Hi Count, nice to hear from you, and I hope you enjoy the new job.
I hope you don't mind me asking a question. As one of the BackRoom's few regular bus-users, one thing which has begun to really irritate me is a decline in one bit of driving standards of bus drivers: braking.
An increasing number of bus drivers seem not to bother with smooth, progressive braking. Sometimes every stop ends in a jerky jolt, because the brakes haven't been eased as the bus nears a halt. Some journeys are made horribly uncomfortable, and earlier in the summer I got thrown down the stairs on a London bus.
So my question is whether they train drivers how important is to brake smoothly, and how to do it?
Otherwise, I think buses are generally pretty good, tho not double-deckers -- the stairs are too dangerous, and I much prefer the lovely new bendy buses.
My biggest gripe with buses is that there are not enough of them. London buses are reasonably frequent, but in the rest of the country they are pretty patchy. My local service declines to 30-minute intervals after 6pm on weekdays, and for most of saturday and sunday.
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No Wheels has mentioned my main gripe with buses: the drivers must think they're in a Ferrari and drive accordingly! Corners are taken far too fast for passenger comfort and the resulting speed means they have to brake very hard for other traffic or bus stops. It's like being in a car with a 17 year old boy driving - absolutely on the ragged edge at all times.
Maybe it's the bus timetables which are too tight to drive "properly" or maybe it's to relieve the boredom, but it makes for a very unpleasant journey and sometimes I wish for seat belts and a racing car rollbar inside!
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Hello NoWheels and Garethj,
I agree that some drivers seem to take great pleasure in the 'kangaroo' method of driving.
In their defence, though, some buses are fitted with retarders which work in conjunction with the brakes. Sometimes these can malfunction or be set up incorrectly meaning that too much assistance is given, leading to the perception that the driver is standing on the brakes.
When I was training, my instructor told me that in the vast majority of modern buses the brakes are so sensitive that it is often enough to simply place your foot on the brake pedal and clench your toes. This sounds mad, but it actually works and I am able to bring an eleven ton (sixteen ton if it is full) single decker to a smooth halt from 56 mph. I reckon that the bus drivers who brake sharply simply can't be bothered to make the extra effort. Shame really as they give those of us who take pride in the job a bad name.
TC
--
One a-ha-ha, two a-ha-ha, I love to count a-ha-ha-ha-ha!
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Harsh braking is totally in my opinion down to the driver. Basically its down to whether the driver can be bothered to plan ahead and brake gently. The best drivers are those who use the brakes as little as possible, adjusting the throttle to the road conditions. If a bus does have bad brakes - like some older darts or if the retarder is erratic in operation, the trick is use the brakes as infrequently as possible through good road planning.
The coach I drive has very smooth brakes compared with the buses we have. But even when I drive buses, which I did yesterday to help out, I'm complemented on a smooth ride in a bus whose brakes, were very fiddly to use.
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OK, I *might* buy the story about brakes being down to misadjustment but what about the cornering that produces enough body roll to slide passengers out of their seats?
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earlier in the summer I got thrown down the stairs on a London bus.
Sorry to hear that, NoWheels. I trust you're better now?
Apparently, when I was tiny I was being carried down the stairs by "Mummy patently" when the same happened. Blood everywhere - but the driver wouldn't help. I had to be taken to casualty for a head x-ray, so now every medical questionnaire that asks if I've had a head x-ray has to be told the saga.
[never been the same since! ;-) ]
Anyway, buses - my happen'orth.
I detest them. My reason for doing so has changed over the years, though.
As a teenager, I had to catch the bus to school. The drivers clearly hated us (can't imagine why...) and would blatantly lie to us, claiming that there weren't any seats left when there clearly were. Or they would just drive past. Now, when you're 11, the snow is three feet deep*, your shoes leak, the next bus is not for half an hour, and you have no form of sustenance or warmth, the feeling starts to become mutual.
Later, as a adult, I started to see things from the point of view of the driver (a bit). I now detest buses for two different reasons instead.
(i) The nature of the company that you are likely to have during your journey. See many posts above....
(ii) The utter and complete idiocy of the management. I simply do not understand why bus operators are completely incapable of putting buses on routes that people want to travel. Wherever I am going, the bus route seems always to be at 90 degrees! And, when there is a suitable service, it takes great detours around every little byway to prevent people from having to walk 100 yards to the stop - for this it adds 10-15 minutes to the journey.
An example: there was a bus service to the Verulamium estate in St Albans. The operator said they wanted to stop it because it was uneconomic. Of course it was; the bus was every two hours and the first one left at 10:30 am. Thus, it manages to be completely useless whether you want to go to work or the shops!
The fact that there were regular traffic jams between Verulamium and the town centre seemed to completely pass them by.... oh really.
Yet, amazingly, every bus that I get stuck behind seems to be empty! How do they do it? Perhaps if they stayed at home their service would run better?
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*No, I'm not kidding.
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Sorry to hear that, NoWheels. I trust you're better now?
Thanks! I mostly landed on top of my suitcase, so my only injuries were a few bruises and a sore tongue (from when I bit it to avoid doing a fishmonger's wife exercise at the bus driver).
Thing was, at the start of the same journey, I had been thrown over shortly after boarding when the driver accelerated away like a Nova-driver, so I was kinda unamused. When I got home next day, I called London Buses to complain, and they confessed that it was a problem which was getting worse.
The man there (a former driver) explained that recruitment and training was now all done by the bus companies, who have difficulty recruiting staff because they pay poor wages, so standards were slipping. London Buses are apparently rather depressed about it all, but can't do anything.
Apparently, when I was tiny I was being carried down the stairs by "Mummy patently" when the same happened.
Sorry to hear thta, it sounds v nasty.
[never been the same since! ;-) ]
My parents say I was never the same beforehand, so you're doing better than me :)
As a teenager, I had to catch the bus to school. The drivers clearly hated us (can't imagine why...)
I was on the bus yesterday when the teenagers boarded. I rather wish that driver had told them there were no seats left!
Now, when you're 11, the snow is three feet deep*, your shoes leak, the next bus is not for half an hour, and you have no form of sustenance or warmth, the feeling starts to become mutual.
A bit of suffering is good for your soul ;-)
Anyway, when I were a lass, bus were luxury ...
(i) The nature of the company that you are likely to have during your journey. See many posts above....
Apart from feral teenagers, I don't mind the company too much. A few unpleasant folks, but mostly just people, some of em surprisingly nice. But then I like meeting lottsa difft sorts of ppl, which not everyone does
(ii) The utter and complete idiocy of the management. I simply do not understand why bus operators are completely incapable of putting buses on routes that people want to travel.
It's so widespread that I think there must be a management training programme to achieve this :(
It's got worse since privatisation: my area has lost several very useful bus routes, to be replaced with useless ones. Wish I could understand exactly why :(
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Back to the \"Bad braking\" argument.
I am sorry to contradict anyone but a lot of the buses I drive have ridiculously sensitive brakes, just tap them and you end up sending punters flying.
And yes, the drivers report this and as usual nothing at all is done to rectify the fault as doing so will indirectly cost the shareholders (gods in the eyes of my employer) money.
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As a recently ex-bus driver of 10 years I completely agree with Miller and others on the fact that some buses have ridiculously sensitive brakes.
On the opposite side of things some buses have brakes which require a lot of foot pressure for not a lot of braking.
PP
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I should also concede that some bus drivers couldn't care less how they drive with regard to passenger comfort.
PP
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As a recently ex-bus driver of 10 years I completely agree with Miller and others on the fact that some buses have ridiculously sensitive brakes. On the opposite side of things some buses have brakes which require a lot of foot pressure for not a lot of braking.
This is all true, but when driving a vehicle with sensitive brakes, isn't it possible to drive in such a way which minimises the effect? (see my post above)
When I drive buses occasionally although I have been type trained on them, it takes me a little while to get used to the brake (and the accelerator come to think of it) but after a few minutes things are okay.
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This is all true, but when driving a vehicle with sensitive brakes, isn't it possible to drive in such a way which minimises the effect? (see my post above)
What London Buses told me is that too many of the bus companies are skimping on the training, because they are trying to get drivers out on the road ASAP ... and that they remain so short of drivers that they don't take drivers away for retraining if they use the brakes as an on/off switch :(
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>> When I drive buses occasionally although I have been type trainedon them, it takes me a little while to get used to the brake (and the accelerator come to think of it) but after a few minutes things are okay.
Same applies for any vehicle that you're not used to driving.
I'm talking about vehicles with either badly set up brakes or retarders which the driver cannot compensate for however hard he/she tries.
PP
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I am sorry to contradict anyone but a lot of the buses I drive have ridiculously sensitive brakes, just tap them and you end up sending punters flying.
I get the impression that the latest generation of London double-deckers (the ones with the curved bottom edge to the front window) have this prob. They all seem to jerk to a halt
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Anyway, when I were a lass, bus were luxury ...
Good heavens they have gone downhill then.
I remember what they were like in the 80s; if that was luxury by todays standards then what happens now???
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