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Volvo V60 - Mad to buy a used diesel? - KBB

Hello all, I am looking at buying a 2nd hand V60 (the new model, post 2018) at some point in the next 6 months.

Current car is a petrol and the intention was to go for another petrol, however, looking on Autotrader, it appears that (like a lot of medium sized "premium" estate cars) diesels outnumber petrol by about 2 to 1. Would be an auto, though I think that is irrelevant to my question.

Thanks to the general rule of supply and demand coupled with the demonisation of diesel, it means that like for like, the diesel models are often more than £2k cheaper than the equivalent petrol. Coupled with the fact that the 2 petrol engines available are both 2.0 litre turbos with relatively poor mpg, the higher cost of the petrol starts adding up.

For example, I kept the car for 6 or 7 years and did about 8000miles/year I would probably be looking at least £3k extra cost over the period of ownership.

I appreciate that there may be future punitive charges on diesels, however, I am struggling to see how those charges could add up to that sort of amount given that I don't live near London or any city that is proposing to introduce a ULEZ type arrangement. The govt could increase VED for diesels across the board, but again, I can't see them making that too punitive given the pro-diesel rhetoric for a number of years. If we did need to drive into a ULEZ on occasion, we could always take my wife's car which is a petrol, or use public transport (shock horror). I'm not that bothered about residuals as I intend to keep the car for a number of years to the point where the resale value is in the hundreds.

My commute is short (about 15 miles each way) but is 90% motorway and I don't tend to do lots of short trips so I don't see DPF problems being a major worry.

What I'm not sure on are:

Increased servicing costs - do diesels actually cost more to service as a rule, or do they just have more to go wrong in terms of DPF, EGR valves etc?

Adblue - never having owned a diesel I have no idea if the cost of this would negate some of the fuel saving. How much adblue would one expect to get through driving around 8000-1000 miles/year? Variation in mileage as I don't know how many days I'm going to be in the office post COVID.

Anything else I've overlooked (apart from diesels sounding like a tractor)?

Volvo V60 - Mad to buy a used diesel? - badbusdriver

Your motorway useage may mean diesel is viable, that doesn't mean it is a great idea though.

Increased servicing costs - do diesels actually cost more to service as a rule, or do they just have more to go wrong in terms of DPF, EGR valves etc?

As to this, yes, in both cases.

(apart from diesels sounding like a tractor)?

Not neccessarily, depends on the individual car. Some diesels are perfectly refined, especially with 6 or more cylinders.

Personally, i'd consider other options, such as a hybrid. Maybe a Lexus?.

Volvo V60 - Mad to buy a used diesel? - RT

Based on my Touareg's Adblue consumption at 400 miles/litre, I'd expect a V60 to get 500-600 miles/litre as it's smaller/lighter..

Volvo V60 - Mad to buy a used diesel? - KBB

Based on my Touareg's Adblue consumption at 400 miles/litre, I'd expect a V60 to get 500-600 miles/litre as it's smaller/lighter..

How much is it per litre?

Volvo V60 - Mad to buy a used diesel? - RT

Based on my Touareg's Adblue consumption at 400 miles/litre, I'd expect a V60 to get 500-600 miles/litre as it's smaller/lighter..

How much is it per litre?

Varies considerably - I get 20 litres at a time from ebay, works out at 80p/litre - it's cheaper than that at truck stops with Adblue on a pump but much more in small quantities in supermarkets and car accessory shops.

Volvo V60 - Mad to buy a used diesel? - KBB

Your motorway useage may mean diesel is viable, that doesn't mean it is a great idea though.

Increased servicing costs - do diesels actually cost more to service as a rule, or do they just have more to go wrong in terms of DPF, EGR valves etc?

As to this, yes, in both cases.

(apart from diesels sounding like a tractor)?

Not neccessarily, depends on the individual car. Some diesels are perfectly refined, especially with 6 or more cylinders.

Personally, i'd consider other options, such as a hybrid. Maybe a Lexus?.

Thanks. Yes, you're right, there are some refined diesels but the reviews of the Volvo diesels suggest they are not in that camp!

I like the idea of a hybrid but I suspect that would cost me even more, given the higher cost to buy and I would worry about more expensive repairs out of warranty due to all the complex electrical gubbins. Also, the motorway miles are not going to be the optimal way to run it as that sort of speed would, I imagine, run the battery down much faster than town driving.

I've considered a Lexus but they don't seem to make an estate car any more and the IS200 is a bit small (coming from a Skoda Superb).

Before someone asks why I am looking to change; the Superb almost lives up to its name but, after having it for 2 years and trying every seating adjustment possible, I can't get my right leg/foot comfortable.

The reason I'm not buying yet is also to see what the new Octavia hybrid is like and if the seats are better (for me) than in the Superb.

Volvo V60 - Mad to buy a used diesel? - Engineer Andy

Note KBB that many people are getting rid of diesels not just because of changes to tax or ULEZs, but because many, especially those equipped with DPFs, etc, are at the age that any usage-related problems start showing up.

You may well have a driving pattern that will not give any further problems, but as you're buying second hand, can you 100% guarantee any previous owner(s) did not do a lot of short trips from cold, and are offloading the car before some expensive issue(s) appear?

You're already paying a premium for a Volvo anyway - why not consider something less 'upmarket' (how 'posh' the car is, not the quality of its engineering) that is either cheaper for the same age (especially if it's a petrol engined car) or a slightly newer car for the same money?

The Honda Civic diesel be worth a look for size and as a generally reliable engine. I'm not so keen on the styling, but that's subjective, and the car has a decent sized boot. The last of the Skoda Octavia 1.4TSi (150PS) would be also a worthy car, especially with its equally huge boot. Both would also be good on fuel.

It really depends on how lucky you are owning a second-hand diesel engined car, even over a shorter period. It could be great with no problems, or be no end of trouble because of how it was driven previously. Because of the extra emissions control systems, maintenance WILL be higher over the longer term - by how much depends on its previous life as much as in your hands.

I'd stick to a petrol car for the likely annual mileages you're going to be doing.

Volvo V60 - Mad to buy a used diesel? - KBB

Note KBB that many people are getting rid of diesels not just because of changes to tax or ULEZs, but because many, especially those equipped with DPFs, etc, are at the age that any usage-related problems start showing up.

You may well have a driving pattern that will not give any further problems, but as you're buying second hand, can you 100% guarantee any previous owner(s) did not do a lot of short trips from cold, and are offloading the car before some expensive issue(s) appear?

You're already paying a premium for a Volvo anyway - why not consider something less 'upmarket' (how 'posh' the car is, not the quality of its engineering) that is either cheaper for the same age (especially if it's a petrol engined car) or a slightly newer car for the same money?

The Honda Civic diesel be worth a look for size and as a generally reliable engine. I'm not so keen on the styling, but that's subjective, and the car has a decent sized boot. The last of the Skoda Octavia 1.4TSi (150PS) would be also a worthy car, especially with its equally huge boot. Both would also be good on fuel.

It really depends on how lucky you are owning a second-hand diesel engined car, even over a shorter period. It could be great with no problems, or be no end of trouble because of how it was driven previously. Because of the extra emissions control systems, maintenance WILL be higher over the longer term - by how much depends on its previous life as much as in your hands.

I'd stick to a petrol car for the likely annual mileages you're going to be doing.

Yes, that is the worry of buying 2nd hand and I suppose buying something at 2 years old and low mileage could actually be a worse bet than average or high mileage as the lower mileage car may have just pottered around town and never got up to speed for any decent amount of time.

I'm not a badge snob but I do think the V60 (well, pretty much everything Volvo are producing at the moment) is a really good looking car with what appears to be a lovely interior and whilst I am very impressed with the interior and the refinement of the Superb I have read a few comments from people who have made the same switch and have said that the Volvo is in a different league in terms of better interior quality, low ride noise etc. Or maybe they are just telling themselves that since they've spent so much cash on it...

I have the 1.4 TSI in the Superb and it is a great engine, has enough power (for me) even in something the size of the Superb and I get about 46mpg over a tank with the mostly motoroway miles but as I said in my reply that just co-incided with yours, I just can't get comfy. It's actually OK on longer journeys as I can put on the CC, but around town when I am regularly on and off the pedals, it is worse.

I may have a look at the Civic but I share your view on the styling. The new Corolla looks decent but seems expensive and the infotainment looks crap.

As I said, I'm also holding out for new Octavia once that is properly released and not just the overpriced "First Edition" trims but then I'd be back with another DQ200 gearbox and worrying about that failing with a £4k+ repair bill.

Volvo V60 - Mad to buy a used diesel? - bazza

To be honest, I think about this a lot too! In my street the majority are a collection of newish and used diesels, going back as far as I can recall. Only one of them met a terminal end due I think to oil dilution etc, all the others, including some up to 150000 miles soldier on, apparently without major issues. I think there was a period say 10 years ago when Euro 5 and dpfs were introduced, then I did used to hear of horror stories but rarely now. The VAG units seem pretty tough, especially the 2.0 don't hear of many diesel related problems. And how many vans do you see broken down, they're all diesel and thrashed daily. In your case I'd be wary of the V60, there's some well known problems with the EGR search this forum. The Honda 1.6 is apparently very reliable. I would seek out something from a main dealer with perfect service history and at least average miles. Be mindful of future tax changes that won't favour diesel too, but good luck and let us know what happens.

Volvo V60 - Mad to buy a used diesel? - concrete

The OP said he was looking at 2018 Volvo's. The EGR problem was solved by then, at least that was said on this forum some time ago. I have a 2017 Volvo XC60 with a diesel engine and this design came after all the problems. I do like driving diesels but only really have one to tow a caravan. Other wise for my 8K or so annual mileage I would go a different route. Probably hybrid given my longer occasional journeys. I would not balk at the V60 diesel, it is a fine unit. It mates well with the TC 8 speed autobox with fuel consumption in the high 40's when not towing. I think it could be a bargain for the OP to own a good brand with a decent reputation. Only drawback is the dealers are horrendously expensive for service and repairs so find a recommended indie as soon as you can.

Cheers Concrete

Volvo V60 - Mad to buy a used diesel? - KBB

The OP said he was looking at 2018 Volvo's. The EGR problem was solved by then, at least that was said on this forum some time ago. I have a 2017 Volvo XC60 with a diesel engine and this design came after all the problems. I do like driving diesels but only really have one to tow a caravan. Other wise for my 8K or so annual mileage I would go a different route. Probably hybrid given my longer occasional journeys. I would not balk at the V60 diesel, it is a fine unit. It mates well with the TC 8 speed autobox with fuel consumption in the high 40's when not towing. I think it could be a bargain for the OP to own a good brand with a decent reputation. Only drawback is the dealers are horrendously expensive for service and repairs so find a recommended indie as soon as you can.

Cheers Concrete

Indeed, that was the previous model and from reading the thread it did appear that Volvo were admitting the issue (perhaps not openly, however) and trying to resolve it instead of other manufacturers who will vehemently deny any significant issues.

Reading through the threads on the Volvo owners club it seems like there are some issues with the D5 but that is not available on the V60. I haven't seen any particular issues being raised on there other than the satnav and central touch screen being a bit glitchy.

Point noted re servicing. Do you have any recommendations around the Southern hampshire area (B'mouth/Soton/Pompey etc)?

Volvo V60 - Mad to buy a used diesel? - craig-pd130

I had the VEA D4 engine in my V60, registered June 2014. Over the next 3 years it had 3 successive EGR 'fixes' before going back at the end of the lease.

Really nice car, and nothing else went wrong with it - the DPF system is very robust and mine never gave any DPF issues, despite my short 4-miles-each-way commute.

BUT double-check that any Volvo you are looking at has the AdBlue EGR system that Volvo eventually fitted to the VEA engines. The previous system simply didn't work, despite what anyone may try to tell you about it now being fixed, or it's fine if you always use premium diesel. It never got properly fixed. It was a classic engineering foul-up caused by a lack of pre-launch testing in real-world usage conditions.

Volvo V60 - Mad to buy a used diesel? - concrete

Point noted re servicing. Do you have any recommendations around the Southern hampshire area (B'mouth/Soton/Pompey etc)?

I actually now coincide the annual service and MOT with a trip back to North Yorkshire. There is an indie Volvo specialist I know and I get a full service and an MOT for around £250-290. The local Volvo dealer wants over £500 for the service alone. No brainer really. I live in Kent and I did suss out an indie near Brighton. He wanted £325 for the service and extra for the MOT. Not bad compared to franchised dealers. I can't remember the name but I found it on the internet so no recommendations.

On my old Superb I have recorded up to 62mpg on extended runs at cruising speed. But averaged around 50mpg. My D4 XC 60 auto gets in the high 40's in general use and not towing which I think is quite good for the size of it. Only witnessed 3 DPF burns in 26K miles. Probably had more but I am unaware of them.

Cheers Concrete

Volvo V60 - Mad to buy a used diesel? - craig-pd130

Only witnessed 3 DPF burns in 26K miles. Probably had more but I am unaware of them.

Yes, they were unobtrusive in my V60 D4. There was almost no detectable difference in driving behaviour, the most reliable sign was if the main engine cooling fan was running. It only ever ran when a regeneration was happening, I think it did so to help shift the hot air from around the DPF canister.

Volvo V60 - Mad to buy a used diesel? - Avant

I used to have a V60 (the previous model but the same D4 diesel engine as in the current one), and averaged 44 mpg in mixed motoring. Volvos are notoriously thirsty, both petrol and diesel. We also had an Audi A1 at that time with the 1.4 TFSI engine and it weas easy to get 50 mpg, more on a long run.

Most people can get comfy in Skodas, but comfort is a very personal thing and clearly you can't. I wonder if sitting higher up, as in an SUV, would help. Youi could stick with Skoda and look at the Kodiaq or smaller Karoq. If you want a diesel, the 2-litre versions, both petrol and diesel, use a wet-clutch DSG which doesn't have the same problems as the dry-clutch DSG which the 1.4s have. Or there's the Volvo XC40 and XC60 SUVs, but again both will be thirsty.

Also, if you do go for a new-model Volvo, make sure you can live with almost everything, including heating and AC, being controlled by the touchscreen. I couldn't.

Volvo V60 - Mad to buy a used diesel? - KBB

I used to have a V60 (the previous model but the same D4 diesel engine as in the current one), and averaged 44 mpg in mixed motoring. Volvos are notoriously thirsty, both petrol and diesel. We also had an Audi A1 at that time with the 1.4 TFSI engine and it weas easy to get 50 mpg, more on a long run.

Aha, I've finally worked out how to split the previous message into sections. Is there any way to be notified of new replies?

Anyway, back on topic, I've seen 60mpg in the on board display of the Superb after a long section of 50mph avg speed limit on the motorway. Although I think that overestimates as the brim to brim measurements are never near that.

Most people can get comfy in Skodas, but comfort is a very personal thing and clearly you can't. I wonder if sitting higher up, as in an SUV, would help. Youi could stick with Skoda and look at the Kodiaq or smaller Karoq. If you want a diesel, the 2-litre versions, both petrol and diesel, use a wet-clutch DSG which doesn't have the same problems as the dry-clutch DSG which the 1.4s have. Or there's the Volvo XC40 and XC60 SUVs, but again both will be thirsty.

I'm going to sound like a grumpy old man here but I really don't get the SUV fashion. They are more expensive than the equivalent estate, have worse handling, worse fuel consumption and generally a smaller boot (eg. the Karoq boot is smaller than the Octavia).

However, I'm not that much of a grumpy old man that I would rule them out without at least giving them a try, so maybe I should look again.

Also, if you do go for a new-model Volvo, make sure you can live with almost everything, including heating and AC, being controlled by the touchscreen. I couldn't.

That does put me off but I imagine one these things you adjust to reasonably quickly and people say the voice recognition actually works quite well. Looks like the new Octavia had gone the same way, although not to the same extent as the new Golf.

Volvo V60 - Mad to buy a used diesel? - barney100

Just done 1900 miles in my V70 2008 in two weeks without any fuss. Don't worry about the diesel, I've had quite a few now and can't say I've noticed any great difference in service costs, Give a diesel a good run every few days works for me.

 

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