Vauxhall Antara - Bought used car without warranty - Advice please

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Tue 28 Jul 2020 14:01
Vauxhall Antara - Bought used car without warranty - Advice please - Philip Morgan

I'm wondering if anybody can offer some advice, please. I bought a 2013 Vauxhall Antara 2.2 Exclusiv yesterday. I bought it without warranty, as it was a part-ex and unfortunately this particular dealership has a policy of no test drives, due to the current Covid-19 situation. The car has a full Vauxha service history and a great MOT history, as well as appearing physically looked after. Unfortunately, on the drive home I noticed excessive vibration in the car. After a bit of googling, I found that the dual mass flywheel is a common issue and creates this exact problem. As that's a big job and the part comes at a cost, it's an expensive fix.

Can anybody advise on where I stand as a consumer and if I have a right to return the vehicle? I've got it booked in on Friday for a check over at a local garage. Should I wait until I get their verdict before contacting the dealership, or is it best to contact them now? Do I even have a leg to stand on, as it is not under warranty and is 7 years old with 91k on the clock? Am I. Covered by the Consumer Rights Act 2015, or is it debatable because of these reasons?

Thank you.

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Tue 28 Jul 2020 14:11
Vauxhall Antara - Bought used car without warranty - Advice please - mcb100

Straight back to the supplying dealer for investigation/rectification/refund.

https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/consumer/buying-or-repairing-a-car/problems-with-a-used-car/

Edited by mcb100 on 28/07/2020 at 14:21

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Tue 28 Jul 2020 14:41
Vauxhall Antara - Bought used car without warranty - Advice please - Philip Morgan

Thank you for the reply. As it says at the link you supplied, could they not argue that it is 'wear and tear', as the car has done over 90k?

Should I wait for confirmation from a mechanic, or just get straight back in touch with dealership?

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Tue 28 Jul 2020 14:45
Vauxhall Antara - Bought used car without warranty - Advice please - mcb100

I'd be straight back there so no accusation can be made that your mechanic has in any way made it worse.

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Tue 28 Jul 2020 14:57
Vauxhall Antara - Bought used car without warranty - Advice please - badbusdriver

Thank you for the reply. As it says at the link you supplied, could they not argue that it is 'wear and tear', as the car has done over 90k?

Should I wait for confirmation from a mechanic, or just get straight back in touch with dealership?

That may be a viable argument if the symptoms did not show themselves immediately. What your post says to me is that the garage sold the car knowing the DMF was on its way out.

As an aside, my 2010 VW Caddy van (2.0 non turbo diesel) has been exhibiting the same symptoms for a couple of years. Hasn't got any worse and TBH only shows itself at idle.

Edited by badbusdriver on 28/07/2020 at 14:58

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Tue 28 Jul 2020 15:08
Vauxhall Antara - Bought used car without warranty - Advice please - mcb100

Same here with a DMF - we've had one grumbling away on a Scenic for the past four years. It'll fail one day, and the car gets left in a skip.

It's possible the dealer didn't know about it, they've brought it in from a previous owner who didn't disclose the fault, washed and polished it and put it on sale without driving it. Sometimes they get bitten.

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Tue 28 Jul 2020 18:08
Vauxhall Antara - Bought used car without warranty - Advice please - Andrew-T

The essential thing is to go back with the car ASAP. There's a good chance they were unaware of the fault, but you weren't given the chance to find out in a test drive. You may have to brazen it out.

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Tue 28 Jul 2020 18:18
Vauxhall Antara - Bought used car without warranty - Advice please - Avant

Agreed. You might have bought it without warranty but you are still protected by consumer law.

Hopefully you can get a refund and then go to another dealer who will let you have a test drive. It's perfectly possible to sanitise the controls of cars, and refusal to allow test drives is a cop-out.

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Fri 31 Jul 2020 14:08
Vauxhall Antara - Bought used car without warranty - Advice please - Philip Morgan

Agreed. You might have bought it without warranty but you are still protected by consumer law.

Hopefully you can get a refund and then go to another dealer who will let you have a test drive. It's perfectly possible to sanitise the controls of cars, and refusal to allow test drives is a cop-out.

Thanks for the advice. So there's a DPF filter issue and 1st and second gears have a little resistance when shifting. That's what I know of, but there could be even more issues.

The dealership is claiming they aren't liable as it's a trade sale, but Citizens Advice say otherwise. Does anybody have any past experience with this kind of thing?

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Fri 31 Jul 2020 14:20
Vauxhall Antara - Bought used car without warranty - Advice please - pd

It depends if you paid true "trade" price for it or proper retail. If you paid proper retail you should expect some backup but if you paid under market value you clearly have no right to expect the same experience.

Whilst Citizen's Advice is correct in that there is no true "trade" sale to a consumer the price and nature of the transaction do relate to your rights and what to expect.

It is down to what is defined as a "reasonable person" would expect. If it was £1500 cheaper than retail and sold on that basis I suspect a "reasonable" person would reasonably expect not much comeback. It is important to remember the legislation is designed to protect the seller from unreasonable demands as much as the other way round.

The fact that you did not test drive it may work in your favour as you did not get an opportunity to inspect the goods but equally they may just say you declined the offer.

You are also correct in that wear and tear is a factor. It all depends on how bad it is I guess, if it is driving then it is doing the basic job of being a car.

Edited by pd on 31/07/2020 at 14:21

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Fri 31 Jul 2020 14:38
Vauxhall Antara - Bought used car without warranty - Advice please - RT

My understanding is that the Consumer Rights Act 2015 makes dealers' statements like "trade sales" or "sold as seen" to be worthless when selling to a consumer, ie non-trader, regardless of the price paid - however the car's condition should be judged with regard to the price.

I suspect the OP is going to be given a hard time by this trader so getting some proper legal advice with a view to using the Small Claims Court would seem sensible.

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Fri 31 Jul 2020 15:59
Vauxhall Antara - Bought used car without warranty - Advice please - Philip Morgan

Thanks everyone. Any further advice is appreciated, but you've all been helpful.

In case anyone is interested in seeing what I'm dealing with, a friend of mine found this dealership review website and it makes for a horror show of a read. Search from low to high on the reviews:

www.cardealerreviews.co.uk/dealership/a1-ortos-veh...C

It goes without saying that I wouldn't have gone there had I seen this first. Autotrader reviews were good. Lesson learned.

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Fri 31 Jul 2020 18:10
Vauxhall Antara - Bought used car without warranty - Advice please - pd

In fairness not all the reviews are bad.

It is correct you can't simply stick a sign up saying "Trade" and think it makes any difference. However, if they are genuinely selling at trade price then that is a factor. What they can't do is sell at retail, stick up a sign and say "no comeback".

Wait until they actually take a position before assuming.

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Fri 31 Jul 2020 18:27
Vauxhall Antara - Bought used car without warranty - Advice please - Andrew-T

<< there's a DPF filter issue and 1st and second gears have a little resistance when shifting. That's what I know of, but there could be even more issues. >>

The car is 7 years old and has done 90K, and you say it seems to be in reasonable nick. If you got it at bargain price (did you?) and you get no joy from the seller (as seems possible) you might like to find out the cost of needed repairs. You may have not done too badly. Middle-aged cars can't always be faultless.

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Wed 5 Aug 2020 01:28
Vauxhall Antara - Bought used car without warranty - Advice please - Philip Morgan

So there's an update. The gear issue seems intermittent, so doesn't happen all the time and the DPF light went off, but vibration continued, so I took it to a Vauxhall main dealership for a diagnostic. It has a suspected collapsed flywheel as it has bearings in the bell housing and you can feel it through the clutch, there is a suspected rear differential issue (recommend new), due to clunking in reverse, especially whilst on full lock, and an oil leak from the front of engine.

We're talking £2000-£3000 worth of repairs, there. Oh and two bulbs are out, too. Not a big issue I know, but it's something else.

Im hoping they accept the refund request.

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Wed 5 Aug 2020 06:54
Vauxhall Antara - Bought used car without warranty - Advice please - joegrundy

Have a look at this official government publication:www.businesscompanion.info/sites/default/files/Car...f

In particular, note what it says about disclaimers - they should not be used and have no effect. Any vehicle sold must be of 'satisfactory quality' and 'fit for purpose' (taking into account age, etc.). Unrectified faults should be pointed out.

If you bought the car on HP/PCP the finance company - not the dealer - is entirely liable.

If you intend to reject the car, make sure you give formal written notice to the dealer or finance company within 30 days of purchase saying that you wish to exercise your rights under s.20, CRA 2015

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Wed 5 Aug 2020 09:26
Vauxhall Antara - Bought used car without warranty - Advice please - Andrew-T

Any vehicle sold must be of 'satisfactory quality' and 'fit for purpose' (taking into account age, etc.). Unrectified faults should be pointed out.

But this car is apparently a 'part-ex', and I would guess many traders would have limited idea of what faults it has. So a test drive is essential, and if one was refused, comeback should be worth trying. On the other hand the refusal may suggest that faults were suspected ....

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Wed 5 Aug 2020 10:15
Vauxhall Antara - Bought used car without warranty - Advice please - joegrundy

Any vehicle sold must be of 'satisfactory quality' and 'fit for purpose' (taking into account age, etc.). Unrectified faults should be pointed out.

But this car is apparently a 'part-ex', and I would guess many traders would have limited idea of what faults it has. So a test drive is essential, and if one was refused, comeback should be worth trying. On the other hand the refusal may suggest that faults were suspected ....

Agreed re test drive.

The 'part ex' is just another attempt at disclaimer and doesn't mean anything under consumer rights law - and could be seen as an attempt to mislead the buyer as to their rights.

This is what the official guide I linked to above says:

Checking the vehicle’s mechanical condition.

Make sure you have procedures in place for checking the condition of any vehicle you intend to sell to ensure it is safe, roadworthy and of satisfactory quality.

You should arrange for a qualified person to carry out a pre-sale inspection of vehicles to make sure that:• The vehicle is roadworthy and safe before being exposed for sale.• The vehicle is of ‘satisfactory quality’ such that it is fit for use on the road, in a condition which reflects its age and price, and is reliable.

Edited by joegrundy on 05/08/2020 at 10:16

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Wed 5 Aug 2020 11:10
Vauxhall Antara - Bought used car without warranty - Advice please - Terry W

I have sympathy for an individual has made a potentially costly mistake.

But to buy a car without a test drive, without a warranty, from a garage who have some/a lot of negative feedback, and on the basis of a slightly questionable "trade sale" is frankly stupid.

I hope the OP gets his money back or problems fixed - but this should be a lesson to us all!

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Wed 5 Aug 2020 12:32
Vauxhall Antara - Bought used car without warranty - Advice please - MGspannerman

“In fairness not all the reviews are bad”

how bad do they have to be then before you would consider them “bad”? You are not Donald Trump are you?

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Wed 5 Aug 2020 16:34
Vauxhall Antara - Bought used car without warranty - Advice please - pd

“In fairness not all the reviews are bad”

how bad do they have to be then before you would consider them “bad”? You are not Donald Trump are you?

The website rates then as "very good".If you read on beyond the first few there are many more good reviews than bad.

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Wed 5 Aug 2020 12:44
Vauxhall Antara - Bought used car without warranty - Advice please - Gibbo_Wirral

I agree. Nobody should be doing this. If you need an emergency runaround just get a cheap banger to see you over.

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Wed 5 Aug 2020 15:46
Vauxhall Antara - Bought used car without warranty - Advice please - Andrew-T

<< The 'part ex' is just another attempt at disclaimer and doesn't mean anything under consumer rights law >>

I think it's just a statement of fact, certainly no kind of 'disclaimer'. A car of this age will have been a part-ex somewhere - probably somewhere else - as most cars at this kind of dealer's will have come from auction. Little chance of the seller knowing anything much about its life, nor its faults unless they have test-driven it.

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Wed 5 Aug 2020 16:16
Vauxhall Antara - Bought used car without warranty - Advice please - badbusdriver

“In fairness not all the reviews are bad”

how bad do they have to be then before you would consider them “bad”? You are not Donald Trump are you?

The garage scores 4 out of 5 over 107 reviews, which is a decent enough result. And bear in mind the reviews on the link have been arranged from 'lowest to highest'. Swap that around and you will see a rather different picture.

www.cardealerreviews.co.uk/dealership/a1-ortos-veh...C

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Wed 5 Aug 2020 17:17
Vauxhall Antara - Bought used car without warranty - Advice please - joegrundy

<< The 'part ex' is just another attempt at disclaimer and doesn't mean anything under consumer rights law >>

I think it's just a statement of fact, certainly no kind of 'disclaimer'. A car of this age will have been a part-ex somewhere - probably somewhere else - as most cars at this kind of dealer's will have come from auction. Little chance of the seller knowing anything much about its life, nor its faults unless they have test-driven it.

I agree with you - but the OP said " I bought it without warranty, as it was a part-ex" which suggests that the two are linked. Was he told that by the dealer? Was the dealer suggesting he should have lower expectations because it was being sold as a p/x (whatever that implied)?

It is up to the dealer to satisfy himself as to the car's condition at the time he offers it for sale.

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