pub in the land?"
"Our extensive research show clearly that routine speeding by
otherwise responsible motorists is not a serious road safety issue yet while the focus remains on speed other far more important issues are neglected. But even worse than that is the effect of speed cameras on responsible drivers. It should be obvious to everyone that drivers looking for cameras are not looking for hazards on the road ahead."
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\" Keep doing the same old thing, youll get the same old thing, try something different today!\"
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road deaths have not fallen significantly for a decade.
But traffic has grown substantially. Deaths per mile are way down.
"It's a grudge thing for most motorists who have received a speeding ticket. They know full well that they were driving at a safe and appropriate speed at the time of the so-called offence and they resent being abused."
Most speeding drivers know they were driving at a safe and appropriate speed? Pull the other one.
It should be obvious to everyone that drivers looking for cameras are not looking for hazards on the road ahead."
Welcome back to our old friend the can't-walk-and-chew-gum argument. Learn how to drive within the limit, then stop worrying about cameras.
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Here! Here! Well posted NoWheels.
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Im not plain stupid, just a special kind of stoopid.
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for gods sake i dont usually speed, i am a driver who sticks to the limits all the time (give or take 5mph)
i only popped my head in to get an answer to my question not a load of personal abuse.
you dont know me so dont judge me.
i can see i am not welcome here so i will leave you all to it.
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Nice one NoWheels and IHPJ, The guy was only looking for advice which he got from some of us!
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Jellybean
Dont panic, as Adam says if you get caught you are up for a visit in court. You dont really have any mitigating factors for that amount over, A dirty nappy wont wash it I am afraid. Just show some penitence in court. Its only going to be three points and a FAT fine or 6 points and a lesser fine. No ban.
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for gods sake i dont usually speed, i am a driver who sticks to the limits all the time (give or take 5mph)
I feel uncomfortable rubbing it in, but that limits-give-or-take-5mph claim would only make sense if you thought that your speed of 80-85 was in an 80mph zone. I didn't think there were any 80mph limits anywhere near the Severn Bridge.
I'm not trying to be horrid to you -- my reason for writing this is that I do think that if you are that far over the speed limit, the court would be unlikely to be lenient unless you start by acknowledging that your speed was excessive even if you thought it was a 70mph zone.
You've already had a police officers's advice on how well the son's-nappies excuse might work. "Very very sorry, your honour" will cut a lot more ice with any court than excuses.
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But traffic has grown substantially. Deaths per mile are way >> down.
Could that be because the increased traffic means average speeds have dropped?
Most speeding drivers know they were driving at a safe and appropriate speed? Pull the other one.
Isn't it mainly 'safe' drivers - ie 25-50 age range who are getting caught? I got caught by a hidden tripod mounted mobile unit doing 85MPH on a quiet summer evening on a brand-new dual carriageway. There has never been a serious accident on that road since it opened but it's a dream location to generate revenue.
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>> But traffic has grown substantially. Deaths per mile are way down. Could that be because the increased traffic means average speeds have dropped?
Possibly. But unless you want to be yelled at, don't tell the anti-camera folks that: they claim that reduced speeds won't reduce accidents numbers or severity.
Isn't it mainly 'safe' drivers - ie 25-50 age range who are getting caught?
I haven't seen any figures. Do you know if any have been published?
But if these 'safe' drivers think it's 'safe' to drive at excessive speeds and aren't observant enough to spot either the speed limits or cameras, then of course they will get caught.
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Jellybean,
I know it'll weigh on your mind but there's nothing you can do (apart from learning from this incident) until a NIP arrives. There's every chance they were focused on the other car and missed you.
I find vehicles quite frequently cut in and slow down for no apparent reason. I tend to change lanes to give myself the maximum clear space in front of me. Sometimes I give the other driver a 'look' but I'm usually a pretty calm driver so wouldn't shout at them. Although a traffic policeman yelled at me the other day, which was quite a surprise - but that's another story.
Easy to say that you ought to have seen the van but they can get you at 1000Metres and they're usually positioned to get people just as they come around bends (at least the 2 that got me where!). You do have to stand on the brakes though, as the speed reading is instant - it's no good just easing off. This may well cause crashes behind you, but not to worry, accidents justify the speed cameras existence.
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No need to have spotted the camera van nor to wonder why the other car suddenly decelerated from 80+mph. The 50mph speed limit heading west on the second severn crossing surely are posted?
The 50mph limit is there to get people to slow down for the toll boths. Should have been paying attention to the speed limits as well as what others are doing around you.
Now if you didn't see the 50mph signs then I would not use that as part of an excuse/reason. That's probably driving without due care and attention. And if you did see the 50mph signs ahead, why didn't you slow down? Or were you hoping there was nobody around with a speed camera? But then again you had to eventually stop at the tolls.
Now.... whether you get offered a fixed penalty or go to the magistrates really depends on your speed. At 26mph over the limit the police cannot offer a fixed penalty. But bearing in mind speedometers over-read (my Mondeo is doing about 75mph when the speedo says 80mph) you might be lucky. If your speedo said 80mph when they clocked you then you might be within the 10% plus 2mph margin for error and end up less than 26mph over the limit. So 3 points and £60.
Fingers crossed you were not doing over 76mph then...
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Ok let's stop now. He wants to know what the penalty is not to be hung drawn and quartered.
Ok - he broke the speed limit. Did he crash? No. Did he kill anyone? No. Did anyone get hurt? No. I'll admit he was going pretty quick but I'm willing to bet that the road he was on didn't always have a 50 limit.
So let's all go easy on him. I don't see how saying "You heartless father" and all that malarky is helping.
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Adam
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You're right to say the limit of 50mph hasn't always been there. They introduced it last year because of the accidents when people approached the toll booths too fast:
news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/wales/south_east/3732910.stm
www.checkyourspeed.org.uk/fe_news/news_details.asp...4
It's been there a while now though. Never go west bound myself because I don't want to pay the toll.
Be warned that there's talk of a 30mph limit approaching the tolls.
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Oh and before anyone asks, I do have one SP30, which was received whilst driving my own car doing 72MPH in a National Speed limit - Sunday afternoon, wide open out of town road no traffic and yes I didn't see the Beds Police Police Speed parked neatly into the offside layby ;) Points should be off for counting purposes in a couple of months :o)
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Im not plain stupid, just a special kind of stoopid.
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I think the likelihood of jellybean speeding excessively again is pretty low. The uncertainty of waiting for the envelope to drop through the door is probably enough!
PS Why are you all assuming Jellybean is a man?
PPS No offence Jellybean
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PS Why are you all assuming Jellybean is a man?
I was wondering that! Suggestion for poll topic?
:-)
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I think the likelihood of jellybean speeding excessively again is pretty low. The uncertainty of waiting for the envelope to drop through the door is probably enough!
I think you are right. And I hope that Jellybean will eventually find the replies here helpful, even though they must have made for pretty uncomfortable reading.
PS Why are you all assuming Jellybean is a man?
All? Not me!
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80 in 50 is getting into ban territory. This is up to the magistrates.
Simple stuff: if you get a summons, turn up - on time and smartly dressed. Be polite.
Take something to read, as there can be long waits at court. Take your licence.
Don't drive to court.
IMO you're better off just apologising, rather than trying to justify speeding. They've heard it all before. If they are considering a ban, they will say so, and give you a chance to speak.
If you would *genuinely* lose your job if you couldn't drive, you need to get a letter from your employer to take with you as evidence. Again, just IMO, I would think hard before trying "wouldn't be able to take kid/aged parent to school/hospital/etc" type stuff - you might get sympathy, or you might get the sort of sanctimonious nonsense evident elsewhere in this thread.
If you're in ban territory but end up not banned, you're likely to get a heavy fine and 6 points. They will judge "heavy" in this context based on information you give them about your income and outgoings. It would be a serious criminal offence to lie (although since there doesn't seem any opportunity for them to check the information given, I doubt there are many convictions....) but you may wish to consider in advance what these are and how to best to present them.
6 points isn't as tragic from an insurance p-o-v as you might think, if you don't have any other offences to declare.
It's important to tell your insurance, and your employer if they also insure you to drive any vehicles, of your conviction ASAP.
Good luck.
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Quite a few years ago I was done for doing 97mph on a motorway. I could have used the usual excuses of sunny day, clear motorway, etc. but I was speeding. And the speedo probably read above 100mph too if I was honest.
This was south Wales and they have been keen on trapping speeding motorists for ages.
Anyway, had to go to magistrates and obviously didn't drive (meant train from Manchester and an overnight stay in Cardiff!). Points to note:
1. Turn up early because I got in as the first case of the morning! No long wait.
2. Had a letter from employer explaining doing a lot driving, stressful work of late, important to keep licence, etc.
3. Was apologetic and when asked if I had anything else to say, even said the salary figure was now wrong because of recent pay-rise. Thought fine would be based on ability to pay and therefore honesty might pay off ;-)
In the end, got 5 points and £150 fine. They even offered to allow me to pay fine via installments (and I was on nearly £30k at the time!)
Needless to say not been caught speeding since.... and that's because the most I do on the motorway is 80mph (so less in reality) and on all other roads have always stuck to limit, to annoyance of some other drivers.
Going back to your speed. If it was 80mph on the speedo I'd hope you got 3 points and £60 fine.
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Courts are reluctant to ban a driver who rely on their licence for their living, but by the same token they do taken a very dim view of these 'heavy users' since as they rely on their licence, they should be acutely aware of the need to respect the Road Traffic Laws - since their licence is that important.
Anyhoo - the last two commentators give good advice for when turning up @ Court. Apologies and humility go much further than excuses and justifications for (wrong) actions and do take a cheque book with you.
Depending on the exact speed at which you were clocked and if you are summonsed to Court, you might want to hire a Solicitor to reppare your defence - not to get you 'off' but to put your mitigating corcumstances before the Court so that you do not loose your licence. But in any event, there is a LOT of good advice given here, especially in the last two posts. You would be advised to heed their advice.
On the oterhand, you might be lucky and not have been clocked and this should serve as a warning to you for the future, since you usually do obey the speedlimits and you will now stick to them rigidly. Good luck.
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Im not plain stupid, just a special kind of stoopid.
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I am new here and really need some advice.
As you've had that advice, I'm locking this thread before emotions run higher than they already have.
I am really scared as my car is my life and I couldnt live without it in all honesty.
And this is most likely the reason for the high emotions and personal comments made toward you. If your car is your life and you couldn't live without it, then don't speed - whatever the circumstances - which in this case wasn't exactly an emergency.
DD.
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