Any - Dual Exhausts - scot22

I have noticed that some cars have dual exhausts. What advantages/disadvantages does this bring ? Is it just something different ?

Any - Dual Exhausts - skidpan

Some exhausts are actually tuned to improve performance and engine note, but on most cars with 2 exhausts its just a styling thing.

If it looks better it must be better.

Old Joke:

Q What do you call a Lada with twin exhausts

A A wheelbarrow

Any - Dual Exhausts - bathtub tom

Exhaust diameter size and length are a science. Too big or long and the pumping losses come into play. These large bore jobbies on some cars are probably restricting the car performance. The old car makers seemed to know what they were doing. Look at the small bore exhausts on old cars like an Austin 7, it's to get the gasses away before they cool too much.

I looked into this more years ago than I care to remember. One phrase that stuck in my mind was: " the best thing to do with the exhaust is get rid of it". Look at aero engines, but then came along turbos.

I never fully understood 2-strokes, they're a completely different kettle of fish!

Any - Dual Exhausts - craig-pd130

I never fully understood 2-strokes, they're a completely different kettle of fish!

2-stroke expansion chambers are a dark art, and no mistake. MZ's Walter Kaaden applied the knowledge he'd gained working on the pulse-jet motors that powered V1 rockets to develop them for MZ's racing programme in the 1950s. Arranging 'cone' shapes in the exhaust pipe exploits the pressure wave that travels in the pipe, so you can use the wave to a) suck fresh mixture into the cylinder and then b) keep it there while it goes bang. But only in a specific rpm range ....

Any - Dual Exhausts - Oli rag

Walter Kaaden, didn't he take all of his and MZ's secrets and hand them to Suzuki?

Any - Dual Exhausts - craig-pd130

Walter Kaaden, didn't he take all of his and MZ's secrets and hand them to Suzuki?

No, it was the MZ team's star rider, Ernst Degner, who was approached by Suzuki in 1961, and as a result defected from East Germany for £10,000 plus a job as Suzuki works rider and developer, taking with him various MZ engine parts (cylinder, piston, disc valves etc).

Suzuki were a laughing stock in GP racing at the time. Degner was an excellent racer and also a skilled development rider under Kaaden's tutelage.

The deal was that Suzuki would enable Degner's (and his family's) defection if he would guarantee to develop a 125cc race engine for Suzuki that produced 25bhp ready for the 1962 season. So he stole Kaaden's know-how and took it with him to Suzuki.

I can highly recommend 'Stealing Speed' by Mat Oxley (published by Haynes), which covers the entire story, from Kaaden's wartime experiences to MZ's retirement from racing and Degner's death, taking in the lethal world of 60s GP motorcycle racing. It's a fantastic, absorbing read.

Any - Dual Exhausts - craig-pd130

In the olden days of carburettors, etc, getting an engine to 'breathe' better (i.e. getting more fuel/air into the cylinders, making it go bang, and getting the spent gases out again faster) would involve having a freer-flowing exhaust system. In cars with V-formation engines, this often involved having a separate exhaust system for each bank of cylinders.

This would have measurable advantages: for example, the big 7.2 litre Chrysler V8 that was used in the Jensen Interceptor as well as dozens of US-market cars, had different BHP outputs depending on whether the engine was equipped with a single exhaust (230bhp) or twin exhausts (285bhp).

With modern cars, it's less critical because of the need to control emissions, etc. In fact, with the need to heat up catalytic converters and particle filters and maintain them at the correct temperatures, modern exhausts are often desgined to be restrictive.

So having dual exhausts is often a styling exercise (i.e. a single exhaust pipe leads from the engine to a silencer box, which then has two pipes exiting from it).

Any - Dual Exhausts - brum

If I'm not mistaken, a lot of twin exhausts on modern cars, one of them is a dummy. Its a styling thing.

Any - Dual Exhausts - scot22

Thanks everyone. I am right then in thinking a dual exhaust is basically a waste of resources without any advantages ? I had just wondered if it might increase maintenance costs and possibly be a source of problems.

However, probably nothing either way.

Any - Dual Exhausts - Nezza
I do not know much about engines but can confirm our 2011 plate 2.2 Galaxy has two exhausts and back boxes. This is not a styling thing as unless you get on your hands and knees you would never know. The smax has the same but these have chromed end pipes to give it the "sporty" look. I'm sure Ford would not go to the expense on the Galaxy if it was just for appearance when it can not be seen.

I would prefer just one for the lower maintenance costs but saying that a good OEM exhaust can last 10 years+ in my experience.
Any - Dual Exhausts - xtrailman

Mazda CX-5 has two tail pipes coming from one back box, no idea if they increase performance, but the multiple manifold out pipes i would expect do.

Theres only one exhaust pipe going to the rear.

Any - Dual Exhausts - gordonbennet

Most of the dual pipes are for image purposes, proper twin systems can sound wonderful on V or H engines, V6 and 8's especially, never found V10/12's to sound particularly nice though unless on Diesel commercials where the CC's are somewhat more.

Not much sounds better than a Deltic in full song mind.

Any - Dual Exhausts - RT

Not much sounds better than a Deltic in full song mind.

Or even during initial acceleration as one engine picks up before the other - but you're right, I can think of a few equals but none better - and the equals are all classic aircraft.

Any - Dual Exhausts - scot22

Thanks for the additional posts. I'm not interested in image and don't want to make any particular noise - as quite as possible for my liking.

Just wanted to find out if they caused any problems or had any benefits. As usual, lots of helpful forum posts.

Thanks again all.

Any - Dual Exhausts - steelghost

One other thing worth bearing in mind - to avoid unwanted resonances at certain engine speeds, the exhaust designers may use two "tailpipes" to achieve sufficient overall flow, without having to increase pipe diameters beyond a certain point, thereby maintaining engine performance and keeping noise down (unlike popular exhaust modifications commonly seens on small hatchbacks, which make a lot of noise but have pretty much zero effect on performance!)

Any - Dual Exhausts - John F

Not much sounds better than a Deltic in full song mind.

Agreed. (trainspotter emeritus?)

Some even have quadruple exhausts which are very complex, see pp14 - 17 in this link.

www.volkspage.net/technik/ssp/ssp/SSP_268.pdf

A nice touch is the flaps that open in two of the four tailpipes when you give it a bit of wellie. Sounds good but looks discreet.


Any - Dual Exhausts - xtrailman

No modern car is going to add extra weight and costs just fot image, it makes no sense.

Any - Dual Exhausts - bernie123

No modern car is going to add extra weight and costs just fot image, it makes no sense.

So wrong ! There are many examples of things on cars that are purely a styling exercise. Image sells cars. Most people have to like the look of a car before they buy it. As an example look at cars from VAG. Lots of different cars in different classes but many are the same under the skin.

Any - Dual Exhausts - xtrailman

If it was just for style the pipe would be a dummy.

Any - Dual Exhausts - RT

If it was just for style the pipe would be a dummy.

No, simply put.

Any - Dual Exhausts - SlidingPillar

I've got twin exhausts on the vintage car; and it's only a V2. Although there is more metal, the curves are far simpler and it does away with the problem that one cylinder will vibrate differently to the other one.

Joining the two would look very silly and undoubtedly would flow less well too. J.A Prestwich (the engine builder) cottened early in the 20s that big exhaust bores and large diameter valves flowed more gas and thus gave better performance for the same cam profile. Of course it is ridiculously noisy but who worries about that...

Any - Dual Exhausts - 1litregolfeater

Yeah but some cars have four exhausts... so that would be four times more powerful!