Guys,
Use the handbrake at traffic lights, please.
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And now my new one has Led's as the main brake lights they will blind you even more. Hahahah.
Seriously though I am now getting into the habit of putting the car in P whilst at lights so as to minimise the blinding effect to people behind me.
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I hope I'm not excluded from this discussion because I have a Volvo Automatic.
I've just passed my Advanced and they recommend puting the car in Neutral, Hand Brake on, straighten wheels, hands on steering wheel. That way if you're shunted from behind your foot won't slip off the brake, and you won't go so far. Park won't hold a car in a collision, I'm told it's just a locking pin. That said, I keep on eye on the mirrors and tap the brake pedal to warn motorists behind.
Further you don't blind motorist behind you. I'm sure they appreciate that courtesy.
WipeOut
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Marcos/Wipeout,
If you have autos with torque convertors - best to stay in DRIVE and apply the handbrake, even at long lights.
This causes less wear on your gearbox and saves the reverse light flashing as you come from Park to Drive.
Matt35.
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Matt35
Not to worry, but I did say Neutral and not Park, as that stops the Reverse lights coming on.
Unless you know otherwise I'm sure car auto gearbox can cope with going in to neutral?
Regards WipeOut
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Wipeout,
The gearbox can, of course,cope with going into Neutral, but the general consensus seems to be that less wear takes place by leaving it in Drive.
You are also a little bit better prepared to get moving if you need to get out of the way quickly?
I did notice that you said N and not P - in the RoSPA test, they look for you being in N at the start of the drive.
Matt35.
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Personally I don't find the brake lights a problem (until someone manges to replace the LED's with a row of those pen lasers) It's when the car's start rolling backwards that I get a little unnerved.....
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I'm with OP.
I've never noticed a problem. I don't even find it irritating never mind retina-searing.
Could I suggest that you stop staring into them and see if that helps.
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Brake lights never bother me either, just look at more appropriate things like mirrors and traffic signals.
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The intensity of brake lights is lessened somewhat if you're looking at them from well above eye-level behind the wheel of a big 4X4. Personally, I find it irritating, but it's a fairly minor example of the thoughtlessness that manifests itself in many more serious ways on the roads.
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high level brake lights can be a bit dazzling if your stuck behind them at lights, but if the drivers got their foot on the brake, it's irrelelvant whether they are driving manual or auto.
What is truly annoying is auto drivers who keep their foot on the brake when they are moving
Bora - what Bora ?
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Take my foot off the brake pedal at the lights?! Good point and something I do find annoying.
But how else are you supposed to check out the totty in the car behind in the dark?
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"What is truly annoying is auto drivers who keep their foot on the brake when they are moving"
Don't understand that. If you remove your foot entirely the creep will often be such that you would rapidly impact the car in front, when you are in a slow moving queue. You HAVE to keep your foot on the brake.
I suppose one could not move off until there was a wide gap, then release the brake, let the creep move you on and then brake again but then you'd get grumpy because I wasn't keeping up.
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Simple answer to this problem: Stop staring at the brake lights when the car in front has stopped!!! Why not look at the stereo in your car..or anything else instead????
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"But how else are you supposed to check out the totty in the car behind in the dark?"
Put your reversing lights on!
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Marcus please do not use park, Two very good reasons, When you go into drive you go through reverse and the guy behind has a hart attact and secondly if you are in park and god forbid some guy smacks into the back of you it would just be your rear thats bent but you auto box as well, Just use the handbrake. Regards Peter
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"Put your reversing lights on! "
Might cause facial distortion due to hysteria. I find totty is best observed in natural repose.
For those auto drivers who put their vehicle in "Park" at lights, anyone sat behind will know the effect that momentary reversing lights can have on your anxiety and buttock cheek tension.
Thanks to this column, in the dark hours of this morning I changed my usual pattern of driving and used my handbrake and "Neutral" whenever possible. Satisfied that I may have made a trivial difference to someone elses travelling comfort, I was surprised to find my usual long wait at a difficult junction cut short by a fine fellow who waved me out.
Reap and sow? Too soon to tell.
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I'll second that, Park is not a good idea at lights, as someone severely rear-end shunted on a motorway whilst stationary, the effect on the auto box was to completely destroy it.
Neutral and handbrake is best.
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PeterB
Automatics creep forward in drive if you take your feet off the pedals which is why we need to put the brakes on to control speed, particularly in slow moving traffic.
Makes parking, manouvering, ramps, and moving in slow traffic very easy!
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Mark,
'
"I'm with OP.
I've never noticed a problem. I don't even find it irritating never mind retina-searing.
Could I suggest that you stop staring into them and see if that helps."
It never bothered me either, when I was younger - want to swop eyes?
It is, of course, also a matter of courtesy and consideration to the punter behind - even if the plonker is sitting with headlights in your mirror.
Matt35.
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I'm rather starting this last night.
It was meant to be a slightly TIC way of letting of steam, but my concience was pricked tonight by a poster on another thread who said there had been too much abuse lately. That's a fair point and I'm sorry for causing offence.
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Mark, ' "I'm with OP. I've never noticed a problem. I don't even find it irritating never mind retina-searing. Could I suggest that you stop staring into them and see if that helps." It never bothered me either, when I was younger - want to swop eyes? It is, of course, also a matter of courtesy and consideration to the punter behind - even if the plonker is sitting with headlights in your mirror. Matt35.
It's also an offence under RVLR 1989 section III clause 27 item 11
fixed penalty £30
So folks who sit with the footbrake on stick that on your handbrake as a reminder!
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peterb:
Why not address that to 90% of people stopped at lights?
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peterb: Why not address that to 90% of people stopped at lights?
Exactly. As others have said it's not just drivers of particular cars and it's most definitely not confined to automatics. It's such a common bad habit as to be nearly universal. I recently read a letter in a magazine (whose title I'm embarrassed to mention) in which someone seriously suggested a device that turns off the brake lights after a few seconds. Such a device already exists and it's called correct use of the handbrake.
Unless I'm sadly mistaken, failing to use the handbrake is a serious enough offence to fail the driving test.
I'm only in my thirties, but I am dazzled by bright brake lights at night. You really can't avoid looking directly ahead. The problem is exacerbated because many cars have high brake lights (following the lead of the Punto and Focus) and most now have a central brake light that's usually made up of very bright LEDs.
For what it's worth, when I was learning to drive I was encouraged to wait with the handbrake on with my foot fully on the clutch and the gear in first, ready to move off. I suspect part of this was self-interest on the part of my instructor who was paranoid about rear collisions from drivers not checking that learners are actually moving off when expected.
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I'm glad someone finally posted to say this is a fixed penalty offence. It's also a lack of common courtesy.
And having just read the other Mercs/BMW thread, I'm leaving it there.
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At this time of the year when we are driving a lot in the dark, so many people seem to sit on the footbrake at traffic lights blinding the car behind with their brake lights.
Now, not all of these drive automatics and quite often they are doing this with the car pointing uphill.
My query is, how on earth do you pull away safely, uphill, by sliding your left foot over from brake to accelerator in these circumstances?
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Rant starts....
I can't believe you are asking this question. Do what everyone else should be doing - use the handbrake.
This really winds me up as it its soooooooooo inconsiderate. Hill starts used to be part of the driving test - obviously a skill soon forgotten (and I don't mean by you in particular, just 90% of the driving population).
Rant ends.
The technique is basically simple. When the traffic starts to move, put into first gear and release handbrake as clutch starts to bite, then continue to balance gradual transfer of drive with release of handbrake.
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I just don't get this blinding/dazzling business. A minor irritation, perhaps, but not blinding as oncoming headlights are. Is it something that affects those who wear spectacles much more than those without them?
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I couldn't agree more!
Driving on the motorway drives me nuts with stop/start conditions,anyway, and to have 3 balls of red light projected onto me everytime the car in front stops is really annoying.
What's more, the drivers are totally oblivious to everything - even flashing them with main beam doesn't have any effect.
I was always taught to put on the handbrake whenever the car was stationary for more than, say, 15 seconds, but it would seem I'm in the minority these days....
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As I pointed out when this came up last week I don't think brake lights are dazzling It's when the cars start rolling backwards that I get concerned.
To extend the point though how many of those that always put the handbrake on put their car into neutral as well? Also is it better for the clutch/gearbox to keep putting the car in neutral or to keep your foot on the pedal when in stop start queues?
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I would agree with your post, Civlian, except that how often are you actually stationary on a motorway for more than 15 seconds?
In my experience, start stop traffic is precisely that, start then stop every couple of seconds, so expecting people to use the handbrake every time is a bit much if you ask me. However much of the time motorways are level enough for the car not to roll, so i try not to sit on brake unless it is necessary to hold the car still.
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Fully agree about the handbrake on, out of gear routine Civlian. Just taught my daughter to drive, she passed, and I nagged the face off her about sitting in gear at the lights. It's just not a relaxed or safe position to be in when in gear. Taught my elder daughter the same , she told her friends and they thought it a good idea. Never seemed to have heard about it in their driving lessons.
By the way, my question was rhetorical, and with an auto box I wouldn't have that problem anyhow.
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I think doctorchris was asking a rhetorical question.
I do know what he is talking about-people sit on upward hills, foot on brake, then try and move away with a quick foot movement, usually ending up in rolling back followed by stalling of the car. What is so hard about using the handbrake (unless it is a MB with a foot operated handbrake, but that's another story).
The use of brakes whilst stopped at lights etc is an annoyance, as it just adds to the hassle of the evening journey home when you've had enough and feel a headache coming on.
Unless of course the person behind has front fog lights illuminated for no safe reason-then the "keeping on" of brake lights just makes you feel better.
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As I mentioned on the previous thread about this subject, (i.e. sitting in traffic with brake lights on) this is an offence which can incur a fixed penalty ticket £30 no points.
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Question: When should the handbrake be used?
Answer: Whenever the vehicle is stopped and there is time to apply and release the hendbrake.
So what do you think? About 5 or 10 seconds?
I've never understood drivers who sit with brake and clutch pedals depressed. It's tiring and causes more wear to the vehicle.
Re dazzling - not everyone has perfect vision. Mine is good, but as I age I find I am bothered more by bright lights at night. Have a thought for others if you are a 'foot on the brake pedal' driver. The same goes for misuse of fog lights.
Like so much poor driving it boils down to not having consideration for others, also known as bad manners. I blame the parents myself. It's not your fault you are bad mannered - it's the way they raised you. ;-)
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I have seen a new bus with LED light clusters, they change in intensity when the vehilcle stops to a quite accetable level, obviously buses are automatic, and dont have a handbrake as such.
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