SWMBO has a 1litre Yaris just over two years old which she has owned for just over a year, just serviced last month.
I noticed when I picked it up from the garage that in reverse there was a slight whine but not driving it regularly I was not concerned.
The missis has now remarked that it is getting more noticeable particularly when the steering is on a tight lock.
It is still in warranty and going back to the garage on Thursday for a check but I wonder if you experts out there can give any suggestions before I take it in.
I am concerned that it may be a clutch problem which is not under warranty. I am however aware from the service history that it had a clutch replaced before we bought it in Nov.2002 and would then argue that a clutch a year is not really acceptable.
Any thoughts?
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I would expect a whine on full lock indicates the power steering is under load and is normal.
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Update today is that the fault is indeed the clutch and a replacement is being supplied and fitted under warranty.I have no quibble with the way I was treated by the dealer - very apologetic.
When I pointed out to the service manager that the clutch had been renewed in Nov.2002 and thatI was concerned that the car was going through a clutch a year he advised me that the problem was with 'the rivets on the clutch cover ' and that it was a known fault. He advised that the clutch cover design has been modified on later models but will the new clutch be to the amended design I wonder?.
Over to you folks - Is it a known fault and has it been modified? I dont want to face the same situation a year down the line when the car is out of warranty although I have to say the service manager of the local dealer would I think play fair if it did happen.
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Another Update -
Today the wifes Yaris was returned to me at work complete with new clutch ,washed, valeted looking good ,all done free of charge under warranty.
One slight problem - the noise is still there.
So it went straight back to the dealer whose mechanic came out with me and confirmed that the problem had not been cured.
They are now speaking to Toyota as the clutch replacement was a new one designed to cure the known problem. As it hasn't its back to square one.
HJ please note that this is a problem which appears well known to Toyota which they are trying to cure but which is apparently not being publicised as the mechanic had a strictly private and confidential memo from Toyota about it detailing the symptoms and proposed cure.
A sqwauking noise or resonance in 1st , 2nd and reverse gear is very noticable particularly when cold.
It may well be worth publicising this to other Yaris owners on the car by car breakdown before they possibly fork out for a new clutch.
I have to say that at the moment I have nothing but praise for the dealer and I am sure the problem will be sorted but when?
I'll keep you posted.
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I was very interested to read of your reverse gear whine issue. My 18 month Yaris 1.3 has a really loud whine in reverse and also slight clutch judder. Forward gears all OK. The local Toyota station has diagnosed gearbox problems and the car goes in tomorrow to be sorted, hopefully all under warranty. I understand from speaking to the Toyota transmission expert, that the gearbox oil can be easily changed. Have you had that done? It made a tremendous difference to the gear change and quietness of my Wife's 4 x 4.
Please keep us posted and I will do the same!
Jaytee
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Jaytee - The wifes Yaris is the 1 litre but the whine is definitely more noticeable in reverse and when the engine is cold.
We don't appear to have a problem with clutch judder but when I was talking with the dealers mechanic and reading the private and confidential memo to them from Toyota it was stated that the setting of the clutch pedal had an effect on the noise.
It appears that it is a definite clutch rather than gearbox problem because they had all sorts of graphs where they had measured the resonance at different setings etc.
The gearbox oil presumably must have been changed because the gearbox has to come out to fix the clutch.
I have to say I'm glad its a Toyota as there has been no quibble whatsoever about repair under warranty.
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Hi there Helicopter,
I took the Yaris in today for its reverse gear whine to be sorted. The loan car given to me is a '03' Yaris D-4D which has no whine or meshy gear noise at all in reverse. The clutch is also very light and progressive, unlke the sudden 'all-in or all-out' as it is with my car at the moment. If my problem was clutch related noise, I do not understand why it only affects reverse gear and not 1st or 2nd in forwards. I sure have a clutch problem, but will await the findings and performance when my car is returned. HJ et. al. rave about the Yaris D-4D and it probably has better mpg, but its hellishly noisy underway and doesn't seem to be a patch on my CDX
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On most cars the reverse gear is noisier than forward gears. This is because generally (although not always) the reverse gear train is of a fairly primitive design. The rationale behind this is that reverse is only used over very short distances and refinement is therefore subservient to cost.
Typically 'straight cut' gears are used and an 'idler' gear is used to engage reverse.
You can really hear this is you get the car rolling backwards and then dip the clutch to take the load of the geartrain. The gears will 'chatter' and you'll get quite a whine, often very cyclical. None of this is necessarily a cause for concern.
Some cars have more sophisticated reverse geartrain with synchromesh and these are generally much quieter.
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Aprilia - The operation of the reverse was explained to me at some length by the mechanic who replaced the clutch and what he said tied in with what you say above.
However this is more than a normal noise and was described in the Toyota memo to dealers as a sqwauk causing a noticable vibration or resonance.
Whatever the cause of the problem Toyota must have had a fair number of complaints about it because the memo was three or four detailed pages of symptoms, graphs and recommendations as to new clutch part numbers , clutch pedal settings etc and IMO you don't go to the amount of work which they had obviously put in without cause.
They marked this strictly private and confidential - why do this if it is not considered a serious problem which they do not want to be generally known? Although they apper to be playing fair with me at the moment IMO they may not want it broadcast and end up replacing thousands of clutches.
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JT - I spoke to the dealers today and they have sent the old clutch to Toyota for examination and report and they have promised to contact me and arrange a repair asap when Toyota have an answer to the problem.
I'm using the car today and the noise is virtually unnoticeable unless you know what to listen for but its still there and the dealer agrees its still there.
I didn't bother with a loan car as I have a company car and the wife has been using mine.
When it does go in I'm going to ask for a RAV4 with bull bars !
Let me know what they say when you get yours back.
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Just be careful what you post here ref this problem - it's potentially commercially sensitive information!
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Sounds like my Corolla noise..... does it happen in all the gears ?
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Further update.
The mechanic from the dealer rang me this morning to advise progress with Toyota UK and apparently the fact that the replacement clutch has not cured the problem has set alarm bells ringing.SWMBO's Yaris has started a major investigation.
They are examining the old clutch and will eventually want the replacement clutch for examination.This will obviously take a bit of time
I questioned him again at some length about the problem and tried to make notes.
He advised that it was definitely a clutch and not gearbox problem and that the gearbox oil had indeed been changed when he replaced the clutch.So JT / Aprilia that answers your questions.
It appears that the problem lies with the material of the original clutch plate resonating at a particular level which crosses at a similar resonance in the clutch pipes etc resulting in the reported noise.
The replacement clutch plate supposedly to cure the problem was of a different material which resonates at a different higher frequency inaudible to the human ear which also does not affect the rest of the clutch.
Does this mean that the Yaris will be chased by packs of dogs when the problem is cured!
I'll keep you posted.
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hmmm... noise sounds like mine, though mine's in all gears... might get good local garage to have a look....
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Arnold - How old is the Corolla ? If it is less than three years old then get your Toyata dealer to have a look as it should be fixed under warranty if it is the same problem.
Even if its over three years I feel sure that if your problem is a known fault then Toyota and their dealer will play fair on replacement or repair.Don't forget they want you back buying Toyota next time.
However as far as I am aware the problem is specific to the Yaris and is only noticed in reverse , first and second, particularly when cold.
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Helicopter,
My Yaris is still at the Dealers in bits and they are awaiting further parts from Toyota. They couldn't/wouldn't explain exactly what was on order, and I don't really care so long as all is fixed under warranty. The delay however, does seem to suggest it is more than replacing the clutch, although this is just my supposition.
Still do not like the D-4D. The CDX trim standard on my car makes comparison with the D-4D GS difficult and I can live with this until mine is ready. More later! - stay tuned!
Jaytee
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Helicopter,
Picked up my Yaris from the repair Dealership today. I had a chance to speak with the Mechanic who worked on the car and he said they replaced input and output mainshaft bearings and bearings on the reverse gear shaft. Also fitted a new clutch. No sign of the judder on the drive home and most of the reverse gear meshy/whine has gone. Whats left seems quite normal for a reverse gear on any car. Service Manager said cost was close to £1,000, so thank God for a good warranty.
As in your case, they cleaned the car and I too, cannot fault the warranty/Toyota service. I hope thats the end of my issues. Strange though, to have such problems after only 14500 miles.
Jaytee
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Jaytee - glad to hear your problems are cured.
The wifes Yaris has done just over 18000 miles at two years old and like yourself I am concerned that these sorts of problems with clutches and gear bearings are arising at a relatively young age in what are supposed to be supremely reliable cars.
I am waiting to see what Toyota come back to me with interest but what concerns me is what happens to the people who have not got warranties and who may end up with a large bill for a duff clutch.
I think you need to watch and make sure at the slightest indication of unusual clutch noise you have it back in the dealers.
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To be honest I think you were suffering gearbox bearing noise. I cannot understand how the clutch could be responsible for the noise - under normal driving the clutch is engaged and acts like a near-solid coupling. All parts would be rotating at the same speed - there is nothing to resonate.
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Glad they've sorted it out for you H. Sounds like you found the diesel noisy - care to expand on that experience? Drive my wifes 03 1.3 petrol Yaris occasionally. Sounded like a lorry today, in all fwd gears. Only 7000 miles. I've noticed it before but its not getting quieter. She hasn't mentioned it, and tho' I'm reluctant to spoil her enjoyment, I don't fancy a failure. Any views?
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Nortones2, Hope you are not in for the same Yaris gearbox/clutch issues that have afflicted both Helicopter and myself. My own Yaris 1.3petrol is an extremely quiet car withlittle noticeable noise in any forward gear. As you can see from the thread, I had gearbox bearing and clutch problems, all well defined in the thread, and now fully resolved with an excellent warranty service.
The loaner car given to me was a Yaris D-4D diesel which, although very responsive and economical, was very noisy in operation. The trim level was only a GS, so probably not as well insulated as my CDX. It confirmed my views on diesel cars, but thats another topic.
All I can advise is that, if your car sounds noisy, has any reverse gear excessive whine, has any forward gear knocking or unusual noise, get it back to a Toyota Dealer for close inspection. Your warranty is impeccable and the Dealer will handle the issue with total competence.
Jaytee
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Jaytee: its not what i would call quiet, so I my well take your advice. Re the diesel Yaris, we tried 2, and the engine seemed very quiet in both, given that I'd expect to hear it at tick-over. One example initially had a really raucous rattle at about 2500 - it was found to be an unsecured bit of pipework. Well, thats what they told us, and when fixed the example was fine. It had been used by an em'ee as a run-around. The noise didn't appear to have bothered her!
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Looks like my Rav4 D4D is whining too. I prefer to call it screeching. Almost two months gone and still no solution. Taking car back to dealer on Monday to have new flywheel fitted. Clutch assy and near side drive shaft already replaced. Problem elusive. Done 16000 miles. Car only 14 months old.
On reflection the screeching was always there but got progressively worst to the point of being annoying.
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Sorry to barge in here but I tell you what is really refreshing -
The attitude of the manufacturer and dealer.
Most of the others from Ford to VW and especially MB seem to avoid giving the customer satisfaction.
Recently put SWMBO Yaris 1.3CDX (Auto) in for 20,000 service. The car will be 3 years old in July.
I mentioned to the service writer that I was not happy the way the carpet had worn through on drivers section, particularly as we use Toyota overmats. (I really expected them to tell me to take a running jump) The whole interior carpet was replaced under warranty!!
Now then, that has probably cost Toyota £60 or so (guess), but they have one customer who will definitely buy Toyota again (me) AND I have told my friends and colleagues about this event and who knows if they will buy Toyota but I bet it is more effective than spending a zillion on TV advertising.
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I am just about to collect a Yaris 1.3CDX manual 60K, 4 years old with TFSH so all the above is good news on the main dealers.
There are very very few this 1.3 model around from car dealers. Perhaps it is so good they are kept?
I finished up with 180 mile round trip for this one.
Any hints or tips as I am totally new to Toyota?
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Henry
No - I have no special hints or tips at all, well apart from the fact you will be getting a manual so you need to be alert to the discussion on this thread wrt gearbox/clutch noise.
If yours is 4 years old it must be one of the first I suppose.
I really rate the Yaris as a town car (esp the auto) and it is my car of choice for these trips over my Merc. It is nippy, responsive and sticks to the road like a go kart - love it. You will be aware of the downside - a bit noisy for a long trip and limited lugggage space - but its horses for courses as they say.
I have found dealer service very reasonable cost wise too - I would not dare have my Merc serviced at a Main Dealer, I only have four limbs and I need all of them!!
Enjoy your Yaris.
NormanB
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Yes NormanB, I know what you mean. You can read in the thread the issues I have had and, at the moment touch wood, all seems to have been cured. My car was an import into the UK by a British serviceman, who bought the car new from a Toyota Dealer in Holland. When I took the car to my local Toyota dealer at the start of my gearbox issues, the warranty had not been transferred or the car put on the UK register. Rather than leave me to sort it all out, the dealer's Service Manager took copies of my documentation, telephoned with the Dutch dealer to get other details and had the warranty transferred to Toyota UK. Most other dealerships would not have bothered, I'm sure.
I think the service was superb and will certainly influence me when I come to change the car, or SWMBO's car in the future.
Jaytee
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Hi Guys, sure it is not the wife whining cos you are driviung her car all of the time!
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Just to update you on the original problem I spoke to the dealer today who advised that Toyota are back to the drawing board to try and devise a field fix for the original noise problem as the replacement clutch did not cure the problem.
They have asked for up to a month to investigate but the dealer has said if any problems crop up in the meantime to let them know.
The clutch operates OK with the slight whine and I am sure it will not fail and Toyota will be back with a cure.
It is very refreshing to have honest and straightforward answers from both dealer and manufacturer and I am quite happy to wait for them to contact me in a few weeks.
Oh and they gave us a free Toyota cleaning and valet kit as an apology for the inconvenience.
I will post again when I get an answer.
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This thread just goes to prove how a little customer care and thoughtfulness at a local level can keep customers happy even if there is a product quality issue.
One wonder what Fiats reputation would be with such attention to detail, or Renault, or ETC ETC..........
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