Agree with Michael - a man of good taste (after all he does drive a Ford ;-))
They're not as big as you think, boot space wise and you cannot, get an Impreza with no turbo. It's the law!
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Adam
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It's not an estate, its a hatchback. This might sound pedantic but if you want an estate you presumably want space and the Impreza Wagon does not really offer this. Plus it's woefully slow.
Why do people say these things? Have you ever driven one or even sat inside one? At least you didn't say 'boring' which is what most people say when giving comment about a Japanese car (presumably they mean 'boringly reliable').
I haven't driven the latest ('03-on ?) Imprezza, but I have driven an '02 Imprezza 2.0GX sallon. It was certainly not 'woefully slow' - they have a sub-10 second 0-60 time and will do over 125mph (although I didn't check that). Nothing like as fast as the WRX, and not a sports car of course, but faster than, say, a 1.8 Focus which would be its competition, and great fun to drive. Faster and more fun than any number of Pug/Cit/Renault sheds.
Compared against a Focus 1.8 Estate it would be a reasonably roomy and quite stylish (IMHO) car, especically if you live in a hilly/rural area. Only negative point in my book would be heavier fuel use. If you needs lots of room then look at a Legacy Estate.
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and so say all of us
parts are more expensive, but they are more reliable, and as long as you are owning it during its warranty period thats not really an issue
rather have one than a focus or some such rubbish
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Come on chaps, let's be reasonable!
"woefully slow." With 125BHP? SWMBO has a Xantia with 110 bhp. Seems quick enough to me. How much of your driving time do you use burning rubber and needing sub 10sec 0-60 time?
"Cit/Renault sheds." Why sheds? We have 3 Cits and a Ren in the household and have owned several varieties of "sheds" for many years. They have been admirably reliable and have served the purpose for which we buy them perfectly. OK they are not as well built as a Merc(??) or a VW(??) or a BMW Compact(????) but that's reflected in the price. I don't expect my Matsui radio cassette player to be as well built as my Technics one but it cost a lot less and it is perfect for what I use it for (Terry Wogan anyone?).
"focus or some such rubbish" I don't particularly like Focii, and I'd probably never buy one (certainly not a booted one in Harvest Gold!!) but on what basis are they rubbish?
I don't like the way Subarus look, I can't understand why people think they look good but I don't expect everyone to agree!
Surely reasonably factual advice (perhaps with evidence to show they are "woefully slow") could be offered without the associated insults?
Phil
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it is woefully slow. Your wifes Xantia is probably an HDi 110 - only 110bhp but it does have over 200lb/ft of torque so its pretty rapid. Quicker than an Impreza automatic, certainly.
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Wow really?? you mean I could burn off an Imprezza? (Don't go in for that sort of thing normally, " mind my tyres", she'd say, and I'd probably choose a WRX (?) to try it against!) Go Xantia diesel!!
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I think you'd probably 'have' the manual version of the 2.0 Impreza (The 'Sport' is only 114bhp) as well.
I had a 1.9TD Xantia with the 92bhp old school XUTD engine. Whilst the 0-60 time of 11.6 seconds was nothing to shout about, it could shift when you had it on boost. The HDi 110 is even better :) Great cars.
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To be fair he was talking about the auto, it is slower than the manual.
But definatly an interesting choice. Don't know about the auto box on these - how are they?
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>>"focus or some such rubbish" I don't particularly like Focii, and I'd probably never buy one (certainly not a booted one in Harvest Gold!!) but on what basis are they rubbish?<<
Woah woah woah!!! What have I done wrong?? I simply stated they weren't as roomy in the back as you think! ;-)
Incidently, a Focus and an Impreza are hardly same money are they. Bit of an unfair comparison.
I found the Fiesta 1.6 Zetec somewhat more lacking in performance against the RR Vogue.
;-)
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Adam
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"Incidently, a Focus and an Impreza are hardly same money are they. Bit of an unfair comparison."
That was my point Ad (along with a quiet dig at you!!!) - and Focii certainly aren't rubbish from what I have read (well except for beige ones with a boot!!).
Incidentally, my car is a beautiful Sahara Gold (OK, beige according to the V5!!)
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>>Incidentally, my car is a beautiful Sahara Gold (OK, beige according to the V5!!)<<
Neh neh - you drive a gold car...oh wait - pot, kettle, and er...Gold.
;-)
I agreed with your post Phil - just felt I should at least defend my poor car...which I'm going to stop doing now!
How come on your V5 it's beige yet on mine it's down as gold?
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Adam
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"How come on your V5 it's beige yet on mine it's down as gold?"
Don't know! Who fills in the details on the original V5? Do details come from manufacture or some bloke at the dealer's who has a quick glance? Seem to remember a thread on here recently that said colour was often wrong/inaccurate.
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Oh yeah - I seem to remember it being the dealer putting the colour down but you'd think gold instead of beige wouldn't you?
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Adam
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Blimey, I've started something here!
I'm trying to stick to something japanese for the usual reasons. I've looked at a Nissan Tino, but they're a 1.8 with 115hp, and the same with the Primera. The fuel consumption is about the same as the Subaru. I've got a Honda Shuttle at the moment which is a bigger than I really need, but it does have 150hp with auto and I get about 29mpg. Ideally I'd like a diesel auto, but not many companies do these. I've also considered a Zafira, but again the petrol is 125hp and the diesel is only 100hp. To be honest, comparing fuel consumption figures for petrol and diesel autos, bearing in mind the diesels/autos usually have a higher lease price, and diesel is more expensive per gallon, there's usually not much in it.
The most suitable seems to be the Honda Stream 5 speed auto with 160hp and a reasonable amount of room. But the lease prices for these are much higher than for something like a Civic Type R that has a similar list price. It seems you can only get a good lease price on the less desirable stuff, or the popular (big discount) stuff.
I spoke to the sort-of-local Subaru dealer (there aren't many around!) today and they offered me a 24hr test drive so I may do that next week.
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Go for the test drive, Dave.
Those who are critical of the non-turbo Imprezza have likely never driven one. They are beautifully engineered (engine transmission etc.) and fast enough for the family owner. I've not driven an auto Imprezza (have driven auto Legacy - and they are good). The auto will be a bit slower than the manual I drove.
IMHO the non-turbo *is as much fun* as the turbo. An odd statement, I know, but although the acceleration is slower you'll find that on a winding road at speed you get all the handling attributes of the turbo model. Moreover it is a bit too easy to get into trouble in the turbo, whereas in the non-turbo you are operating well within the chassis 'comfort zone' and there is more of a margin of error.
Subarus are very underrated cars, and a non-turbo Imprezza is not that much different in (list) price to a Focus, although you may get more of a discount on a Focus.
I may well consider a Subaru for my next car - the one thing that puts me off is the depreciation.
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Here speaks the voice of experience.
The Forester is the same mechanically as the Impreza. We have a 1999 Auto (non-Turbo) and a 2003 Turbo Auto in our family. I have also test driven a 2003 Impreze Auto - non Turbo. So.....
All are thirsty unless cruising on the motorway.
All are very comfortable, with a good ride and nice not too low profile tyres. Engines are very smooth with what appears to be a good amount of torque and the non-turbo Forester with poorer aerodynamics than an Impreza is certainly quick enough for me even though I drive the turbo one.
The latest models have a reasonable interior, although the Impreza seemed to lack some nice features of the Turbo, but the auto gate is very Merc like but even easier to use. The Impreza hatchback is probably similar to the Forester to drive although the Forester is higher which I prefer and has a larger boot I suspect.
So far all have been very reliable but make sure you get a decent service dealer, preferably one of the non-sales outlets like the one in Heaton Mersey near Stockport which is Subaru approved.
We like ours for the combination of reliablity, comfort and being slightly left-field in a sea of conformatiy. As we don't do huge milages the poor economy doesn't hurt too mcuh and is a price worth paying for great traction on slippery roads. During the snow in the north over Christmas, the cars felt very secure and the 4wd was able to pull/push us around corners at normal speeds which in a normal car would have had us off the road.
Enjoy!!
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Espada III - well if you have a family and need a Lamborghini, what else do you drive?
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I have driven an Impreza Turbo, non turbo and a 2.0 auto and 2.5 auto Legacy.
I dislike the Impreza turbo bonnet scoop but like the 2.0 looks. IIRC the auto is smooth but not a ball of fire: but certainly not slow. Great handling.
But I would not buy new (depreciation) altho' there are good s/h bargains. And if you do lots of town work fuel consumption can be low 20s - if you drive hardish.
Seats are comfortable but servicing costs can be high.
For: handling, smooth, cheaper s/h, reliability
Against: fuel cosnumtion, servicing costs.
madf
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Couple of sensible posts there.
Its just the depreciation that would put me off - plus servicing is expensive. I was once asked to change a timing belt on one (every 40k). I looked in Autodata and declined! Its a *long* belt and a very tedious job. I think the dealers probably charge about £500. I also had to swap a torque splitter on one. A new unit was over £1000! Even s/hand was over £500. Dread to think of cost of an auto transmission rebuild on an out-of-warranty Subaru. They make their own autos and they're unique.
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** UPDATE **
I had a good long test drive, and it wasn't too bad really. Performance was OK, but nothing to write home about. Guess you really need the turbos. The main problem I had was the lack of rear space, especially the lack of depth in the rear. I guess I've been spoiled with the Shuttle as I've lifted out the middle row of seats so I can get at my stuff real easy. The lack of factory cruise control also put me off a little as I find it quite handy, and no arm rest on the front seats. Also, dealers are few and far between, and warranty only 60K (I do about 30K/year).
I tried a few others, so here's a precis:-
Honda Stream - nice and powerful (160hp) but can't remove the seats, so space limited and fairly shallow. No cruise option, very expensive to lease even through list price not much higher than other options.
Nissan Tino - Not much power (115hp), reasonable space.
So you know what? I'm going to keep the Shuttle! 150hp, plenty of spare space, cruise, front arm rests, space to mount the Satnav screen and speed trap screen without them having to stand right on top of the dash, rear windows already tinted, bluetooth phone kit already fitted, Cat 1 alarm already fitted, space for a fridge between the front seats, I can do all the maintenance myself without worrying about warranty issues or the need of a supercomputer to diagnose problems, and above all, it's brought and paid for. I'm also not commited to it for 3 years in case my needs change.
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Aye - the best and cheapest car is often the one you've already got!
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Couple of sensible posts there. Its just the depreciation that would put me off - plus servicing is expensive. I was once asked to change a timing belt on one (every 40k). I looked in Autodata and declined! Its a *long* belt and a very tedious job. I think the dealers probably charge about £500.
I'm having the cambelt changed on my legacy 2 litre (single cam per bank) by Subaru. They've quoted £210 inc vat and say it is very rare that any tensioners or idlers need changing. Not too bad but dear by Ford standards but then it's not built to Ford standards.
The exhaust back box, which I'll need soon, is an eye-watering £168 plus vat just for the part but I'll fit it myself. Doesn't seem to be available as a pattern either. Anyone know where I could get one cheaper?
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I'm having the cambelt changed on my legacy 2 litre (single cam per bank) by Subaru. They've quoted £210 inc vat and say it is very rare that any tensioners or idlers need changing. Not too bad but dear by Ford standards but then it's not built to Ford standards. The exhaust back box, which I'll need soon, is an eye-watering £168 plus vat just for the part but I'll fit it myself. Doesn't seem to be available as a pattern either. Anyone know where I could get one cheaper?
Your quoted price is very reasonable. I think its a two hour job "by the book", although it would take me a lot longer.
Ideally the radiator should come out (so a good time to flush and replace coolant) - I suspect dealer mechanics would try to take a short cut and leave it in place (check for any 'dents' in the back of the radiator when you get it back!). Would be a good time to renew alternator and PAS/AC belts too. The timing belt alone costs about £70, I think.
There is a tensioner wheel on the top of the belt run, just to the right of centre. Persoanlly I would renew it. There is an associated tensioning plunger that should be checked - its dear if you need a new one (about £150).
For your exhaust box try calling these people:
www.buypartsby.co.uk
Parts Direct in Derby.
Blueprint might also do exhuasts, but I've never found them particularly cheap.
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Thanks for the info, Aprilia.
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Subarus are very 'exotic' in comparison to the rest of the car market as they all have AWD and a Boxer engine.
The only other company who uses the same philosohy is Porsche. All their cars are slight variations of one model making them almost faultless.
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